WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:16.580 Hello, and good morning, good afternoon, depending on what part of the country you're joining 2 00:00:16.580 --> 00:00:19.560 us from and how recently you woke up. 3 00:00:19.560 --> 00:00:21.040 My name is Richard Bonn. 4 00:00:21.040 --> 00:00:25.160 I am our creative producer here at Keyspire. 5 00:00:25.160 --> 00:00:30.680 You longtime viewers of our program will recognize me as the guy in the background, typically 6 00:00:30.680 --> 00:00:36.320 the secondary host in these shenanigans. 7 00:00:36.320 --> 00:00:41.880 But today we have what I would call a very special episode. 8 00:00:41.880 --> 00:00:45.880 Let me just go back to that slide, and then I will entertain you by walking and chewing 9 00:00:45.880 --> 00:00:46.880 gum. 10 00:00:46.880 --> 00:00:48.520 Again, no, that was a joke. 11 00:00:48.520 --> 00:00:50.960 I will sit right here and keep talking to you. 12 00:00:50.960 --> 00:00:57.280 So we are talking about the Canadian election and how the Canadian election might invest 13 00:00:57.280 --> 00:01:01.480 you as real estate investors. 14 00:01:01.480 --> 00:01:06.560 And to do that, I've assembled a panel. 15 00:01:06.560 --> 00:01:12.360 One of the people on my panel would be Jason Whitsall, our typical Inner Circle Live primary 16 00:01:12.360 --> 00:01:13.600 host. 17 00:01:13.600 --> 00:01:21.940 But because Jason is a Keyspire success coach and a realtor and somebody with a background 18 00:01:21.940 --> 00:01:28.160 in journalism, I thought it was more valuable to have me asking the stupid questions and 19 00:01:28.160 --> 00:01:30.360 him giving the smart answers. 20 00:01:30.360 --> 00:01:33.000 So welcome, Jason. 21 00:01:33.000 --> 00:01:34.000 And then also... 22 00:01:34.000 --> 00:01:38.840 Now you've set an expectation, Richard, by the way, smart answers. 23 00:01:38.840 --> 00:01:43.000 Well, we have people smarter than you here as well. 24 00:01:43.000 --> 00:01:47.760 One of them would be Harris Newman, who comes to us from... 25 00:01:47.760 --> 00:01:51.480 I'm going to say EZ Mortgage Solutions, Harris. 26 00:01:51.480 --> 00:01:55.720 I know it's supposed to be pronounced easy, but this is Canada. 27 00:01:55.720 --> 00:01:58.520 It's EZ Mortgage Solutions. 28 00:01:58.520 --> 00:02:03.480 He's guided our members through the complexities of lending, providing exceptional care and 29 00:02:03.480 --> 00:02:08.759 service with a specialization in both residential and commercial lending. 30 00:02:08.800 --> 00:02:13.040 And we've brought him in to sort of be our money guy today. 31 00:02:13.040 --> 00:02:18.920 And then we also have Kyle Hampson, who is a lawyer and partner at McKenzie Lake. 32 00:02:18.920 --> 00:02:23.400 He has had a relationship with Keyspire for over a decade, providing exceptional service 33 00:02:23.400 --> 00:02:29.120 to our members, as well as expert insight at our summits. 34 00:02:29.120 --> 00:02:36.440 So we've got our coach, we've got our lawyer, we've got our broker, we've got our bald guy 35 00:02:36.720 --> 00:02:42.760 who used to work in television news and feels that somehow qualifies him to host a roundtable 36 00:02:42.760 --> 00:02:44.400 discussion show. 37 00:02:44.400 --> 00:02:46.920 And then, of course, we have all of you. 38 00:02:46.920 --> 00:02:52.200 So this is going to be a discussion between all of us. 39 00:02:52.200 --> 00:02:58.760 As many of you probably know, the election was only Monday, and we didn't actually know 40 00:02:58.760 --> 00:03:04.120 the full final results until yesterday, which I have to say I've never, never really seen 41 00:03:04.120 --> 00:03:05.120 that before. 42 00:03:05.120 --> 00:03:08.240 A lot of races very tight. 43 00:03:08.240 --> 00:03:13.560 And that means that we have a lot of, we don't know what's going to happen exactly. 44 00:03:13.560 --> 00:03:20.600 What we're going to do is base this around what we have been told is going to happen 45 00:03:20.600 --> 00:03:23.000 largely through the liberal platform. 46 00:03:23.000 --> 00:03:29.880 So starting this off, I have a multiple question for you as the audience, largely rhetorical. 47 00:03:29.880 --> 00:03:37.520 But it is, how does the new Canadian government impact your real estate investing plan? 48 00:03:37.520 --> 00:03:39.960 Answers could include, it depends. 49 00:03:39.960 --> 00:03:40.960 I don't know. 50 00:03:40.960 --> 00:03:42.220 What's your plan? 51 00:03:42.220 --> 00:03:44.640 Your plan should be longer than any one government's term. 52 00:03:44.640 --> 00:03:49.000 I'm an office, and you should make adjustments as needed so the numbers work. 53 00:03:49.000 --> 00:03:53.960 Could be any of the above, could be all of the above, or maybe it's time to move to the 54 00:03:53.960 --> 00:03:54.960 Cayman Islands. 55 00:03:54.960 --> 00:03:59.640 And I say that because it's a lovely tropical place and a good place for offshore banking 56 00:04:00.400 --> 00:04:04.320 So you could substitute that for any other country of your choosing. 57 00:04:04.320 --> 00:04:07.200 I'm not the boss of you. 58 00:04:07.200 --> 00:04:10.560 And as I attempt to switch sides, so what are we doing today? 59 00:04:10.560 --> 00:04:13.280 I've reviewed the liberal election platform. 60 00:04:13.280 --> 00:04:18.440 I've highlighted several options that may be of interest to real estate investors. 61 00:04:18.440 --> 00:04:22.120 These have been ranked through Jason and I so that we cover what we think are the most 62 00:04:22.120 --> 00:04:26.800 relevant first, as we're likely not going to have time for them all. 63 00:04:26.800 --> 00:04:31.800 And then at any point, I would encourage you all to ask questions as well. 64 00:04:31.800 --> 00:04:36.300 Now because I'm in the host seat and Jason's on the panel seat, we might not be having 65 00:04:36.300 --> 00:04:38.160 our eyes on the chat. 66 00:04:38.160 --> 00:04:44.900 So like any true broadcast call-in show, you can come on camera, open up your microphone 67 00:04:44.900 --> 00:04:45.900 and ask your question. 68 00:04:45.900 --> 00:04:50.440 I do ask that you use the raise a hand feature just so that we're not talking over each other 69 00:04:50.440 --> 00:04:57.000 and I can go, oh, your name here has a question and then we can bring you on and do this in 70 00:04:57.000 --> 00:04:58.440 an orderly manner. 71 00:04:58.440 --> 00:05:00.000 So let's first hear. 72 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:04.240 from our panel, Jason, Kyle, and Harris. 73 00:05:04.240 --> 00:05:07.340 And my first question for all of you would be, 74 00:05:07.340 --> 00:05:11.120 what are you most excited about with this outcome? 75 00:05:11.120 --> 00:05:14.720 And excited can be positive, it can be anxious, 76 00:05:14.720 --> 00:05:16.480 it can be a lot of things. 77 00:05:16.480 --> 00:05:19.200 And I think I'm gonna pick on Harris first. 78 00:05:21.520 --> 00:05:23.800 Talk to the money guy first, wow. 79 00:05:23.800 --> 00:05:24.640 Yeah. 80 00:05:24.640 --> 00:05:25.640 All right. 81 00:05:25.640 --> 00:05:27.680 Thanks Richard for having me, this is exciting. 82 00:05:27.680 --> 00:05:29.280 No pun intended, I can talk about this 83 00:05:29.280 --> 00:05:30.920 for the first question. 84 00:05:30.920 --> 00:05:33.500 I think for me, what's most exciting with the outcome 85 00:05:33.500 --> 00:05:35.600 is we've actually got some understanding 86 00:05:35.600 --> 00:05:36.880 about where are we going now. 87 00:05:36.880 --> 00:05:38.440 I mean, there's been a lot of noise in there, 88 00:05:38.440 --> 00:05:41.200 like, is it gonna be the Liberals, is it gonna be the PCs? 89 00:05:41.200 --> 00:05:43.120 Who's gonna retain office at the end of this? 90 00:05:43.120 --> 00:05:45.080 And so I think, you know, good, bad, or ugly, 91 00:05:45.080 --> 00:05:47.520 we now have a decision made by the country. 92 00:05:48.500 --> 00:05:50.120 Although very close to a majority, 93 00:05:50.120 --> 00:05:53.580 about three or four chairs short of that. 94 00:05:53.580 --> 00:05:55.120 But I think this will, I think, allow us 95 00:05:55.120 --> 00:05:57.760 to start to put distractions behind us, 96 00:05:57.760 --> 00:06:00.000 which does have an adverse effect on the market. 97 00:06:00.000 --> 00:06:01.080 And that's what we've been seeing, 98 00:06:01.080 --> 00:06:02.680 like, especially in the mortgage space, 99 00:06:02.680 --> 00:06:05.560 where we've got like fixed term rates moving upwards 100 00:06:05.560 --> 00:06:07.800 as opposed to downwards. 101 00:06:07.800 --> 00:06:09.520 And that's for a variety of reasons. 102 00:06:09.520 --> 00:06:10.560 Part of it was the election, 103 00:06:10.560 --> 00:06:12.400 part of it's obviously stuff going on, you know, 104 00:06:12.400 --> 00:06:13.920 on our other side of the border there 105 00:06:13.920 --> 00:06:16.440 with our Trump and Tara friend. 106 00:06:16.440 --> 00:06:18.840 And for me, I think what is also exciting 107 00:06:18.840 --> 00:06:20.880 is really starting to see how this will impact 108 00:06:20.880 --> 00:06:22.920 Bank of Canada, like, will we start to see rates 109 00:06:22.920 --> 00:06:25.060 start to decrease now going forward? 110 00:06:26.000 --> 00:06:28.380 And is that enough to now get us to that next level? 111 00:06:28.380 --> 00:06:30.700 And will we see the bond market start to settle down a bit 112 00:06:30.700 --> 00:06:32.140 now that we've got some decisions made? 113 00:06:32.140 --> 00:06:34.620 So it's probably a good starting point, I think. 114 00:06:34.620 --> 00:06:38.400 All right, and then same question over to you, Kyle Hampson. 115 00:06:39.420 --> 00:06:42.180 Yeah, I'd really echo a lot of what Harris said. 116 00:06:42.180 --> 00:06:47.060 Now that we sort of have a position to move forward from, 117 00:06:47.060 --> 00:06:49.820 it will really be interesting to see how we move forward. 118 00:06:49.820 --> 00:06:53.420 Obviously, the next step is gonna be a throne speech 119 00:06:53.420 --> 00:06:56.180 from Mark Carney and tabling a budget. 120 00:06:56.180 --> 00:06:58.220 When does parliament get recalled? 121 00:06:58.220 --> 00:07:02.900 And do we actually start to see some of the platform 122 00:07:02.900 --> 00:07:05.780 of the Liberal Party that they put forward 123 00:07:05.780 --> 00:07:08.500 start to take shape and move forward 124 00:07:08.500 --> 00:07:11.420 and how they will need to amend it 125 00:07:11.420 --> 00:07:13.900 if they stick with this minority? 126 00:07:13.900 --> 00:07:16.260 Who will they be partnering with? 127 00:07:16.260 --> 00:07:19.040 Will it be the NDP that would be enough 128 00:07:19.040 --> 00:07:22.180 to get them across into a majority? 129 00:07:22.180 --> 00:07:24.940 Would they appease some of the block members? 130 00:07:24.940 --> 00:07:27.740 22 seats there, that's enough. 131 00:07:27.740 --> 00:07:32.740 And will the Conservatives actually move forward with them 132 00:07:32.740 --> 00:07:35.580 on anything that really does make sense 133 00:07:35.580 --> 00:07:39.660 from a fiscal responsibility position? 134 00:07:39.660 --> 00:07:42.220 Because that was what they were pushing 135 00:07:42.220 --> 00:07:47.220 and what they were exposing during the entire campaign. 