WEBVTT

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Okay.

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Hey,

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how you doing.

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Got my video.

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There we go.

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See, can you see me.

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Yes, I'm sorry I was not able to answer your.

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I didn't get back to you yesterday, and about the thing that you sent. It was very busy day I drove to Colorado 14 hours, and then stopped off see friends for for dinner.

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And then it was just one thing and then all of these people ended up contacting me yesterday and so I'm like trying to get back to everybody etc so anyway, it's good that you set up a time to talk today.

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Yeah, I thought that might be easier.

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Yeah, yeah.

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So, um, did you have anything that you wanted to go over before I jump in.

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I mean,

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did you get my text message yesterday.

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Yeah, you're talking about the video right. Yeah. Did you.

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That's what I was referring to is getting back to you on the on the video. And yes I did watch it. Yes. So, um, the.

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I would. It's one of those things where, because I was already prepared, then I wasn't coming in blind, so I don't know what I would have felt like in the spirit, if I hadn't known.

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But I do know that when that I was not conscious when I saw her a feeling anything, but you know that happens sometimes. So, but I did notice some things like in how she presents herself, it's very.

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And you can just kind of see some things where there's an element of.

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How would you put it.

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What's the word I thought of it yesterday while I was watching it. And of

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insincerity, where it's very.

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I know that she believed what she's saying. So I don't mean insincere like she's lying necessarily, or that she believes that she is.

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There's an element, I think, though, that I don't know even how to how to explain how to explain that so just there's an element in which she's just very, very careful about how she presents herself, and it's it's fake.

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And so that I could catch that I could, I could see.

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And it's very.

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Why can I not think of all of the words I thought of yesterday, I was like oh it's that word and that word and that word when, when I was watching her but anyway it's very, very put together very stilted very stiff.

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And all about presentation and display, etc. The point my point is that that's indication of a lack of sincerity, and that it's not coming from the heart and the spirit of a person.

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It's something that they are trying to present, it's a presentation, etc.

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And it's a takes a lot to keep all of that kind of thing together to keep that together for oneself to keep that together in how one presents oneself etc. So there's an element of a lack of security in her, which is very evident already in the fact that how she

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interacts with you, or interacted with you.

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People try to control other people when they feel extremely insecure.

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So I already knew that. But then to watch it and how she presented herself, and that was interesting, but as far as like being able to see, oh, something.

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And there's a lack of insincerity there.

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And that would make someone kind of think,

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okay, I don't know about all of this.

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I don't know how, it's superficial.

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There you go.

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That's one of the words.

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It's a very superficial

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and just a lack of a depth of substance to it.

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It's like a house of cards.

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Everything just has to be just so in order to work.

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And so she has to work really hard to control things

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to keep the house of cards up, which is what a cult is.

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I mean, that's why you have,

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that's why they require all of the brainwashing, et cetera.

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Is this the house of cards and everything

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just has to be just so in order to keep going.

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I didn't sense like, I don't know how I would have been,

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what I would have felt if I'd been in her presence.

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I don't know what it felt like, you know,

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if I had just watched that video and not known something,

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if I would have felt something,

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I just know that I didn't yesterday,

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but I was already prepared for it,

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but I didn't sense anything.

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But, and then there was something else

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I was gonna say about all of that.

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Cause you were asking, well,

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how would someone be able to see and know

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just seeing someone?

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But I can't think of what it was.

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It's very easy to be drawn in by that kind of a person

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because everything seems sugary sweet.

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I've actually been, and I thought about this yesterday,

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a friend of mine met me on,

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that has become one of my best friends on Facebook.

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She and I met December 27th.

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We remember the day and we connected on Facebook

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and she, and so I went down to Houston to meet her

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and everything.

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And we started chatting over like Facebook and Marco Polo.

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I mean, like every day for,

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we'd send like a 45 minute, hour and a half long,

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like videos on Marco Polo or, you know, Facebook, whatever.

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We really got to know each other

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because we realized there were so many spiritual,

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that we were going through some similar spiritual seasons.

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And, sorry, I'm gonna sneeze.

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Thank you.

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And anyway, I've been down to see her twice

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and she's just precious and we really enjoy each other.

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And the Lord has just given us

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a tremendous gift in each other.

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Well, when I was down there just maybe about a month ago,

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she introduced me to some people that she considers

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to be her spiritual parents.

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And she said, she said,

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oh, she was letting him know how she met me.

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Oh, I met Ashley.

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And she said, when I first saw her on,

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and I first got that video from her on Facebook Messenger,

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she said, she's like, she said it was very suspicious

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because she said, can someone really be that sweet?

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So in other words, there's a reason why, like with her,

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like with Jamie, what's her name, Kimberly,

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why people don't trust it.

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It's because it's very, to usually be like that

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is very insincere.

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Now me, it's just me being me, but I,

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anyway, there was an element of it when I was growing up

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that wasn't, I don't wanna say it wasn't sincere,

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but there was the put on,

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that was another phrase I was thinking of yesterday.

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So it's a bit of a put on.

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There was an element in which, yes, I was,

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it was a bit of a put on for me as well,

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because I, because of the culture that I was in,

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you know, spiritual, social culture,

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you had to be very careful about how you present yourself,

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display yourself in a particular way.

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And so I kind of groomed myself to be accepted

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and to be acceptable.

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And I stifled myself.

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So what came out was this more gentle, more whatever,

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you know, because I was trying to be accepted.

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I was trying to be enough

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and I was trying to be okay with everybody.

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And that eventually though, when I found my true spirit,

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there was an element of that that's still natural

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and et cetera.

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But even me, it wasn't, it was a put on for a while.

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So that was something that my friend,

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when she was seeing me now,

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she's just like, I don't know that I can trust that.

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It doesn't seem real

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because we're used to people like Kimberly

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that we see and we're like, that's not real.

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Because in my point is that people can recognize

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that people can tell when you're being fake.

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People can tell when, when,

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it is that you believe is only going so far and then the rest of it you're having to make up

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in order to convince someone that what it is that you have and what it is that you believe

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really is sincere and also trying to be very gentle and kind of like draw people in.

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My point in saying all of that is it's extremely normal to be drawn in by that.

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It's extremely normal because it feels accepting and it's pulling like gravity and it meets a need

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that we have when there's a wound or there feels like a void or whatever.

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That's all very normal and it's all very natural and I would imagine even though you haven't voiced

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this that you've been concerned like was there some big red flag that I should have caught and

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I didn't and I could be wrong but it sounds that over these past few weeks and I've been listening

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to you talk it sounds like you're trying to self I could be wrong so I'm not stating this over you

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I'm just saying what it is that I was thinking but it sounds like you're trying to self-audit

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like where did I go wrong and I shouldn't have how was I supposed to know better and I didn't

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and I just wanted to assure you that that's that someone like Kimberly meets a need that

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people have to feel loved and accepted and valued and and to be and and to have someone that looks

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like that and acts like that and talks like that to find I don't know some kind to validate us in

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some way and and spend time with us or see things in us if especially if we see something that we

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that we value like oh my goodness if they see me then there must be something like me that I value

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in me too but so that's it's very understandable it's extremely understandable and extremely

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normal what's not normal is the fact that your spirit persisted that is an indication of a very

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sensitive spirit that you had that you were noticing there are certain things that don't

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feel right but then you kept doubting yourself and thinking no that you know that that I that

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thing that's coming about of me that may not be true and I need to realize that I might be a the

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problem and I need to give other people a chance or I need to whatever and so that is a that isn't

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normal that's a sign of extreme spiritual sensitivity but the other thing is very if

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you squelch that because we doubt ourselves and we think that's me being mean to somebody else

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that's me not wanting to give somebody a chance it's me like looking for the problem and a devil

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under a rock and whatever and we start talking ourselves out of it and then so is if we talk

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so that it's very easy to to to um be uh to be drawn to someone like that very normal um that's

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why it's so dangerous because it's normal anyway I just talked a whole whole lot I just wanted to

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give you encouragement that that um that it's extremely understandable and to commend you

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and encourage you that you have something extraordinary in you that you noticed something

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was wrong and to recognize and to acknowledge to yourself that you are not something that in

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someone that doesn't need to be trusted in other words you need to you need to know that you have

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good things in you and you can trust yourself um and anyway so that's a whole bunch of stuff