136 00:07:48.060 --> 00:07:49.180 Right. 137 00:07:49.180 --> 00:07:53.220 So I think at this point, we'll wait to see 138 00:07:54.700 --> 00:07:56.700 what the next steps are gonna be. 139 00:07:56.700 --> 00:08:00.780 Unfortunately, we now have a place to move forward from, 140 00:08:00.780 --> 00:08:01.860 like I mentioned earlier, 141 00:08:01.860 --> 00:08:03.620 but we still don't know in what directions 142 00:08:03.620 --> 00:08:06.060 we're gonna be going and which ones first. 143 00:08:06.060 --> 00:08:07.100 Right. 144 00:08:07.100 --> 00:08:10.580 And then Jason Witzel, what are you most excited about? 145 00:08:10.580 --> 00:08:13.860 I'll echo some of both of what they've said. 146 00:08:13.860 --> 00:08:16.420 I think what I'm looking forward to 147 00:08:16.420 --> 00:08:19.060 is stability moving forward, 148 00:08:19.060 --> 00:08:22.820 especially when it comes to 149 00:08:22.820 --> 00:08:25.460 the market interest rates inflation. 150 00:08:26.860 --> 00:08:31.860 The second thing I'd like to see is how they build upon 151 00:08:31.940 --> 00:08:34.940 some of the policies that they've already introduced 152 00:08:34.940 --> 00:08:39.460 and more so policies that they introduced 153 00:08:39.460 --> 00:08:42.700 and now see that need an adjustment. 154 00:08:42.700 --> 00:08:44.380 For example, immigration policy 155 00:08:44.380 --> 00:08:46.100 that they already have adjustment. 156 00:08:46.100 --> 00:08:48.300 I'd like to see other policies 157 00:08:48.300 --> 00:08:51.940 when it comes to housing adjusted as well 158 00:08:51.940 --> 00:08:54.540 and see what kind of other new policies 159 00:08:55.460 --> 00:08:57.060 that they're gonna introduce. 160 00:08:58.620 --> 00:09:00.980 PolyEv won't get his way, obviously. 161 00:09:00.980 --> 00:09:03.380 They won't be called back this summer like he wanted to, 162 00:09:03.380 --> 00:09:07.020 but we'll see, like Kyle said, 163 00:09:07.020 --> 00:09:10.140 what happens as far as getting the support 164 00:09:10.140 --> 00:09:13.700 to get some of these policies over the line. 165 00:09:14.740 --> 00:09:18.420 They're definitely, if you look at all three platforms, 166 00:09:18.420 --> 00:09:22.580 they do share quite a common thread 167 00:09:22.580 --> 00:09:24.900 when it comes to housing policies. 168 00:09:24.900 --> 00:09:28.580 And I think they can eventually agree on most of those, 169 00:09:28.580 --> 00:09:30.780 but it'll be interesting to see who they get 170 00:09:30.780 --> 00:09:34.380 to push some of those other policies over the line. 171 00:09:35.220 --> 00:09:38.340 Well, and I love that you use the word policies so much 172 00:09:38.340 --> 00:09:40.180 because we did not rehearse that at all. 173 00:09:40.180 --> 00:09:42.020 Jason and I sit right next to each other 174 00:09:42.020 --> 00:09:44.260 and have been preparing the show for, 175 00:09:44.260 --> 00:09:46.300 well, we tried to do it last week. 176 00:09:46.300 --> 00:09:49.460 And then honestly, we had four probable outcomes 177 00:09:49.460 --> 00:09:51.980 for Tuesday morning and we had none of them 178 00:09:51.980 --> 00:09:53.620 because we didn't know who won. 179 00:09:53.620 --> 00:09:57.900 But at any rate, let's talk about the liberal platforms. 180 00:09:57.900 --> 00:10:00.100 And these are things that when I. 181 00:10:00.000 --> 00:10:04.080 I looked through the site, made me go, hmm. 182 00:10:04.080 --> 00:10:07.240 To those of you who are younger than Gen X, 183 00:10:07.240 --> 00:10:10.280 you might not get the reference, but that's OK. 184 00:10:10.280 --> 00:10:13.280 You use slang that I don't know. 185 00:10:13.280 --> 00:10:15.680 All right, so first one is on building homes. 186 00:10:15.680 --> 00:10:17.760 And I've got a secondary slide on this 187 00:10:17.760 --> 00:10:19.240 because there's a few things. 188 00:10:19.240 --> 00:10:22.040 But these, in quotation marks, are literally 189 00:10:22.040 --> 00:10:24.720 copy and pasted right off the liberal platform 190 00:10:24.720 --> 00:10:26.040 from their website. 191 00:10:26.040 --> 00:10:29.960 So they said they're about giving your government back 192 00:10:30.080 --> 00:10:32.160 into business of building homes and doubling 193 00:10:32.160 --> 00:10:35.080 the pace of construction over the next decade 194 00:10:35.080 --> 00:10:38.440 to almost 500,000 new homes. 195 00:10:38.440 --> 00:10:39.320 Did I say that right? 196 00:10:39.320 --> 00:10:42.120 I always get those zeros confused. 197 00:10:42.120 --> 00:10:45.560 A year, well, reducing charges and new home construction 198 00:10:45.560 --> 00:10:49.320 costs, reducing the cost of new homes by tens of thousands 199 00:10:49.320 --> 00:10:50.640 of dollars. 200 00:10:50.640 --> 00:10:52.920 And that wasn't, nobody was really saying 201 00:10:52.920 --> 00:10:55.040 we shouldn't build homes. 202 00:10:55.040 --> 00:10:58.280 Some of the more specific things they were getting into 203 00:10:58.280 --> 00:11:03.680 was to create this Build Canada Homes business government 204 00:11:03.680 --> 00:11:09.000 branch, where they will, one, act as a developer. 205 00:11:09.000 --> 00:11:12.440 They've got $25 billion in financing 206 00:11:12.440 --> 00:11:15.960 to innovative prefabricated home builders, 207 00:11:15.960 --> 00:11:20.600 much like our friends at Packed Homes, 208 00:11:20.600 --> 00:11:22.680 one of our community sponsors. 209 00:11:22.680 --> 00:11:26.520 And then we've got $10 billion in low-cost financing 210 00:11:26.560 --> 00:11:31.560 for capital and homes, sorry, in capital for homes 211 00:11:31.560 --> 00:11:34.800 that support middle and low-income Canadians. 212 00:11:34.800 --> 00:11:37.880 This will include housing for students, seniors, 213 00:11:37.880 --> 00:11:40.640 veterans, and people with disabilities, 214 00:11:40.640 --> 00:11:42.520 indigenous housing, shelters, and more. 215 00:11:42.520 --> 00:11:45.400 So some of these I look at and see us 216 00:11:45.400 --> 00:11:48.040 as real estate investors. 217 00:11:48.040 --> 00:11:52.200 Students, that's definitely how Scott McGillivray 218 00:11:52.200 --> 00:11:55.440 and Michael Cerasini got started in investing, servicing. 219 00:11:55.440 --> 00:11:59.760 So I'm thinking there might be something 220 00:11:59.760 --> 00:12:02.120 in these things for us. 221 00:12:02.120 --> 00:12:04.280 And I'm gonna throw this one to Jason Witzel first 222 00:12:04.280 --> 00:12:06.320 as our key spire coach. 223 00:12:07.960 --> 00:12:12.280 What is your take on these various policy proposals 224 00:12:12.280 --> 00:12:13.120 they had? 225 00:12:14.840 --> 00:12:19.840 Well, you know, I think like any of their policy, 226 00:12:19.960 --> 00:12:22.000 it's in the right place. 227 00:12:22.000 --> 00:12:27.000 It's implementation and maybe aggressive in nature 228 00:12:29.760 --> 00:12:32.400 and ambitious is the word I was looking for. 229 00:12:32.400 --> 00:12:37.400 So it makes sense on paper, but in reality, 230 00:12:39.800 --> 00:12:44.360 we'll see I'm skeptically optimistic. 231 00:12:44.360 --> 00:12:45.200 Yeah. 232 00:12:45.200 --> 00:12:46.040 That's what I'd say. 233 00:12:46.040 --> 00:12:49.080 Do any of you think that, so for example, 234 00:12:49.080 --> 00:12:51.480 if the government is going to now be builders 235 00:12:51.960 --> 00:12:53.120 and they're gonna be building all these homes 236 00:12:53.120 --> 00:12:56.440 on public land, and any of you can jump in here 237 00:12:56.440 --> 00:12:58.920 and take this one, is this going to create 238 00:12:58.920 --> 00:13:01.320 more competition for us, or is this going 239 00:13:01.320 --> 00:13:04.960 to create opportunities for us as investors? 240 00:13:04.960 --> 00:13:07.080 I might jump in on that first. 241 00:13:07.080 --> 00:13:08.160 Please do. 242 00:13:08.160 --> 00:13:10.880 I have a number of clients, builders and developers 243 00:13:10.880 --> 00:13:13.240 who have acquired surplus lands 244 00:13:13.240 --> 00:13:15.400 from various levels of government. 245 00:13:16.880 --> 00:13:19.760 In my personal opinion, that is the better way 246 00:13:19.760 --> 00:13:20.800 to move forward. 247 00:13:20.840 --> 00:13:23.920 The government often, when they conveyed these lands, 248 00:13:23.920 --> 00:13:26.640 these surplus lands to builders and developers, 249 00:13:26.640 --> 00:13:28.560 they put restrictions on them. 250 00:13:28.560 --> 00:13:31.240 They put monitoring conditions on them. 251 00:13:31.240 --> 00:13:33.560 And if they're not developed or constructed 252 00:13:33.560 --> 00:13:35.400 within a certain time period, the government 253 00:13:35.400 --> 00:13:38.400 can purchase them back at a discounted rate. 254 00:13:38.400 --> 00:13:41.600 And in my opinion, that protects the government interest, 255 00:13:41.600 --> 00:13:45.040 protects the public interest, but also allows the builders 256 00:13:45.040 --> 00:13:48.640 who have the expertise and the manpower to do it, 257 00:13:48.640 --> 00:13:52.200 not burdened by administrative oversight, 258 00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:54.640 by levels of government. 259 00:13:56.240 --> 00:13:59.400 I think in the long run, that's going to lead 260 00:13:59.400 --> 00:14:04.400 to faster produced, lower cost products, 261 00:14:04.760 --> 00:14:08.560 as opposed to having the government become a builder, 262 00:14:08.560 --> 00:14:11.600 something that they haven't done since World War II. 263 00:14:12.440 --> 00:14:15.920 So I think that would probably be the better way 264 00:14:15.920 --> 00:14:17.200 of moving forward. 265 00:14:17.200 --> 00:14:21.680 I don't think a government administrative oversight role 266 00:14:21.680 --> 00:14:25.480 will lead to faster built homes or cheaper homes. 267 00:14:27.200 --> 00:14:30.800 And then Harris, your take, and I'm especially curious 268 00:14:30.800 --> 00:14:35.120 about the financing options for some of these kind of builds. 269 00:14:35.120 --> 00:14:38.800 I'm thinking the prefabs and the affordable housings 270 00:14:38.800 --> 00:14:42.920 and any strategies we can be looking at. 271 00:14:43.920 --> 00:14:48.800 Yeah, I mean, certainly the 500,000 new homes a year 272 00:14:48.800 --> 00:14:51.080 is an interesting number that they put out there. 273 00:14:51.080 --> 00:14:53.800 I mean, March, March, 2025, last month, 274 00:14:53.800 --> 00:14:56.520 I think new construction, we were at like 214,000. 275 00:14:56.520 --> 00:14:59.640 So it'll be interesting to see if we can achieve 276 00:14:59.640 --> 00:15:00.480 that target. 277 00:15:00.000 --> 00:15:05.260 target of the 500,000 because anytime we can certainly put up that kind of volume, it opens 278 00:15:05.260 --> 00:15:06.900 up doors for a whole bunch of things, right? 279 00:15:06.900 --> 00:15:12.740 It's new immigrants to Canada opportunities, affordable housing opportunities. 280 00:15:12.740 --> 00:15:21.220 So from a banking perspective, certainly you're starting to hear a lot more about ADUs, accessibility 281 00:15:21.220 --> 00:15:24.000 units that are being added onto properties right now. 282 00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:27.100 So that's starting to get some buzz. 283 00:15:27.100 --> 00:15:32.300 There are definitely new programs for new immigrants coming to the country. 284 00:15:32.300 --> 00:15:37.360 So again, opportunities to get other people from an affordable housing perspective into 285 00:15:37.360 --> 00:15:39.500 the market that otherwise hasn't been there. 286 00:15:39.500 --> 00:15:41.500 We're all starting to hear things about rent to own, right? 287 00:15:41.500 --> 00:15:45.260 I mean, again, there's that rent to own concept, which is another strategy that's out there 288 00:15:45.260 --> 00:15:50.660 that is not perhaps taken advantage of enough, but there are certainly key spire investors 289 00:15:50.660 --> 00:15:54.260 that have certainly sort of played in that space before. 290 00:15:54.260 --> 00:15:56.980 And rent to own, also known as lease to own. 291 00:15:56.980 --> 00:15:59.220 We use that term a lot as well. 292 00:15:59.220 --> 00:16:00.220 For sure. 293 00:16:00.220 --> 00:16:01.220 For sure. 294 00:16:01.220 --> 00:16:05.540 So yeah, I mean, I think aggressive target of 500,000 homes, which is amazing and back 295 00:16:05.540 --> 00:16:08.860 to sort of what Kyle and Jason have already echoed. 296 00:16:08.860 --> 00:16:12.820 Certainly I'm not sure getting the government into the building division now is probably 297 00:16:12.820 --> 00:16:13.820 the best way. 298 00:16:13.820 --> 00:16:16.960 We already have trouble with red tape in the government. 299 00:16:16.960 --> 00:16:21.700 So this could slow things down a little bit with having too many cooks in the kitchen. 300 00:16:21.700 --> 00:16:25.180 But I think certainly from a competitive standpoint, I think it certainly adds a tremendous 301 00:16:25.180 --> 00:16:29.180 amount of value, as Kyle was alluding to with the number of builders he deals with. 302 00:16:29.180 --> 00:16:36.220 So I think creating certainly that as an opportunity will be very helpful from a product perspective 303 00:16:36.220 --> 00:16:37.700 and certainly more affordable. 304 00:16:37.700 --> 00:16:39.140 All right. 305 00:16:39.140 --> 00:16:41.700 And then let's see what I've got on this next slide. 306 00:16:41.700 --> 00:16:42.700 All right. 307 00:16:42.700 --> 00:16:47.100 So this was another thing that they had put up as a proposal. 308 00:16:47.100 --> 00:16:52.060 And this was the first time I'd actually heard the term MIRB, which I really love. 309 00:16:52.060 --> 00:16:54.340 It's fun to say MIRB. 310 00:16:54.340 --> 00:17:00.220 I invite you all to let that let that term just escape your lips in this conversation. 311 00:17:00.220 --> 00:17:06.060 But he said they will reintroduce a tax incentive for home builders known as the multiunit rental 312 00:17:06.060 --> 00:17:12.180 building MIRB, which in the 1970s spurred tens of thousands of rental housing units 313 00:17:12.180 --> 00:17:13.780 across the country. 314 00:17:13.780 --> 00:17:16.220 Now I was alive in the 70s. 315 00:17:16.900 --> 00:17:23.859 I was too young to know anything about the MIRB policy. 316 00:17:23.859 --> 00:17:29.780 Did a little bit of reading up on it. 317 00:17:29.780 --> 00:17:37.460 Found a CBC article from 2023 when CMHC was looking at it, said the MIRB scheme allowed 318 00:17:37.460 --> 00:17:43.420 investors to claim depreciation and certain other costs of an apartment building against 319 00:17:43.420 --> 00:17:44.900 unrelated income. 320 00:17:44.900 --> 00:17:54.020 It was credited with encouraging the construction of 195,000 units at the cost of 24 billion 321 00:17:54.020 --> 00:17:57.660 in foregone taxes. 322 00:17:57.660 --> 00:18:00.700 So and that was repealed in 1982. 323 00:18:00.700 --> 00:18:07.060 So they're looking at bringing back some form of that, which honestly, I think from a cash 324 00:18:07.060 --> 00:18:10.060 flow perspective sounds like a good thing. 325 00:18:10.060 --> 00:18:13.420 But what is your take on it? 326 00:18:13.420 --> 00:18:20.140 Let's start with Harris as our money guy. 327 00:18:20.140 --> 00:18:24.500 Certainly anytime we can get rentals and certainly it depends on if there's going to be restrictions 328 00:18:24.500 --> 00:18:31.060 on is it based on affordable or does the ownership have the opportunities on what they're setting 329 00:18:31.060 --> 00:18:32.060 as rents? 330 00:18:32.060 --> 00:18:36.140 Obviously reasonable enough within jurisdictions across the country. 331 00:18:36.140 --> 00:18:40.220 But I think certainly anytime you're starting to see a lot more clients within the key spire 332 00:18:40.220 --> 00:18:44.220 looking at land development opportunities and opportunities on how to capitalize on 333 00:18:44.220 --> 00:18:48.540 land that they're sitting on, I'm hearing more and more conversations around that space 334 00:18:48.540 --> 00:18:49.540 at the moment. 335 00:18:49.540 --> 00:18:53.500 So I think certainly if you've got land that you are sitting on that you can certainly 336 00:18:53.500 --> 00:19:01.420 build a multi-unit residential building on and create housing, I think there's a great 337 00:19:01.420 --> 00:19:05.660 opportunity here for clients to certainly capitalize on. 338 00:19:05.660 --> 00:19:10.060 And then Kyle, what is your take on the proposed MIRB policy? 339 00:19:10.060 --> 00:19:12.860 Well, I think it's good. 340 00:19:12.860 --> 00:19:17.060 I think one of the biggest things that they need to fix first are the building and zoning 341 00:19:17.060 --> 00:19:19.180 requirements that you have. 342 00:19:19.180 --> 00:19:25.340 I know here in Ontario at the last election, it was sort of floated around that there would 343 00:19:25.340 --> 00:19:31.380 be deemed building and zoning approval for multi-residential units up to a certain number 344 00:19:31.380 --> 00:19:35.540 of buildings that are a certain number of units within a building. 345 00:19:35.540 --> 00:19:36.740 That hasn't come to pass. 346 00:19:36.740 --> 00:19:42.340 So you can throw these tax incentives out there, but unless you fix the practical issue 347 00:19:42.340 --> 00:19:50.180 of getting local municipalities to approve re-designating, re-zoning parcels of land 348 00:19:50.180 --> 00:19:56.300 for multi-unit residential buildings along major through-fairs within a city would make 349 00:19:56.300 --> 00:19:57.900 the most sense. 350 00:19:57.900 --> 00:19:59.940 But you're going to have... 351 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:03.960 you're gonna have practical issues so you can have the tax incentives for 352 00:20:03.960 --> 00:20:08.240 those that get approved but you're not actually gonna see tens of thousands of 353 00:20:08.240 --> 00:20:12.960 rental housing units being created unless that building and zoning issues 354 00:20:12.960 --> 00:20:19.160 can get rectified at a municipal level. But jurisdictionally that is 355 00:20:19.160 --> 00:20:25.720 municipal as well so my take on it would that this would be just the 356 00:20:25.720 --> 00:20:32.840 federal government trying to pump things up on the demand side no? They can 357 00:20:32.840 --> 00:20:39.640 they can try yeah but it's a cart before the horse. Right, and Jason I 358 00:20:39.640 --> 00:20:47.800 know you want to say the word MIRB. It's a good word I think Chris almost Brooks 359 00:20:47.800 --> 00:20:53.320 you just had a comment there sums it up best this is you know a way that you're 360 00:20:53.320 --> 00:20:57.960 putting more more money in the pocket as a tax incentive and someone who's 361 00:20:57.960 --> 00:21:02.560 like they said probably already wealthy and I'll agree with Kyle I think 362 00:21:02.560 --> 00:21:12.520 honestly to fix the biggest issue it's it's multi-tiered but the biggest what I 363 00:21:12.520 --> 00:21:16.120 see is the biggest reason we're in this in the first place is in municipalities 364 00:21:16.120 --> 00:21:22.960 and the red tape and the lack of permits that's happened over time so and a lot 365 00:21:22.960 --> 00:21:30.400 of it was because of even how we how we vote municipal councillors and such into 366 00:21:30.400 --> 00:21:35.000 into power and it's you know it's the whole not in my backyard thing right so 367 00:21:35.000 --> 00:21:41.040 development comes up and it's it's not my backyard you know you hear their 368 00:21:41.040 --> 00:21:45.120 constituents say I don't want this and even though it's it's for the better 369 00:21:45.120 --> 00:21:52.360 good you know well down the road of even some of these voters who will be even 370 00:21:52.360 --> 00:21:59.240 around right even alive so it's municipalities that need to for me most 371 00:21:59.240 --> 00:22:03.160 of the changes need to come at the municipal level and if that means at the 372 00:22:03.160 --> 00:22:06.940 federal level forcing them I think that's what needs to be done so you got 373 00:22:06.940 --> 00:22:12.360 into an interesting point about the NIMBY ism that can happen especially at 374 00:22:12.360 --> 00:22:17.200 a local level and I'm suddenly thinking of this argument that I have with my 375 00:22:17.200 --> 00:22:21.800 parents a lot coming from the key spire perspective and there are they would 376 00:22:21.800 --> 00:22:25.800 complain like oh they're gonna you know put an apartment building in the 377 00:22:25.800 --> 00:22:29.440 neighborhood or you know there's townhouses on the other side of the 378 00:22:29.440 --> 00:22:33.720 street and what's that gonna do for our property values but I can't help but 379 00:22:33.720 --> 00:22:40.840 notice that any everyone's property values regardless keeps going up and if 380 00:22:40.840 --> 00:22:44.960 nothing else I would think like look at the GTA you know if you have a single 381 00:22:44.960 --> 00:22:51.280 family home sitting in amongst three condo buildings that you know the that's 382 00:22:51.280 --> 00:22:56.200 still a multi-million dollar property there right like it's not really that 383 00:22:56.200 --> 00:23:00.440 that whole perception of a property values decreasing because of what's 384 00:23:00.440 --> 00:23:04.840 going on in the neighborhood isn't so much a thing or have any of you found 385 00:23:04.840 --> 00:23:14.400 that it that I'm wrong no yeah exactly property values aren't gonna decrease 386 00:23:14.400 --> 00:23:19.640 but it may take away their son in their backyard so yes I do see Rosario just 387 00:23:19.640 --> 00:23:23.240 most recent comment said that nobody wants an apartment building besides 388 00:23:23.240 --> 00:23:30.320 their nice home in the the nice subs and true but think of it as an opportunity 389 00:23:30.320 --> 00:23:36.520 to build in strength in a community not a you know a loss because you have to 390 00:23:36.520 --> 00:23:41.320 anyway Richard you're also seeing just a I don't I guess you're seeing not in 391 00:23:41.320 --> 00:23:44.640 while it's not a mer but it's multi-unit residential you are seeing a lot of that 392 00:23:44.640 --> 00:23:49.080 popping up in the country now too right well through the CMHC programs so there 393 00:23:49.080 --> 00:23:53.280 are back to your question earlier there are programs available whereby you're 394 00:23:53.280 --> 00:23:56.040 starting to see a number of key spire clients take advantage especially in 395 00:23:56.040 --> 00:23:59.320 their you know pockets like Alberta for example you know they're buying you know 396 00:23:59.320 --> 00:24:04.160 six playo to two triplex or six doors or eight doors and they're getting some 397 00:24:04.160 --> 00:24:09.680 great deep discounted rates and at the same time lower down payment so from an 398 00:24:09.680 --> 00:24:13.080 investment standpoint certainly good or opportunities for our clients to think 399 00:24:13.080 --> 00:24:17.440 about yeah and I'm seeing that I'm my comments are getting some strong 400 00:24:17.440 --> 00:24:24.000 reaction in the in the chats about yeah a lot of a lot of why we get the 401 00:24:24.000 --> 00:24:31.960 resistance parking potential for crime we have lots of land for spaces so you 402 00:24:31.960 --> 00:24:36.200 know there's there's yeah there can be justifiable reasons for not not wanting 403 00:24:36.200 --> 00:24:40.400 things other than simply property values let's let's ignore and that's what 404 00:24:40.400 --> 00:24:44.600 makes politics difficult is that everyone has a perspective and no one's 405 00:24:44.720 --> 00:24:50.160 perspective is more right or you know better than another person's it's just 406 00:24:50.160 --> 00:24:54.240 you've got a everyone's kind of fighting for their own their own needs and 407 00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:59.560 interests and compromises are you know I think good government is when everyone's 408 00:24:59.560 --> 00:25:02.200 a little bit 409 00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:01.480 and unhappy. 