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so what are your thoughts I appreciate that I think when I first met her my gut said something

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was really off um and I didn't trust it like you said um and I had a whole bunch of people

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in the cult that were like which I didn't know was a cult but let's call it in the group at the

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saying oh she's just because she was really mean to me too at the beginning it wasn't just all

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like that video she's very sweet but she targeted me right away and she was very mean um but she

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said and other people said you know it's because she's willing to be honest with you so that you

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can grow and you can be a better person and you know

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She's taken a particular interest in you because you're a mirror to her and she wants

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For whatever reason like she's targeted you

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And it was like I was this target that was very loved but also like very hated at the same time by her

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You're absolutely right

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Pardon. Yeah, I said you're absolutely right because your spirit was a threat to her all of those other people

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That's why she had to focus on you because you were the biggest threat in the room

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That's interesting because

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one of the activities that they do at the beginning of

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You know this one this when I first met her it was like the second day

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They do this activity where you have to pick a buddy in the group

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But you have to pick somebody who you've had the most judgment against and you have to tell them what your judgment is

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And so this girl

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Right away raised her hand out of this group of like 60 people raised her hand and she walked straight over to me and I

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was the person first person picked and

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Kimberly's like

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Oh, well, I'm not really surprised you picked her

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There are a lot of people in this group that wanted to pick her because of their judgments against her

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basically like how I was this person who was everybody had judgments against so it was in a mean way and

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She's like you just disappointed a lot of people in this group who wanted her as their buddy because they're like so judging me and

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I didn't understand that and then

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She made this girl

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Tell me what my her judgment was and then like stare me down and kind of stand up to me

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Cuz this girl I guess had some insecurities and then once you pick a buddy you're with that person the whole week

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So this girl I liked her. That's the funny thing. I met her at the airport and I was like, oh she's picking me as her

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Buddy, that's awesome. Like I really liked her and then all of a sudden she's telling me like what she doesn't like about me

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And I'm like what but then Kimberly said wow, you just you just stood up to the most powerful woman in the room

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so

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yeah, so what you just said so like

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she

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So she targeted me because because I was a threat to her like one of the activities we did was you you get voted

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By 80 people in the group who all end up giving you money if you win and you have an idea

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and everybody shares their idea and I ended up winning and I won like

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$1,500 or something to spend on my idea and

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She was so livid that I won that because she had no control over it and they all voted for me and I won

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It was called most influential. So basically if you were the most influential person in the room you won and so

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The next phone call I had with her she just ripped me to shreds

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She's like, you know, you're using me. You don't care about me. You just want to get something from me and

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You're she just I can't trust you

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Like who do you think you are just all this stuff like really mean and like, you know

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You walk around like a Barbie doll trying to show people how to live life and you have no idea

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And you're delusional to think that people would ever follow you for anything and just mean right?

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but then she would say, you know, I'm only doing this because I love you and I want you to see the truth about who

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you are and and so

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That kind of stuff happened to a smaller degree when I first met her

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but she also roped me in with things like, you know, not letting me go on the

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Zipline I told you that story. Yeah, like weird stuff like that like just strange setups

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And then I told you how I talked to a woman who worked with her like ten years ago who was telling me she was

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Like the most dangerous woman she's ever met. I told you that

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That Kimberly is I?

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Don't think so. Okay, so

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So this woman she actually coaches people at Bethel

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Okay, and she worked with Kimberly years ago and she's very discerning and she knew something was really off about Kimberly

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And she didn't

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she went to the owner of the company at the time and told him and

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He kind of ignored it and then he died and when he died Kimberly took the company over

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She manipulated everybody and ended up getting the company including his wife. And so this woman sent up

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first time I talked to her because a friend of mine was

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Coaching with her and she's like you should talk to Santa like she can give you a lot of insight

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This is when I was still in some confusion and and so she said because I said well

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I don't understand does she really love people and she's just

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Hurting inside so she hurts people out of this brokenness inside her

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but she really does want to help people or is she a narcissistic sociopath who

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Really is out to hurt people because she's so broken

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And she said well, I choose my words very carefully and I I don't say this lightly

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She's like I've worked with human traffickers, I've counseled people who've been pedophiles who've done these awful things

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And she said, Kimberly's the most dangerous person I've ever met.

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And because of the mind control she can have over people and she said I would put her on the same level as Jim Jones.

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And you know Jim Jones like the Jonestown thing.

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So, I mean, in some ways I got taken by one of the best so that's, you know, I didn't just fall for anything. And at the same time, I can see that because that the insincerity that you're picking up.

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That's what's so difficult for me because part of me wants to believe it was sincere because to think that somebody like actually purposely took advantage of me like that, and didn't care.

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It's a lot harder to believe, then.

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I don't know it's just harder to believe than she actually did and.

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Believe or harder to accept. I'm trying to figure out what you're saying, probably harder to accept because I, I didn't.

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Because I, I was sincere, it's like, it's like if you and I, you know, developed more and more of a friendship over like a year, year and a half and we hung out a lot and I visited you you visited me and we had this really deep friendship and then all of a sudden

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I realized that I was the whole time just pulling the wool over your eyes like totally fake like just manipulating you to try to get something from you or whatever.

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How messed up that would feel after believing for a while that this person was sincere, you know.

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So, I think I'm still feeling hurt about that. And the fact that I still am heard about it after.

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I haven't talked to her now for, you know, two or three months so it's been a little while, but we have kept in contact, not that people know that because I haven't told anybody, but we had kept in contact because I was trying for a little while to see

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if it was possible to heal the relationship, and, you know, get on the same page, but it wasn't.

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I tried.

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And I think this is very set in her ways, and I don't let I don't let people into my life, just to let them go very easily. I, I care about people who are in my life and I tend to have my friendships for a long time.

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And so it hurts me that it couldn't be worked out, and that I did care about her and that she really didn't care and that's hard and the fact that she is a cult leader, really at the end of the day, and she pulls people in like that all the time like everyone

256
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who told me she was just loving me and helping me these are all people who are indoctrinated right.

257
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And they all fall for it too. So it's I know it's not just me I only fell for it because everyone else had and they were all convincing me that what I was feeling was wrong, because I was very adamant that first day that she's like projecting she is.

258
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And I told this to the other woman who worked with her who ended up telling her and then in front of the whole group she like attacked me about it.

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But I said I feel like she's projecting I feel like she's using transference from something in her past on to me and I said it doesn't feel right the way she's treating me isn't right.

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But she ended up winning me over and I feel kind of duped, I feel like, like you said like why couldn't I see it, I saw it, but why didn't I trust myself and what you said to me in one of our other calls has stuck with me about me needing to learn to trust myself more which I have been stepping into lately.

261
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Yeah.

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But I guess I'm just obviously still kind of hurt by it, and

263
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I don't know there's still like emotions around it for me.

264
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Yeah.

265
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Well, you gave a lot of yourself to that relationship. I mean the very you know so that it's hard when someone isn't sincere and, and that they're using you.

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Well, understand.

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I don't think that these things are quite as cut and dry, maybe as we make them out to be in order to try to understand them.

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Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, if you imagine that there was an element of sincerity from her, you know, and, and that you did mean something to her, but in this love hate relationship that she had, because of her own insecurity, and the fact that you were her greatest threat.

269
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and she just would use you for purposes

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and that's what the sincerity part was

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and then the insincerity part.

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So it was all for her purposes,

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including the sincerity that fed her in some way.

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And then the insincerity that, again, what fed her.

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So it's like whatever it is that fed her,

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whether it be her being sincere or her not being sincere.

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And so I'm sure that there was some sincerity

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mixed in there, but anyway.

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But here's my biggest point that I wanna make

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is what is so hard about these things

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is that in the fact that you're like,

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oh my goodness, what if she wasn't sincere

283
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and then her not being sincere

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is something that's really hard for me to receive

285
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because I was sincere and et cetera.

286
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So it makes us feel very vulnerable.

287
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And here's the thing, and here's what I recommend

288
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that you walk through with the Lord,

289
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that there is an element of,

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a tremendous element of your deep self

291
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that you gave her in your relationship.

292
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And that's what being vulnerable in a relationship is.

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I mean, we do it with our husbands,

294
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we obviously do it with children,

295
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friends, parents, whatever.