410 00:25:01.480 --> 00:25:05.320 But anyway, another thing they had proposed, GST cuts. 411 00:25:05.320 --> 00:25:08.400 However, that's not for all of us buying our goods 412 00:25:08.400 --> 00:25:09.200 and services. 413 00:25:09.200 --> 00:25:12.680 It is for first-time homebuyers. 414 00:25:12.680 --> 00:25:15.160 So it looks like for first-time homebuyers, 415 00:25:15.160 --> 00:25:19.240 they're going to have up to, yeah, 416 00:25:19.240 --> 00:25:23.040 for houses up to $1 million in value, 417 00:25:23.040 --> 00:25:26.480 could save up to $50,000. 418 00:25:26.480 --> 00:25:33.040 And in recognition that home costs are well above $1 million, 419 00:25:33.040 --> 00:25:37.600 they're also going to have some level unspecified of cuts 420 00:25:37.600 --> 00:25:41.240 on ones between $1 million and $1.5 million. 421 00:25:41.240 --> 00:25:45.720 So I think we're still looking at single-family homes. 422 00:25:45.720 --> 00:25:48.120 I don't see this being an investor policy. 423 00:25:48.120 --> 00:25:51.480 But my job is to ask the dumb questions, 424 00:25:51.480 --> 00:25:54.160 and your job is to give me the smart answers. 425 00:25:54.160 --> 00:25:57.480 Let's start with Kyle this time. 426 00:25:57.480 --> 00:26:00.520 This is a pretty easy thing for the federal government 427 00:26:00.520 --> 00:26:03.400 to implement. 428 00:26:03.400 --> 00:26:08.360 They already have first-time homebuyer credits. 429 00:26:08.360 --> 00:26:10.240 Provinces have them for land transfer tax. 430 00:26:10.240 --> 00:26:12.280 Those provinces that have land transfer tax 431 00:26:12.280 --> 00:26:14.520 rebates for first-time homebuyers. 432 00:26:14.520 --> 00:26:16.240 So that's pretty straightforward. 433 00:26:16.240 --> 00:26:17.520 I mean, if a first-time homebuyer 434 00:26:17.520 --> 00:26:20.880 is buying a house over $1 million, good for them. 435 00:26:20.920 --> 00:26:27.160 Whether they need any additional rebate off of that, 436 00:26:27.160 --> 00:26:29.720 I can see someone in the chat just said, 437 00:26:29.720 --> 00:26:32.720 most first-time homebuyers can't afford new bills. 438 00:26:32.720 --> 00:26:34.880 I would agree with that to a certain point. 439 00:26:34.880 --> 00:26:37.080 I mean, there certainly are townhomes and condos 440 00:26:37.080 --> 00:26:39.960 in smaller markets, not in big cities, 441 00:26:39.960 --> 00:26:44.400 where that could be a real good chunk of savings. 442 00:26:44.400 --> 00:26:48.680 So that's a pretty easy thing to move forward with, 443 00:26:48.720 --> 00:26:53.000 as long as we put it in a process, 444 00:26:53.000 --> 00:26:55.040 or as long as the federal government puts it in a process 445 00:26:55.040 --> 00:26:59.440 where, whereas first-time homebuyers may save money, 446 00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:02.640 it's not something that could then be more directed 447 00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:06.040 to the builders in terms of increasing their price. 448 00:27:06.040 --> 00:27:09.080 I can see Jason nodding along with that. 449 00:27:09.080 --> 00:27:14.000 So, you know, that's a pretty low-hanging fruit one 450 00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:16.080 for the federal government to implement. 451 00:27:16.080 --> 00:27:17.840 It shouldn't really be that hard. 452 00:27:19.280 --> 00:27:21.680 Those would be my thoughts on that. 453 00:27:21.680 --> 00:27:23.400 All right, and I'll give Jason an opportunity 454 00:27:23.400 --> 00:27:27.480 to also nod with his voice and not just his head. 455 00:27:27.480 --> 00:27:29.160 How are you feeling about this, Jason? 456 00:27:29.160 --> 00:27:31.600 It's a giant nodding head, isn't it? 457 00:27:31.600 --> 00:27:35.360 Yeah, my sentiments exactly is, 458 00:27:35.360 --> 00:27:39.560 who is the end-user benefit going to? 459 00:27:39.560 --> 00:27:42.520 And if this is something that, you know, 460 00:27:42.520 --> 00:27:46.360 a way for builders just to pocket more 461 00:27:46.360 --> 00:27:51.000 or pass off the cost to the end-user, the buyer, 462 00:27:51.000 --> 00:27:53.760 then this doesn't solve really anything. 463 00:27:53.760 --> 00:27:56.960 So again, in theory, I like it, 464 00:27:56.960 --> 00:28:01.960 but I don't want to see it, you know, 465 00:28:03.440 --> 00:28:06.120 passed along to the buyer through the builder 466 00:28:06.120 --> 00:28:08.840 by just adding up, you know, 467 00:28:08.840 --> 00:28:10.960 that 50,000 back on the cost of a home. 468 00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:12.400 Up to a million is pretty funny, 469 00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:15.400 and I think Mayor Harris will agree with me, 470 00:28:15.400 --> 00:28:18.720 is, you know, the amount of income required for 1 million 471 00:28:18.720 --> 00:28:21.360 is what, a couple hundred thousand between two people? 472 00:28:21.360 --> 00:28:24.040 So, you know, when we think about the profile 473 00:28:24.040 --> 00:28:26.960 of a first-time buyer, that's certainly changed, 474 00:28:26.960 --> 00:28:30.120 and that's why home ownership is out of reach 475 00:28:30.120 --> 00:28:33.680 for so many younger professionals starting out, right? 476 00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:35.360 Where it's a, like Kyle said, 477 00:28:35.360 --> 00:28:37.400 it's a condo that they're starting out with. 478 00:28:37.400 --> 00:28:42.000 So does the person that's buying that million dollar 479 00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:43.120 need that 50,000? 480 00:28:43.160 --> 00:28:44.000 No. 481 00:28:44.000 --> 00:28:46.280 So you gotta see where, you know, 482 00:28:46.280 --> 00:28:47.680 who is this really helping, 483 00:28:47.680 --> 00:28:52.600 and it's not one, like Kyle said, it's an easy one, 484 00:28:52.600 --> 00:28:56.360 but it's not gonna make a dent, 485 00:28:57.480 --> 00:29:00.960 what I see what the overlying issue is, right? 486 00:29:00.960 --> 00:29:03.840 I have a thought that this might be an advantage 487 00:29:03.840 --> 00:29:08.840 for some maybe also first-time investors 488 00:29:09.120 --> 00:29:11.160 who might not own their own home. 489 00:29:11.160 --> 00:29:12.240 Maybe they've been renting, 490 00:29:12.240 --> 00:29:15.160 and that's how they've been saving their money. 491 00:29:15.160 --> 00:29:18.040 I don't know the fine print on this, 492 00:29:18.040 --> 00:29:20.240 but I don't think we're gonna get that right away, 493 00:29:20.240 --> 00:29:21.960 because as I said off the top of the show, 494 00:29:21.960 --> 00:29:25.720 I want, you know, this to be a conversation with all of us, 495 00:29:25.720 --> 00:29:28.560 inviting you to use the raise a hand feature on Zoom, 496 00:29:28.560 --> 00:29:32.000 and say you want to ask a question or make a comment, 497 00:29:32.000 --> 00:29:35.040 and Rosaria has done just that. 498 00:29:35.040 --> 00:29:38.400 So the floor is yours, Rosaria. 499 00:29:38.920 --> 00:29:41.280 The housing problem here in Canada 500 00:29:41.280 --> 00:29:43.360 is bigger than just not enough homes. 501 00:29:46.120 --> 00:29:48.120 And it's not just in Ontario. 502 00:29:48.120 --> 00:29:49.400 Can you guys hear me? 503 00:29:49.400 --> 00:29:51.160 Yes, yes, we can. 504 00:29:51.160 --> 00:29:52.400 It's not just in Ontario 505 00:29:52.400 --> 00:29:57.400 who has the stupidest laws for landlords. 506 00:29:57.760 --> 00:30:00.160 And I've actually been logging the government. 507 00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:02.340 and becoming a pain in their backside, 508 00:30:02.340 --> 00:30:04.140 but they're not doing anything. 509 00:30:04.140 --> 00:30:07.420 The problem is, like I have three kids. 510 00:30:08.300 --> 00:30:10.700 Number one, they can't get a job. 511 00:30:10.700 --> 00:30:13.160 So one, we have people who can't get a job. 512 00:30:14.380 --> 00:30:16.820 Nobody can live on minimum wage. 513 00:30:17.820 --> 00:30:20.540 You can't afford a down payment on minimum wage. 514 00:30:20.540 --> 00:30:23.740 You're gonna be living with mom and pop till you're 40. 515 00:30:23.740 --> 00:30:25.500 So the house prices are too high. 516 00:30:26.500 --> 00:30:30.940 Building more houses and creating like a 15 minute city, 517 00:30:30.940 --> 00:30:32.820 which everybody's talking about, 518 00:30:32.820 --> 00:30:35.340 is not the answer either. 519 00:30:35.340 --> 00:30:37.820 I don't know what the solution is. 520 00:30:37.820 --> 00:30:40.740 The government cannot build homes. 521 00:30:40.740 --> 00:30:43.620 They can't even get the Eglinton LRT up and running 522 00:30:43.620 --> 00:30:47.260 in what, 20 years now, 15 years? 523 00:30:47.260 --> 00:30:50.940 The government is useless at getting anything done. 524 00:30:50.940 --> 00:30:54.940 The private sector doesn't wanna invest in rentals 525 00:30:54.980 --> 00:30:57.580 because our laws quite frankly suck. 526 00:30:59.540 --> 00:31:02.820 Nobody wants to be a landlord, especially in Ontario. 527 00:31:02.820 --> 00:31:05.900 Well, I would challenge you that we at Key Spire 528 00:31:05.900 --> 00:31:08.940 are largely landlords and I think that there's a good 529 00:31:08.940 --> 00:31:11.520 community of us to lead the way on that. 530 00:31:11.520 --> 00:31:12.500 Yeah, no, I understand that. 531 00:31:12.500 --> 00:31:13.540 I mean, there's good and bad. 532 00:31:13.540 --> 00:31:15.980 We don't have, like we are lucky we've had 533 00:31:15.980 --> 00:31:19.660 really good tenants and we've had some problem tenants. 534 00:31:19.660 --> 00:31:22.260 But until a system is put in place 535 00:31:22.260 --> 00:31:25.620 where we can bring the house prices down 536 00:31:25.620 --> 00:31:27.140 by building houses. 537 00:31:27.140 --> 00:31:30.100 And I'm not talking about putting more houses 538 00:31:30.100 --> 00:31:32.140 in City of Toronto. 539 00:31:32.140 --> 00:31:35.020 Like we've got tons of land north of the city 540 00:31:36.020 --> 00:31:38.020 and I'm not, you know, 541 00:31:38.020 --> 00:31:40.020 but now they're going over the farmland. 542 00:31:40.020 --> 00:31:44.780 Like I'm here in Aurora and Newmarket, King City area 543 00:31:44.780 --> 00:31:49.780 and our farmlands are getting bought up by developers 544 00:31:50.220 --> 00:31:54.460 to build condos, nobody's buying a condo. 545 00:31:55.660 --> 00:31:56.820 Are they building rentals? 546 00:31:56.820 --> 00:31:59.700 No, they're not building a rent. 547 00:31:59.700 --> 00:32:00.980 They're building condos 548 00:32:00.980 --> 00:32:03.280 because nobody wants to buy a rental building. 549 00:32:04.700 --> 00:32:06.100 I don't know what the answer is, 550 00:32:06.100 --> 00:32:10.500 but these tiny homes is just gonna put money 551 00:32:10.500 --> 00:32:13.500 in Mark Carney's pocket because apparently he owns 552 00:32:13.500 --> 00:32:16.580 a company that makes tiny homes. 553 00:32:17.580 --> 00:32:22.580 So I don't know what the answer is here, 554 00:32:22.740 --> 00:32:27.660 but trying to build more homes in subdivisions 555 00:32:28.900 --> 00:32:31.500 isn't going to work like large apartment buildings. 556 00:32:31.500 --> 00:32:33.620 I already don't have any sunlight in my backyard 557 00:32:33.620 --> 00:32:35.700 and that's because our neighbors decided 558 00:32:35.700 --> 00:32:38.540 to put these ridiculous tall trees in there. 559 00:32:38.540 --> 00:32:40.940 But I don't know. 560 00:32:42.300 --> 00:32:43.980 I think trying to say that the government 561 00:32:43.980 --> 00:32:45.980 is going to do this and the government is going to do that 562 00:32:45.980 --> 00:32:46.820 is not the answer. 563 00:32:46.820 --> 00:32:50.420 We cannot rely on the government to fix anything. 564 00:32:50.420 --> 00:32:51.580 This is why we're in trouble 565 00:32:51.580 --> 00:32:53.940 is because everybody relies on the government 566 00:32:53.940 --> 00:32:56.060 and they just make a mess of everything. 567 00:32:57.460 --> 00:32:59.140 So that's my two cents worth. 568 00:32:59.140 --> 00:33:04.140 Yeah, so I think I'm going to get some commentary 569 00:33:04.300 --> 00:33:07.540 on our panels on that. 570 00:33:09.180 --> 00:33:10.940 I wanna throw this over to Kyle 571 00:33:10.940 --> 00:33:13.060 to address some of these issues. 572 00:33:13.180 --> 00:33:14.020 Yeah. 573 00:33:15.140 --> 00:33:18.100 Well, there's a whole host of points in there. 574 00:33:19.020 --> 00:33:24.020 Certainly I empathize with the Ontario landlord laws. 575 00:33:26.340 --> 00:33:28.740 They are very pro-tenant. 576 00:33:29.740 --> 00:33:32.020 They are certainly far more pro-tenant 577 00:33:32.020 --> 00:33:34.140 than other provinces in the country. 578 00:33:37.780 --> 00:33:39.580 Given that the conservative government 579 00:33:39.580 --> 00:33:41.220 is in power in Ontario, 580 00:33:41.220 --> 00:33:43.780 if changes were going to be made to it, 581 00:33:43.780 --> 00:33:47.380 especially with them having a majority, 582 00:33:47.380 --> 00:33:50.100 I would have thought changes would have been made already. 583 00:33:50.100 --> 00:33:54.180 So I wouldn't expect that happening anytime soon. 584 00:33:55.540 --> 00:33:59.380 In terms of developing lands, 585 00:34:01.500 --> 00:34:04.140 a large number of lands are protected 586 00:34:04.140 --> 00:34:09.139 by environmental areas and Greenbelt in Ontario. 587 00:34:10.139 --> 00:34:11.820 And I'm sure other provinces 588 00:34:11.820 --> 00:34:14.620 have a lot of similar aspects in there. 589 00:34:16.100 --> 00:34:18.020 And so as you saw, again, 590 00:34:18.020 --> 00:34:19.780 I know there's people from all over the country, 591 00:34:19.780 --> 00:34:22.739 but I'm far more informed 592 00:34:22.739 --> 00:34:25.100 with what's happening in Ontario. 593 00:34:25.100 --> 00:34:27.179 You saw that there was some movement 594 00:34:27.179 --> 00:34:28.739 towards developing those lands 595 00:34:28.739 --> 00:34:31.420 and it was quickly backtracked. 596 00:34:31.420 --> 00:34:35.139 So again, I don't see that happening anytime soon. 597 00:34:36.139 --> 00:34:40.540 I do agree that significant changes 598 00:34:40.540 --> 00:34:45.179 or tipping points need to happen in the Canadian economy 599 00:34:45.179 --> 00:34:50.179 for younger people to be able to become more employed 600 00:34:51.060 --> 00:34:54.380 and be in a position to purchase homes. 601 00:34:54.380 --> 00:34:56.900 But that's also very much a worldwide thing 602 00:34:56.900 --> 00:34:59.580 with real estate property going up in value. 603 00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:03.440 wage levels across the country or across the world, 604 00:35:04.380 --> 00:35:07.560 not increasing at the same rates. 605 00:35:07.560 --> 00:35:09.320 I don't know what the answer is to it. 606 00:35:09.320 --> 00:35:13.680 If I did, I'm sure I would be not just a lawyer here, 607 00:35:13.680 --> 00:35:15.920 I would be doing a lot of other things. 608 00:35:16.800 --> 00:35:18.960 They are real problems. 609 00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:21.040 We can't disagree with anything that was said. 610 00:35:21.040 --> 00:35:25.160 Those are all issues in terms of not disagreeing 611 00:35:25.160 --> 00:35:26.480 with those points brought up. 612 00:35:26.480 --> 00:35:27.480 They are real. 613 00:35:28.400 --> 00:35:30.440 And I think part of the issue is, 614 00:35:30.440 --> 00:35:31.840 and I'm seeing some people say, 615 00:35:31.840 --> 00:35:36.840 there's a lot of jobs in other parts of the country. 616 00:35:37.200 --> 00:35:41.440 And perhaps people do need to relocate to certain areas. 617 00:35:41.440 --> 00:35:44.240 And perhaps people do need to, 618 00:35:46.520 --> 00:35:49.360 get jobs in other areas for now 619 00:35:49.360 --> 00:35:51.340 and then move into their chosen field. 620 00:35:53.100 --> 00:35:56.160 That's pretty much all I could say on any of those points. 621 00:35:56.160 --> 00:35:57.840 No, I think it's well said. 622 00:35:57.840 --> 00:35:59.240 I do wanna kind of move, 623 00:35:59.240 --> 00:36:01.320 cause we have a lot to talk about. 624 00:36:01.320 --> 00:36:03.280 And the other thing is that, 625 00:36:03.280 --> 00:36:06.320 as noted by these election results, 626 00:36:06.320 --> 00:36:09.880 these were tight races in everything. 627 00:36:09.880 --> 00:36:11.480 And the numbers are very close, 628 00:36:11.480 --> 00:36:14.300 both in the actual results 629 00:36:14.300 --> 00:36:18.080 and in the individual writings in the contests. 630 00:36:18.080 --> 00:36:23.080 And there's a lot of hard feelings on either side. 631 00:36:23.280 --> 00:36:25.200 And I'd like to kind of keep this discussion 632 00:36:25.240 --> 00:36:28.480 focused on the real estate and the tactics 633 00:36:28.480 --> 00:36:33.480 and what to do and what advantages are there for us 634 00:36:33.720 --> 00:36:35.240 within the Keyspire community 635 00:36:35.240 --> 00:36:38.840 and as being investors who create housing 636 00:36:38.840 --> 00:36:40.580 and places to live. 637 00:36:40.580 --> 00:36:45.060 Now we do have another hand up from Connie Hall Saunders. 638 00:36:45.060 --> 00:36:47.720 So I'd like to welcome you to the show, Connie. 639 00:36:51.520 --> 00:36:52.480 Connie, I can't hear you. 640 00:36:52.480 --> 00:36:54.260 I think you're still on mute. 641 00:36:54.260 --> 00:36:55.100 Yep, thank you. 642 00:36:55.100 --> 00:36:55.940 Thank you. 643 00:36:55.940 --> 00:36:57.060 Richard, I'm not used to seeing you 644 00:36:57.060 --> 00:36:58.780 without your fancy hat on. 645 00:36:58.780 --> 00:36:59.700 I do have it there, 646 00:36:59.700 --> 00:37:02.940 but I felt the bald made me look distinguished 647 00:37:02.940 --> 00:37:04.260 and authoritative today. 648 00:37:04.260 --> 00:37:05.500 I absolutely agree. 649 00:37:05.500 --> 00:37:06.620 It certainly does. 650 00:37:06.620 --> 00:37:09.700 I just wanted to share a couple of personal experiences, 651 00:37:09.700 --> 00:37:13.900 both on the new home, 652 00:37:13.900 --> 00:37:16.580 the new or the building homes, if you will, 653 00:37:16.580 --> 00:37:20.220 slide in all of the information that contributed to that. 654 00:37:20.220 --> 00:37:21.940 More recently, after two and a half months, 655 00:37:21.940 --> 00:37:25.100 I pulled my mother out of the hospital 656 00:37:25.100 --> 00:37:27.380 that she was getting sicker in and not better. 657 00:37:27.380 --> 00:37:30.780 And with respect to where she was going to live 658 00:37:30.780 --> 00:37:32.740 because she couldn't be by herself, 659 00:37:32.740 --> 00:37:34.860 one of the options that I explored 660 00:37:34.860 --> 00:37:36.920 was putting an ADU in our backyard. 661 00:37:36.920 --> 00:37:41.100 We're sitting on an acre and it's a rectangular lot 662 00:37:41.100 --> 00:37:43.820 and one very small corner of that acre 663 00:37:43.820 --> 00:37:45.920 sits on the Oak Ridges Marine. 664 00:37:46.980 --> 00:37:50.740 But the other three quarters of it or more, 665 00:37:50.740 --> 00:37:51.980 absolutely do not. 666 00:37:51.980 --> 00:37:55.900 There are houses beside us and a subdivision behind us. 667 00:37:55.900 --> 00:37:59.500 Unfortunately, I was rejected 668 00:37:59.500 --> 00:38:04.500 after three certain departments in the town of Caledon 669 00:38:05.540 --> 00:38:08.100 that it was not going to be possible 670 00:38:08.100 --> 00:38:10.280 that because of that one little parcel, 671 00:38:10.280 --> 00:38:13.500 postage stamp sized parcel on my land 672 00:38:13.500 --> 00:38:14.900 was sitting on the Marine. 673 00:38:14.900 --> 00:38:16.660 It was more recently rolling up 674 00:38:16.660 --> 00:38:20.700 under the Greenbelt rules and regulations 675 00:38:21.540 --> 00:38:23.220 and debacles of everything where that's concerned. 676 00:38:23.220 --> 00:38:28.220 And that this actually is not forecasted in Caledon 677 00:38:28.540 --> 00:38:33.540 to be even looked at or accepted within the next 10 years. 678 00:38:34.720 --> 00:38:39.720 So while we're saying that the government is looking at 679 00:38:44.180 --> 00:38:46.980 increasing ADUs or tiny homes or what have you, 680 00:38:46.980 --> 00:38:50.380 there are still a lot of, as I saw in the chat, 681 00:38:51.140 --> 00:38:53.500 rules and regulations and red tape with respect to that. 682 00:38:53.500 --> 00:38:56.460 Flipping over to new builds and homes 683 00:38:56.460 --> 00:38:58.600 and the $500,000 number, Richard, 684 00:38:58.600 --> 00:39:00.980 that you had in your slide there. 685 00:39:00.980 --> 00:39:02.060 Yes. 686 00:39:02.060 --> 00:39:05.100 More recently, we're just coming out 687 00:39:05.100 --> 00:39:09.040 of a CMHC-MLI project in Newfoundland 688 00:39:09.040 --> 00:39:12.140 in which we were able to purchase homes side by each, 689 00:39:12.140 --> 00:39:14.320 as long as they were contiguously beside each other, 690 00:39:14.320 --> 00:39:17.300 we were able to actually purchase three apartment homes, 691 00:39:17.300 --> 00:39:19.580 which equaled to 12 units. 