296
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And so when we're being that vulnerable and that open

297
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of like, here it is that I, here I am,

298
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how will you accept me like this?

299
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Then it's very hard,

300
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it's especially hard when they don't accept it

301
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and receive it.

302
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But when they've taken something to go a step further,

303
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when they've taken the vulnerable aspects

304
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of who it is that they are,

305
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and there's an element of it that we give them,

306
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that they then control

307
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whether they're doing it for good purposes

308
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or for malicious ones, which for her would be,

309
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I don't know that it sounds like from everything

310
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that it's probably very, very intentionally malicious.

311
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I mean, it's malicious period.

312
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I was thinking about like the intentionality

313
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and I know that some of it was,

314
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it just makes me very nervous to declare something

315
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over someone that I don't know.

316
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It's all of this.

317
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So anyway, I'm just trying to spiritually be conscientious

318
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of like declaring things

319
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and not declaring things over people,

320
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but this is what it sounds like to me.

321
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So you can just take this and bounce this off of your spirit

322
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and bounce this off the Lord.

323
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But anyway, in having given yourself,

324
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there's an element of a very,

325
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like a very deep place that she was given control

326
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and authority over.

327
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And y'all have separated now in your friendship,

328
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but there's still that open area

329
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or that place that she's had access to,

330
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that she was given authority to

331
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and spiritually that's extremely significant.

332
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Now, it doesn't mean that you're not the Lord's

333
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and that he can overcome it.

334
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The point is that's why you're feeling like that.

335
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And it is an actual problem.

336
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It meaning like it's something that,

337
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because it's a problem, that's why you feel that way.

338
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And God's like, God's very jealous of you.

339
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And he's like, no, no, no.

340
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I gave that part of you to you and me, period.

341
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I have access to it.

342
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You know, the Lord, I have access to it

343
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and you have access to it and nobody else.

344
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And so what I recommend that you do

345
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is to go through a process with the Lord to declare,

346
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because you have a right to declare it

347
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because it's yours, no one else's.

348
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So you don't have to ask God to do this.

349
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You have the right because you own it.

350
00:28:57.520 --> 00:29:02.520
You have the right to declare that it's to take it back.

351
00:29:02.840 --> 00:29:06.280
You declare that, you know, whatever that,

352
00:29:06.280 --> 00:29:08.760
that, you know, you can ask the Lord to,

353
00:29:09.280 --> 00:29:14.280
to, you know, for forgiveness.

354
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And by that, I don't mean we need to be like

355
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groveling in remorse.

356
00:29:19.040 --> 00:29:19.880
I don't mean that.

357
00:29:19.880 --> 00:29:22.040
I just mean like, you know, Lord, you know,

358
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I didn't know to protect myself like that.

359
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And will you forgive me for not,

360
00:29:27.200 --> 00:29:30.080
for not knowing to protect myself in that situation,

361
00:29:30.080 --> 00:29:32.440
for not knowing to protect myself to that degree

362
00:29:32.440 --> 00:29:35.320
for not actually doing it, Lord.

363
00:29:35.320 --> 00:29:37.960
You know, I was a, I was a child.

364
00:29:38.000 --> 00:29:39.760
I didn't, I had innocence.

365
00:29:39.760 --> 00:29:41.400
I didn't know.

366
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And would you, you know, would you wipe that clean?

367
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And I declare according to the authority

368
00:29:46.840 --> 00:29:49.680
that you've given me that I take anything

369
00:29:49.680 --> 00:29:51.800
that I have given her access to.

370
00:29:51.800 --> 00:29:53.840
Anything of myself that I opened up to her,

371
00:29:53.840 --> 00:29:56.600
anything that I gave her the authority to,

372
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to take or to have or to have access to or whatever,

373
00:29:59.360 --> 00:30:00.200
Lord, I take it.

374
00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:04.320
it all back. And I declare that according to your words, that it

375
00:30:04.720 --> 00:30:09.120
only I have ownership, and only you have ownership, and only you

376
00:30:09.320 --> 00:30:12.760
have access to that part of my life, and that aspect of who it

377
00:30:12.760 --> 00:30:17.360
is that I am, and pull it all back. So all of these things are

378
00:30:17.360 --> 00:30:21.040
spiritual. And because you're a spiritual being, that's how

379
00:30:21.080 --> 00:30:23.160
that's what you're, you're feeling, you're feeling

380
00:30:23.160 --> 00:30:25.800
something's, something's not right. Now, she didn't have

381
00:30:25.800 --> 00:30:29.600
access to your spirit, because that's spirit, but aspects of

382
00:30:29.600 --> 00:30:33.600
the soul, you know, that were just like, you know, he's very

383
00:30:33.600 --> 00:30:37.200
jealous. And he's like, Nope, that is yours in mind. No one

384
00:30:37.200 --> 00:30:40.840
else has a lot of access to it. You didn't know. You didn't know

385
00:30:40.840 --> 00:30:45.360
that she was not a safe place. And, you know, it's important

386
00:30:45.360 --> 00:30:49.080
for us to be open and to be vulnerable to our spouses and

387
00:30:49.080 --> 00:30:53.520
etc. But when we're when we're when we believe that we can have

388
00:30:53.520 --> 00:30:56.000
access to it, that we can be that vulnerable with somebody

389
00:30:56.000 --> 00:30:58.920
else's friendships and relationships or whatever. And

390
00:30:58.920 --> 00:31:02.480
we end up giving more than we realize that God wants us to.

391
00:31:03.240 --> 00:31:06.040
And that God intends us to, well, then we'll all we have to

392
00:31:06.040 --> 00:31:11.600
do is just claim it back. I actually went through very

393
00:31:11.600 --> 00:31:14.880
interesting timing. I'm telling you what a lot of the Lord has

394
00:31:15.160 --> 00:31:20.040
has been preparing for this conversation. I just had to walk

395
00:31:20.040 --> 00:31:24.800
through this with someone else last night, that there I had

396
00:31:24.800 --> 00:31:30.480
become aware that there were ways in which I had given

397
00:31:30.480 --> 00:31:35.040
someone else potential access to things of myself, my deep self

398
00:31:35.040 --> 00:31:39.000
that I didn't know I had given them access to. I didn't know

399
00:31:39.000 --> 00:31:45.400
that. They knew it, but I didn't. And so they had. So I

400
00:31:45.520 --> 00:31:48.920
asked the Lord for forgiveness. I said, Lord, I understand, you

401
00:31:48.920 --> 00:31:53.200
know, you know, that I was I was innocent. I was naive. I didn't

402
00:31:53.200 --> 00:31:55.760
mean to do this. I didn't know I needed to be protecting

403
00:31:55.760 --> 00:31:58.200
myself. I didn't know I wasn't protect. I wasn't protecting

404
00:31:58.200 --> 00:32:01.800
myself. And I just ask Lord that you accept and receive my

405
00:32:01.800 --> 00:32:05.920
sincerity. And, you know, and which obviously does, but, you

406
00:32:05.920 --> 00:32:08.120
know, I'm just kind of walking my soul through it to the whole

407
00:32:08.120 --> 00:32:10.480
process of like what it is that I believe in what it is I'm

408
00:32:10.480 --> 00:32:13.360
doing. And I just claimed, Lord, I take it all back. And I

409
00:32:13.360 --> 00:32:17.000
declared that that is only mine. And that that is only yours. And

410
00:32:17.000 --> 00:32:21.480
only you have access to that part of me. So anyway, I just

411
00:32:21.480 --> 00:32:26.000
did that last night. I wouldn't have if I had answered your

412
00:32:26.000 --> 00:32:29.720
question yesterday via text, I wouldn't have it all of that

413
00:32:29.720 --> 00:32:34.200
happened after it happened like late last night. And I would not

414
00:32:34.200 --> 00:32:35.880
have been able to

415
00:32:38.280 --> 00:32:44.240
recognize and what God wouldn't have had a

416
00:32:45.720 --> 00:32:49.960
a point of reference for me to have this type of conversation

417
00:32:50.640 --> 00:32:53.880
to this level where, you know, you're saying, why do I feel

418
00:32:53.880 --> 00:32:57.160
like this? But because of what he walked me through personally

419
00:32:57.160 --> 00:33:01.000
last night, you started talking and, and at first I was like,