692 00:39:19.580 --> 00:39:24.060 Halfway through our project, CMHC changed their rules 693 00:39:24.060 --> 00:39:27.100 and we're not permitting that any longer, 694 00:39:27.100 --> 00:39:28.740 which didn't affect us, fortunately, 695 00:39:28.740 --> 00:39:32.180 because we were in the hopper sooner than that rule changed. 696 00:39:32.180 --> 00:39:33.780 So they had to finish ours out. 697 00:39:33.780 --> 00:39:36.220 However, we love to be boots on the ground. 698 00:39:36.220 --> 00:39:40.060 So walking around into new subdivisions 699 00:39:40.060 --> 00:39:43.780 was actually a real eye-opener with respect to targets. 700 00:39:43.780 --> 00:39:44.940 No problem. 701 00:39:44.940 --> 00:39:48.780 And projections, Newfoundland being that they're- 702 00:39:48.860 --> 00:39:50.820 EDA pick up? 703 00:39:50.820 --> 00:39:51.660 Somebody needs a- 704 00:39:51.660 --> 00:39:53.860 Yeah, sorry, we're just getting that taken care of. 705 00:39:53.860 --> 00:39:55.060 There you go, continue. 706 00:39:55.060 --> 00:39:56.940 Thank you, thank you, yes. 707 00:39:56.940 --> 00:39:59.980 That they're actually forecasting a supply gap of- 708 00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:06.540 4000 homes by 2028. And from the horse's mouth, we walked into a 709 00:40:06.540 --> 00:40:10.140 subdivision where we, you know, really had hoped this could be 710 00:40:10.140 --> 00:40:14.640 our next project. And that builder, sadly, said that he was 711 00:40:14.640 --> 00:40:18.380 actually closing his building because his building company, 712 00:40:18.480 --> 00:40:23.700 because there is such a shortage of skilled trades there, that 713 00:40:23.700 --> 00:40:28.940 the few builders that are continuing have poached the 714 00:40:28.940 --> 00:40:34.860 skills from the smaller guys. And that's that's not helping in 715 00:40:34.860 --> 00:40:38.780 the sense that, you know, nobody can be there are barriers to 716 00:40:38.780 --> 00:40:42.260 entry for anybody that wants to do that. And the skills just 717 00:40:42.260 --> 00:40:47.300 don't exist. Back to the hospital, an injured construction 718 00:40:47.300 --> 00:40:54.080 worker, and I were having a chat, who said to me, that since 719 00:40:54.100 --> 00:40:58.620 this inception of the race to new builds, and the government's 720 00:40:59.420 --> 00:41:04.340 financial incentives and whatnot, he has had the ability 721 00:41:04.340 --> 00:41:08.780 to walk from job site to job site with his construction boots 722 00:41:08.780 --> 00:41:14.900 in hand and take cash paid positions without ever writing a 723 00:41:14.900 --> 00:41:20.740 resume ever signing a contract. And builders are that desperate 724 00:41:20.740 --> 00:41:24.820 to get skilled trades in and that's here in Ontario. Sadly, 725 00:41:24.820 --> 00:41:30.220 he's now in a hospital injured as a result of this career path 726 00:41:30.220 --> 00:41:33.860 he's chosen and is not protected from a health perspective. But 727 00:41:34.140 --> 00:41:38.820 that's that's sort of, in my opinion, where the government 728 00:41:39.020 --> 00:41:41.380 easy to write a number and put it to paper and put it on a 729 00:41:41.380 --> 00:41:44.100 slide. But what are the supporting plans that are going 730 00:41:44.100 --> 00:41:49.580 to help our country meet those goals? Because as it sits today, 731 00:41:49.580 --> 00:41:53.980 it doesn't feel like anybody's really paying attention or down 732 00:41:53.980 --> 00:41:56.780 in the weeds where where work needs to be done. 733 00:41:57.300 --> 00:42:00.500 Connie makes a good point. And they did address it a little 734 00:42:00.500 --> 00:42:02.820 bit. I think it's further in your slides, though. You're 735 00:42:02.820 --> 00:42:07.340 right. Construction and trades are definitely something that 736 00:42:07.340 --> 00:42:10.780 needs to be addressed. And I said it before it needs to come 737 00:42:10.780 --> 00:42:15.460 to the forefront because the the plan is great. But the 738 00:42:15.460 --> 00:42:17.980 execution if we don't have the people, it's just not going to 739 00:42:17.980 --> 00:42:22.260 happen. So there definitely needs to be more funding into 740 00:42:22.500 --> 00:42:25.740 and they've started some of that. But there needs to be a 741 00:42:25.740 --> 00:42:26.780 bigger push on that end. 742 00:42:26.820 --> 00:42:29.620 Yeah, a plan a plan associated. Yes. Thank you. 743 00:42:29.900 --> 00:42:33.540 Connie's banged on the MLA and the CMHC MLA. So it's not alone. 744 00:42:33.540 --> 00:42:36.580 We were working on a structure deal as well was in Alberta at 745 00:42:36.580 --> 00:42:39.900 the time. And again, the rules change partway through. So you 746 00:42:39.900 --> 00:42:42.340 think you're going down this path of I can either do energy 747 00:42:42.340 --> 00:42:45.780 efficiency or whatever the case is, or you know, in my case, we 748 00:42:45.780 --> 00:42:49.260 had a client buying exactly like you side by side houses. And 749 00:42:49.260 --> 00:42:54.260 they were two triplexes. So a six door unit property. And in 750 00:42:54.260 --> 00:42:56.860 early this year, CMHC came out and changed the rules again. So 751 00:42:56.860 --> 00:42:59.820 like you could be stuck sort of in the middle of a process like 752 00:42:59.820 --> 00:43:02.860 the clients were working on energy efficiency. We need to 753 00:43:02.860 --> 00:43:05.900 pivot last minute in the middle of the CMHC process and take 754 00:43:05.900 --> 00:43:10.380 them through affordability. So we got lucky. And to Connie's 755 00:43:10.380 --> 00:43:12.980 point, Connie's got lucky as well. We were able to get 756 00:43:12.980 --> 00:43:15.580 through the finish line with the low down payment and the extended 757 00:43:15.580 --> 00:43:18.460 am but these are things we need to always make sure that we've 758 00:43:18.460 --> 00:43:22.260 got, you know, the rule CMHC is an interesting governing body, 759 00:43:22.260 --> 00:43:25.020 right? The rules can change on the fly, like we've seen in 760 00:43:25.060 --> 00:43:25.820 other cases. 761 00:43:25.940 --> 00:43:26.900 Agreed, agreed. 762 00:43:27.140 --> 00:43:29.380 And you just got to make sure that you're protected enough 763 00:43:29.380 --> 00:43:31.780 where you've got enough excess down payment that if God forbid 764 00:43:31.780 --> 00:43:35.060 something changes midstream, and you're in the queue, or waiting 765 00:43:35.060 --> 00:43:39.020 to get your number called to the deli counter. And, you know, 766 00:43:39.020 --> 00:43:40.820 you're, you don't know where you're going to be on some of 767 00:43:40.820 --> 00:43:42.860 these things. So just got to got to really think through 768 00:43:42.860 --> 00:43:45.380 strategies. And but they're tremendous opportunities to 769 00:43:45.380 --> 00:43:46.860 certainly if you can take advantage of them. 770 00:43:47.260 --> 00:43:48.260 For sure. Yes. 771 00:43:48.820 --> 00:43:51.660 Right. Thank you for that, Connie. And to our panel, I 772 00:43:51.660 --> 00:43:54.100 want to be mindful of time because we've got about 15 773 00:43:54.100 --> 00:43:59.020 minutes left till 1pm here in Ontario where we where we're 774 00:43:59.860 --> 00:44:03.420 broadcasting from. I know that we're some of you are going to 775 00:44:03.420 --> 00:44:05.780 be on lunch break, some of us have meetings and stuff 776 00:44:05.780 --> 00:44:10.220 afterwards. So I want to get us off on time. And I think I'll 777 00:44:10.220 --> 00:44:12.620 probably only have time to get through one more issue if I'm 778 00:44:12.620 --> 00:44:15.100 right, and then we'll just have to yada, yada, yada and go, 779 00:44:15.180 --> 00:44:17.940 here's a whole bunch of other things to look into. But I see 780 00:44:17.940 --> 00:44:22.540 Brandon has a hand up as well. So I want to if you can be 781 00:44:22.540 --> 00:44:25.740 quick and direct about your your questions or comments, but 782 00:44:25.740 --> 00:44:27.020 we'll certainly take Brandon. 783 00:44:29.580 --> 00:44:35.060 Quick and direct. Okay. I guess the simplest thing I just my 784 00:44:35.060 --> 00:44:38.860 point of view on on everything is, you know, I'm not somebody 785 00:44:38.860 --> 00:44:42.180 who's in a position to influence what the rules are of the game. 786 00:44:42.940 --> 00:44:46.860 So my focus has always been to figure out how to win the game 787 00:44:46.980 --> 00:44:50.620 with the rules that are in place. And, you know, thinking 788 00:44:50.620 --> 00:44:53.260 through strategies, and yeah, sometimes the rules can change 789 00:44:53.260 --> 00:44:58.020 CMHC does their thing. But wishing the rules were 790 00:44:58.020 --> 00:44:59.980 different, is not going to get 791 00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:03.520 to anywhere, so just figure out what the rules are, 792 00:45:03.520 --> 00:45:05.120 take advantage of the Keyspire community 793 00:45:05.120 --> 00:45:07.040 and the knowledge that's available to us 794 00:45:07.040 --> 00:45:09.280 and figure out how you can win within the rules 795 00:45:09.280 --> 00:45:11.580 and just keep moving forward. 796 00:45:11.580 --> 00:45:14.560 That is fantastic insight, Brandon. 797 00:45:14.560 --> 00:45:17.160 I'm reminded of Michael Cerasini 798 00:45:17.160 --> 00:45:21.880 and I believe this is within the first workshop 799 00:45:21.880 --> 00:45:24.960 of our Signature Mastermind program 800 00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:27.600 where he has the tool, the Control Influencer 801 00:45:27.600 --> 00:45:29.440 and it's this, here are the things 802 00:45:29.440 --> 00:45:31.480 that I can control or not control 803 00:45:31.480 --> 00:45:33.280 and it's basically, one of them is 804 00:45:33.280 --> 00:45:35.560 that you can't control the government and what it does, 805 00:45:35.560 --> 00:45:38.080 but you can control your business 806 00:45:38.080 --> 00:45:39.880 and how you respond to that. 807 00:45:39.880 --> 00:45:42.600 So yes, thank you for that, Brandon, as well. 808 00:45:42.600 --> 00:45:45.800 And I do wanna get us to our next topic 809 00:45:45.800 --> 00:45:47.560 and then we'll try to see what we can do 810 00:45:47.560 --> 00:45:50.200 about wrapping this up. 811 00:45:50.200 --> 00:45:53.440 And mortgage policy reform. 812 00:45:53.440 --> 00:45:57.000 So this one is, so basically on the website 813 00:45:57.000 --> 00:45:59.760 it says that Mark Carney will make mortgage payments 814 00:45:59.760 --> 00:46:03.360 more affordable by reviewing Canada's mortgage market 815 00:46:03.360 --> 00:46:06.520 with the objective to offer Canadians more options 816 00:46:06.520 --> 00:46:08.700 while retaining stability in the market. 817 00:46:08.700 --> 00:46:12.000 This will look at barriers to longer interest rate terms 818 00:46:12.000 --> 00:46:15.280 on mortgages, which would give Canadians 819 00:46:15.280 --> 00:46:17.080 more financial stability. 820 00:46:19.040 --> 00:46:20.960 What does that actually mean? 821 00:46:20.960 --> 00:46:23.080 And I think we're best starting off with Harris 822 00:46:23.080 --> 00:46:24.400 since this is mortgages. 823 00:46:24.400 --> 00:46:26.080 We're going to money guy. 824 00:46:26.080 --> 00:46:27.080 What's that? 825 00:46:27.080 --> 00:46:28.640 Going to money guy again. 826 00:46:28.640 --> 00:46:30.280 Well, it's his bread and butter, right? 827 00:46:30.280 --> 00:46:32.920 I mean, we can exclude him. 828 00:46:32.920 --> 00:46:34.560 Yeah. 829 00:46:34.560 --> 00:46:36.360 Yeah, it's a very interesting statement 830 00:46:36.360 --> 00:46:39.640 and I would love to see how Mr. Carney 831 00:46:39.640 --> 00:46:40.840 is gonna make this happen 832 00:46:40.840 --> 00:46:44.120 for making mortgage payments more affordable. 833 00:46:46.760 --> 00:46:47.920 It's interesting times right now. 834 00:46:47.920 --> 00:46:49.520 I mean, I guess if he's gonna hang his hat 835 00:46:49.520 --> 00:46:52.120 on the fact that the liberals made some changes 836 00:46:52.120 --> 00:46:53.720 towards the last year 837 00:46:53.720 --> 00:46:56.680 with now increasing the amount that one can borrow. 838 00:46:56.680 --> 00:46:59.280 So changing the CMHC rules 839 00:46:59.280 --> 00:47:01.640 so you can borrow from 1 million to 1.5 million now 840 00:47:01.640 --> 00:47:04.240 sort of in that space from an option 841 00:47:04.240 --> 00:47:07.920 or they've taken amortization from 25 years to 30 years. 842 00:47:07.920 --> 00:47:09.360 Like that is an improvement 843 00:47:09.360 --> 00:47:12.240 and certainly is allowing folks 844 00:47:12.240 --> 00:47:14.000 that are taking CMHC mortgages 845 00:47:14.000 --> 00:47:15.840 to be able to spread their mortgage payments 846 00:47:15.840 --> 00:47:16.960 over an extra five years. 847 00:47:16.960 --> 00:47:19.780 That is helping from a qualification standpoint 848 00:47:19.820 --> 00:47:21.820 and from an affordability standpoint. 849 00:47:22.820 --> 00:47:25.980 But right now when we see the rates on the fixed rates 850 00:47:25.980 --> 00:47:27.980 which again are tied to the bond market 851 00:47:27.980 --> 00:47:31.900 not to the actual Bank of Canada prime lending rates, 852 00:47:31.900 --> 00:47:34.660 you're seeing those rates increasing at the moment. 853 00:47:34.660 --> 00:47:37.500 And so that's where we need to start 854 00:47:37.500 --> 00:47:38.940 to get some stability back into this, 855 00:47:38.940 --> 00:47:42.220 get the bond market kind of calmed down 856 00:47:42.220 --> 00:47:43.820 with all the noise it's been dealing with. 857 00:47:43.820 --> 00:47:45.500 And then we can start to see the rates 858 00:47:45.500 --> 00:47:46.420 start to come back down. 859 00:47:46.420 --> 00:47:48.160 Are we getting down to 2% rates again? 860 00:47:48.160 --> 00:47:51.280 That's going to make payments more affordable for everyone? 861 00:47:51.280 --> 00:47:52.680 Likely not. 862 00:47:52.680 --> 00:47:53.880 But I can tell you in this space, 863 00:47:53.880 --> 00:47:55.600 I mean, certainly a number of economists 864 00:47:55.600 --> 00:47:58.440 still feel that we're going to see the bank lending rate, 865 00:47:58.440 --> 00:48:00.480 the prime lending rate that's most important to all of us 866 00:48:00.480 --> 00:48:03.040 that has variable or home equity line of credits. 867 00:48:03.040 --> 00:48:05.760 You know, the crystal ball reading right now 868 00:48:05.760 --> 00:48:08.200 is that essentially there's still about another half a point 869 00:48:08.200 --> 00:48:10.200 that we banked in for this year 870 00:48:10.200 --> 00:48:11.880 where they still see prime dropping. 871 00:48:11.880 --> 00:48:14.240 So when you got prime at 495 today 872 00:48:14.240 --> 00:48:15.840 minus any discounts you've got, 873 00:48:16.840 --> 00:48:18.800 would get down to probably 445 874 00:48:18.800 --> 00:48:20.560 by the end of Q4 of this year. 875 00:48:20.560 --> 00:48:22.800 And, you know, many people are certainly expecting 876 00:48:22.800 --> 00:48:24.960 that they think on the June 4th meeting 877 00:48:24.960 --> 00:48:26.080 might be the opportunity 878 00:48:26.080 --> 00:48:27.720 where they see the next rate cut happen, 879 00:48:27.720 --> 00:48:30.600 which again would help from an affordability standpoint, 880 00:48:30.600 --> 00:48:33.320 from a mortgage payment perspective for all of us. 881 00:48:34.160 --> 00:48:35.000 All right. 882 00:48:35.000 --> 00:48:36.520 And Jason, I've got a question. 883 00:48:36.520 --> 00:48:38.600 Yeah, well, my comment is going to turn 884 00:48:38.600 --> 00:48:40.340 into a question for money guy. 885 00:48:40.580 --> 00:48:45.580 Do you see or envision zero down coming back 886 00:48:46.660 --> 00:48:50.540 for first time buyers and benefits pros cons? 887 00:48:52.340 --> 00:48:53.220 Yeah, zero down. 888 00:48:53.220 --> 00:48:56.860 That would be an interesting perspective. 889 00:48:56.860 --> 00:48:59.540 It was there for a short period of time. 890 00:48:59.540 --> 00:49:00.780 For 20 minutes, yeah. 891 00:49:00.780 --> 00:49:05.780 Yeah, back in, it's hard for me even to say early 2000s. 892 00:49:06.180 --> 00:49:08.540 It would have been back in around that range, exactly. 893 00:49:08.580 --> 00:49:12.580 So, and I know some banks even had a cashback. 894 00:49:12.580 --> 00:49:15.020 It's Bank of, Scotiabank had a cashback. 895 00:49:15.020 --> 00:49:15.860 So back then- 896 00:49:15.860 --> 00:49:17.540 And some banks still offer that, Jason. 897 00:49:17.540 --> 00:49:20.300 There is still cashback offers that some lenders do offer. 898 00:49:20.300 --> 00:49:21.700 Again, it's not to be allowed to be used 899 00:49:21.700 --> 00:49:22.920 for down payment purposes, 900 00:49:22.920 --> 00:49:25.620 but it can definitely be used from a closing cost campaign 901 00:49:25.620 --> 00:49:28.700 or, you know, you got to buy a new fridge, new appliances. 902 00:49:28.700 --> 00:49:32.420 So there are some lenders that do offer cashback promos 903 00:49:33.680 --> 00:49:34.820 as part of their incentives. 904 00:49:34.820 --> 00:49:36.140 So you may not get as deep a discount, 905 00:49:36.140 --> 00:49:38.220 but instead you might get a 3% cashback 906 00:49:38.900 --> 00:49:42.300 or a 2% cashback on closing that would assist them. 907 00:49:42.300 --> 00:49:45.060 You know, you're buying a $500,000 property 908 00:49:45.060 --> 00:49:46.260 with a 3% cashback. 909 00:49:46.260 --> 00:49:48.780 That's not too shabby to assist 910 00:49:48.780 --> 00:49:51.340 with some of the costs you've got on closing. 911 00:49:51.340 --> 00:49:53.820 Yeah, it's, and I wonder, Kyle, 912 00:49:53.820 --> 00:49:56.380 if you were practicing law at that time, 913 00:49:56.380 --> 00:49:57.980 real estate law specifically. 914 00:49:59.340 --> 00:50:00.180 In 07, 08, 915 00:50:00.000 --> 00:50:05.000 Wait, do I look much older than I feel? 916 00:50:06.580 --> 00:50:07.420 So no. 917 00:50:07.420 --> 00:50:08.240 So- 918 00:50:08.240 --> 00:50:09.200 Than the money guy? 919 00:50:09.200 --> 00:50:10.040 Yeah. 920 00:50:11.840 --> 00:50:13.560 I just wanted to check, Kyle. 921 00:50:13.560 --> 00:50:14.840 No, you don't, I didn't. 922 00:50:14.840 --> 00:50:17.520 You were probably either just in law school 923 00:50:17.520 --> 00:50:19.460 or not even quite, maybe. 924 00:50:19.460 --> 00:50:21.200 Just wrapping up high school. 925 00:50:21.200 --> 00:50:22.280 Yeah, that's right. 926 00:50:22.280 --> 00:50:27.280 No, no, obviously the job stresses aged me significantly. 927 00:50:27.840 --> 00:50:28.840 So thank you, Jason. 928 00:50:28.840 --> 00:50:31.680 I'll have a great time with that. 929 00:50:35.080 --> 00:50:36.480 Yeah, no, I don't know. 930 00:50:36.480 --> 00:50:41.360 The zero down back, like when I was a realtor at that time, 931 00:50:41.360 --> 00:50:45.440 it was like, there's people that got a lot of 932 00:50:45.440 --> 00:50:46.840 first-time buyers got in the market 933 00:50:46.840 --> 00:50:48.320 that otherwise couldn't have, 934 00:50:48.320 --> 00:50:50.600 but I'm not sure how I feel about it, 935 00:50:50.600 --> 00:50:54.480 but the way that average prices have gone 936 00:50:54.480 --> 00:50:56.960 and that the, you know, saving for a down payment, 937 00:50:56.960 --> 00:50:58.600 I can't see it. 938 00:50:59.360 --> 00:51:00.200 I don't think it would hurt. 939 00:51:00.200 --> 00:51:02.360 So I don't, I'm not sure what you think here. 940 00:51:05.120 --> 00:51:07.480 Yeah, I think it'd be a great option to bring back 941 00:51:07.480 --> 00:51:09.880 for certainly some of our buyers that are out there 942 00:51:09.880 --> 00:51:11.120 but having a zero percent down. 943 00:51:11.120 --> 00:51:13.200 I mean, it's a, you know, again, 944 00:51:13.200 --> 00:51:14.480 the banks would have an issue 945 00:51:14.480 --> 00:51:16.400 because they're always looking for skin in the game, right? 946 00:51:16.400 --> 00:51:18.560 So they want to make sure, I mean, that's where the banks, 947 00:51:18.560 --> 00:51:20.640 if I'm wearing my bank hat for a moment, 948 00:51:20.640 --> 00:51:23.280 they always want to know whether it's as little as 5% down 949 00:51:23.280 --> 00:51:25.240 that at least there's someone's put in, you know, 950 00:51:25.240 --> 00:51:28.520 X amount of dollar was 25 grand or 30 or 50 grand. 951 00:51:29.280 --> 00:51:30.480 They've got skin in the game 952 00:51:30.480 --> 00:51:32.440 and not as simple to walk away from something 953 00:51:32.440 --> 00:51:34.080 when you've got something that you've put in, 954 00:51:34.080 --> 00:51:35.520 you know, your life savings potentially, 955 00:51:35.520 --> 00:51:36.880 or, you know, you saved up for years 956 00:51:36.880 --> 00:51:40.760 to get to your 25, $50,000 down payment, 100,000, 957 00:51:40.760 --> 00:51:43.080 that it's hard to walk away from a property 958 00:51:43.080 --> 00:51:44.920 when you've got that kind of investment in there. 959 00:51:44.920 --> 00:51:46.640 A zero percent down, you know, 960 00:51:46.640 --> 00:51:48.840 you probably see the keys being dropped off a little easier 961 00:51:48.840 --> 00:51:52.240 than if you've got a percentage into the property, 962 00:51:52.240 --> 00:51:56.680 but it's an interesting and outside the box way of thinking 963 00:51:56.720 --> 00:52:00.080 of opportunities on different ways to get creative. 964 00:52:00.080 --> 00:52:00.920 Yeah. 965 00:52:02.040 --> 00:52:05.520 All right, so I am going to now motor through 966 00:52:05.520 --> 00:52:07.920 some of these things on a very, 967 00:52:07.920 --> 00:52:09.320 here's a whole bunch of things 968 00:52:09.320 --> 00:52:11.400 that we thought was interesting 969 00:52:11.400 --> 00:52:14.000 and we do not have time to talk about, 970 00:52:14.000 --> 00:52:17.400 and then I'll bring it back to wrap the show up 971 00:52:17.400 --> 00:52:20.160 with what I like to get as final thoughts. 972 00:52:20.160 --> 00:52:24.920 So what we didn't have time to talk about was immigration, 973 00:52:24.920 --> 00:52:28.480 and it looks like we're looking to stabilize 974 00:52:28.480 --> 00:52:31.040 or likely lower immigration rates. 975 00:52:31.040 --> 00:52:32.120 There's a policy on that. 976 00:52:32.120 --> 00:52:33.840 Inter-provincial trade, 977 00:52:33.840 --> 00:52:35.960 which I wish we had time to get to that one 978 00:52:35.960 --> 00:52:40.120 because I'm curious how that would affect 979 00:52:40.120 --> 00:52:43.400 things like construction, home building, 980 00:52:43.400 --> 00:52:46.000 that sort of thing, but they're looking to 981 00:52:46.000 --> 00:52:48.960 basically take off a lot of the trade barriers. 982 00:52:48.960 --> 00:52:52.360 The AI tax credit is something that I would suggest 983 00:52:52.360 --> 00:52:54.080 looking out for because it is, 984 00:52:54.080 --> 00:52:56.240 they said it would be aimed for 985 00:52:56.240 --> 00:52:58.840 small and medium-sized businesses, 986 00:52:58.840 --> 00:53:02.520 which is basically you as a real estate investor 987 00:53:02.520 --> 00:53:05.520 are running a small business. 988 00:53:05.520 --> 00:53:08.240 So now granted, there's the thing about 989 00:53:08.240 --> 00:53:11.280 as long as it can demonstrate that they're increasing jobs, 990 00:53:11.280 --> 00:53:14.360 not taking them away, but it's interesting. 991 00:53:14.360 --> 00:53:19.360 It made me go, hmm, national building codes. 992 00:53:19.560 --> 00:53:21.840 Another thing I really wish we had time to talk about, 993 00:53:21.840 --> 00:53:25.400 maybe we'll have to do some follow-up sessions 994 00:53:25.400 --> 00:53:27.640 in the future to talk about some of these things, 995 00:53:27.640 --> 00:53:29.520 especially as they become clearer. 996 00:53:30.400 --> 00:53:33.320 We've got home retrofits. 997 00:53:33.320 --> 00:53:36.240 So basically to make your homes more energy efficient, 998 00:53:36.240 --> 00:53:38.680 various programs proposed for that. 999 00:53:38.680 --> 00:53:42.120 Likewise, to make your buildings more accessible, 1000 00:53:44.720 --> 00:53:46.400 proposed funding for that. 1001 00:53:46.400 --> 00:53:49.120 There would be a review of the corporate tax system, 1002 00:53:49.120 --> 00:53:50.640 which is probably something that makes 1003 00:53:50.640 --> 00:53:52.240 a lot of people nervous. 1004 00:53:53.320 --> 00:53:57.840 Balancing the budget by 2028, which is a long time off, 1005 00:53:57.840 --> 00:54:00.880 but it's interesting to note that it is 1006 00:54:00.880 --> 00:54:03.120 theoretically on the horizon. 1007 00:54:03.120 --> 00:54:06.120 Apprenticeship grants could actually be a very big deal 1008 00:54:06.120 --> 00:54:09.600 in the home, even just getting someone 1009 00:54:09.600 --> 00:54:13.120 to do your renovations could help increase that. 1010 00:54:15.200 --> 00:54:16.040 What do we have? 1011 00:54:16.880 --> 00:54:19.800 Transition bonds, that's a whole other thing. 1012 00:54:19.800 --> 00:54:22.640 Like I said, my recommendation, and we'll get into this 1013 00:54:22.640 --> 00:54:26.440 as we look into these things, flood risk insurance. 1014 00:54:26.440 --> 00:54:30.040 So with climate change and all these natural events things, 1015 00:54:31.000 --> 00:54:34.920 your insurance policies are something to look out for. 1016 00:54:34.920 --> 00:54:39.920 Housing acceleration, income taxes for the middle class 1017 00:54:40.200 --> 00:54:43.520 being brought down slightly, possibly. 1018 00:54:44.680 --> 00:54:47.480 Linking childcare with housing developments. 1019 00:54:47.480 --> 00:54:50.240 I know Jason really wanted to talk about that one. 1020 00:54:51.520 --> 00:54:56.520 Engaging municipalities that make progress on housing first. 1021 00:54:57.440 --> 00:54:58.960 I think that has something to do 1022 00:54:58.960 --> 00:55:00.200 with addressing the NIMBY. 1023 00:55:00.000 --> 00:55:05.920 issue that we talked about and building high-speed rail that connects 1024 00:55:05.920 --> 00:55:10.520 communities between Windsor and Quebec City would have been I don't know how 1025 00:55:10.520 --> 00:55:17.280 much that affects investors other than you know it's a good to invest along a 1026 00:55:17.280 --> 00:55:23.480 rail line and maybe commute some commuter towns would be enhanced but we 1027 00:55:23.480 --> 00:55:28.000 really have about four minutes left in our hour and I wanted to just get a our 1028 00:55:28.000 --> 00:55:33.600 general final thoughts and I think I want to start with Kyle because we 1029 00:55:33.600 --> 00:55:38.280 haven't asked you as much as I wanted to and I think as a lawyer you have a lot 1030 00:55:38.280 --> 00:55:44.080 of insight to bring us on all things government and law so Kyle what are your 1031 00:55:44.080 --> 00:55:49.440 final thoughts on this session you're gonna hate me for this answer but it's a 1032 00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:55.600 massive it depends really I count on you for that yeah no we would count on you 1033 00:55:55.600 --> 00:56:01.000 for that but unfortunately that's the reality these are all promises they are 1034 00:56:01.000 --> 00:56:07.960 not a definitive path or paths that the Liberal government will now be moving 1035 00:56:07.960 --> 00:56:12.400 forward with or or maybe they will but we don't know which are gonna come in 1036 00:56:12.400 --> 00:56:17.400 first and what is gonna happen second we don't know what's gonna happen with our 1037 00:56:17.400 --> 00:56:22.760 neighbors down to the south you know the tariffs are on they're off they're on 1038 00:56:22.760 --> 00:56:29.840 again they're off they're less they're more it it all has a massive impact on 1039 00:56:29.840 --> 00:56:35.080 on exactly what we're gonna be doing I think Harris and I were chatting about a 1040 00:56:35.080 --> 00:56:39.080 week ago or a couple weeks ago saying you know we all thought this was gonna 1041 00:56:39.080 --> 00:56:44.480 be a really good year all the forecasts were interest rates were gonna be going 1042 00:56:44.480 --> 00:56:52.160 down December looks really good in terms of the the future and then everything's 1043 00:56:52.160 --> 00:56:58.400 changed the Canadian election the American influence of the global economy 1044 00:56:58.400 --> 00:57:03.920 and all the impacts on there I think we're very much still in a wait-and-see 1045 00:57:03.920 --> 00:57:09.960 aspect and I would not be surprised to see the market continue to be stagnant 1046 00:57:09.960 --> 00:57:14.680 until there's a little bit more clarity on where things are going except for 1047 00:57:14.680 --> 00:57:18.440 those people that have to renew financing or have to do certain 1048 00:57:18.440 --> 00:57:22.920 transactions I think people who have the time are gonna use it and we're 1049 00:57:22.920 --> 00:57:27.200 gonna see we're gonna see a slower market then I think all of us were 1050 00:57:27.200 --> 00:57:33.200 hoping for this year all right thank you Kyle Harris your your final thoughts I 1051 00:57:33.200 --> 00:57:37.560 don't think I can top that recap there buddy all right well then maybe what do 1052 00:57:37.560 --> 00:57:46.040 we do about he's so much younger in us yeah I don't ramble I think I'll hit it 1053 00:57:46.040 --> 00:57:48.720 on the head I mean it to be frank I mean I think there's so there's still 1054 00:57:48.720 --> 00:57:52.840 it's a lot of what else right now so what what will be the first focus what's 1055 00:57:52.840 --> 00:57:55.920 gonna be the second focus how much is Trump gonna play into this how are we 1056 00:57:55.920 --> 00:58:01.280 gonna calm things down so you know I think you know we have some direction 1057 00:58:01.280 --> 00:58:04.160 now in at least Canada from that perspective but I think there's other 1058 00:58:04.160 --> 00:58:09.400 unknown factors right now that can still play into the excitement we'll call it 1059 00:58:09.400 --> 00:58:14.040 that has impacts in the market and I think that's the unknown piece right now 1060 00:58:14.040 --> 00:58:18.480 as to what's gonna happen in the coming months will you know Carney be able to 1061 00:58:18.480 --> 00:58:21.600 get the entire group together including his peers on the other sides of the 1062 00:58:21.600 --> 00:58:27.100 table to to get things move forward on the agendas and what will be number one 1063 00:58:27.100 --> 00:58:31.840 through five on the agenda as to where they start with but I think certainly you 1064 00:58:31.840 --> 00:58:35.320 know I think as and as investors I think we certainly got it you know look at our 1065 00:58:35.320 --> 00:58:38.040 you know we got to take a look at certainly surrounding ourselves with the 1066 00:58:38.040 --> 00:58:42.480 right people in our circles to ensure we kind of go to them for the right 1067 00:58:42.480 --> 00:58:46.920 guidance and certainly the the discussion points on how we can help 1068 00:58:46.920 --> 00:58:50.440 them move their agendas forward because you don't you're not gonna sit still in 1069 00:58:50.440 --> 00:58:53.400 the next year things are still gonna happen people are still gonna buy two 1070 00:58:53.400 --> 00:58:56.560 people still gonna refinance and people got mortgage renewals coming up so we 1071 00:58:56.560 --> 00:59:00.160 still need to make sure as we think about these things how do we help each 1072 00:59:00.160 --> 00:59:04.240 other in this community move forward and continue to build our real estate wealth 1073 00:59:04.240 --> 00:59:10.840 very well thank you Harris and Jason with so we're at a time for your your 1074 00:59:11.200 --> 00:59:17.640 last thoughts but you are going to be back with us as early as next week 1075 00:59:17.640 --> 00:59:22.960 hosting our next inner circle live with elite aligned coaching and then Harris's 1076 00:59:22.960 --> 00:59:26.320 of course if you look at this calendar here is going to be back with us on the 1077 00:59:26.320 --> 00:59:33.480 27th to discuss self-employed and MLI select financing so seconds of my last 1078 00:59:33.480 --> 00:59:41.040 thoughts Richard okay fine I want to you know what just coach us as investors 1079 00:59:41.040 --> 00:59:46.400 it doesn't matter the government Brandon alluded to this no other government 1080 00:59:46.400 --> 00:59:51.120 tampers more with mortgage laws Harris can attest this housing than the 1081 00:59:51.120 --> 00:59:56.640 Canadian government so it's nothing new as investors you just have to learn to 1082 00:59:56.640 --> 01:00:01.880 pivot and look for opportunity and take advantages 1083 01:00:00.000 --> 01:00:04.900 what's already there. And there are good programs available, funding available 1084 01:00:04.900 --> 01:00:09.420 right now that you can take an opportunity to get advantage of, and 1085 01:00:09.420 --> 01:00:13.500 my thoughts are there'll probably be more to come. So that's where I'll end that. 1086 01:00:13.500 --> 01:00:18.500 All right, well that is a wonderful final thought. So thank you all of you for 1087 01:00:18.500 --> 01:00:25.500 joining us on this very special episode of Inner Circle Live. Thank you for 1088 01:00:25.500 --> 01:00:30.880 indulging me in my lifelong fantasy of reenacting the McLaughlin Group. I don't 1089 01:00:30.880 --> 01:00:34.480 think I lived up to that ridiculous standard. I don't know if anyone even 1090 01:00:34.480 --> 01:00:38.520 gets the reference to the McLaughlin Group. It was an American program, but it 1091 01:00:38.520 --> 01:00:42.800 was it was well ridiculed on Saturday Night Live, so that's good. At any rate, 1092 01:00:42.800 --> 01:00:47.120 thank you for joining us all. I hope to see you all next week on 1093 01:00:47.120 --> 01:00:52.000 Inner Circle Live, and whatever you do and however you feel about the outcome 1094 01:00:52.220 --> 01:00:58.980 of this election, please keep your investing decisions focused on 1095 01:00:58.980 --> 01:01:05.660 the fundamentals and the numbers and the Keyspire community. So thank 1096 01:01:05.660 --> 01:01:10.460 you very much and have a great day. Thanks everyone.