420
00:33:01.000 --> 00:33:03.840
well, that's interesting. I wonder, you know, wonder, Lord,

421
00:33:04.200 --> 00:33:06.880
what is going on? Because I was just, you know, my spirit just

422
00:33:06.880 --> 00:33:08.800
talks to the Lord when when clients talk to me, I'm like,

423
00:33:08.800 --> 00:33:11.160
okay, Lord, you know, what is it that they need? And, and

424
00:33:11.160 --> 00:33:15.680
whatever. And, and, boom, that one, he just put that in my

425
00:33:15.680 --> 00:33:19.640
experience. And I just felt like that's what was going on. So

426
00:33:19.640 --> 00:33:23.160
anyway, I want you to know, the background so that you'll, you'll

427
00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:27.960
feel and you'll understand God, God loves you, and is, and is

428
00:33:27.960 --> 00:33:33.640
preparing for you, preparing for you to have what you need when

429
00:33:33.640 --> 00:33:34.080
you need it.

430
00:33:35.960 --> 00:33:39.400
What, what was the catalyst for you to figure out that that's

431
00:33:39.400 --> 00:33:40.520
what was happening with you?

432
00:33:41.680 --> 00:33:46.680
Honestly, it was a friend of mine who noticed. And because

433
00:33:47.640 --> 00:33:52.480
it was a friend that I have given, how would you say it,

434
00:33:53.440 --> 00:33:58.080
that I look to for that I bounce a lot of spiritual questions

435
00:33:58.080 --> 00:34:01.880
off of, and there's somebody that has gone further down the

436
00:34:01.880 --> 00:34:05.480
journey, the spiritual path that I that the Lord has been

437
00:34:05.480 --> 00:34:09.360
shining light on, you know, rest, and, and all of that. And

438
00:34:09.360 --> 00:34:12.120
they're further down than I am, they've walked with the Lord

439
00:34:12.120 --> 00:34:14.560
longer and in a greater depth and a greater measure than I

440
00:34:14.679 --> 00:34:19.440
have. So they happen to be in the same situation with me. And

441
00:34:19.440 --> 00:34:22.239
what they did, what I didn't know is they were aware that

442
00:34:22.239 --> 00:34:25.280
this and this was like a few weeks ago, they were aware that

443
00:34:25.280 --> 00:34:30.840
this was a possibility about this person. But I, but I didn't

444
00:34:30.840 --> 00:34:34.520
so I didn't know we were there together with this person. And

445
00:34:34.520 --> 00:34:38.920
so my friend was there to see, okay, let's see if what I'm

446
00:34:38.920 --> 00:34:41.600
thinking and what I've been sensing about this person,

447
00:34:41.600 --> 00:34:45.719
what's going on really is true. But I didn't know that they were

448
00:34:45.719 --> 00:34:49.440
done. So they were doing I'm just like, Oh, apparently, this

449
00:34:49.440 --> 00:34:52.679
is just what we're supposed to do. And then I get into that. I

450
00:34:52.679 --> 00:34:56.280
didn't know that I was giving somebody access to something.

451
00:34:57.080 --> 00:35:00.040
And it was all very, it's all very Christian, godly and what

452
00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:05.880
In fact, my friend mentioned, Hey, it mentioned, Hey, you know what, this, this person that

453
00:35:05.880 --> 00:35:11.440
did this, they're like, they're not, he, um, my friend said, I do not believe that they

454
00:35:11.440 --> 00:35:18.280
have any malicious intent whatsoever, but I personally believe that that's not something

455
00:35:18.280 --> 00:35:22.480
in you and in me that they should have access to.

456
00:35:22.480 --> 00:35:28.360
So he said from their perspective, and he said, you know, I believe that, you know,

457
00:35:28.360 --> 00:35:34.120
this friend is, is that, that this person's greatly loved to the Lord and is, um, and

458
00:35:34.120 --> 00:35:35.120
everything.

459
00:35:35.120 --> 00:35:41.880
Um, but, uh, and, uh, that they do, uh, amazing things and they have tremendous treasure,

460
00:35:41.880 --> 00:35:47.560
um, uh, and are, and are given the risk, uh, tremendous response, spiritual responsibility

461
00:35:47.560 --> 00:35:53.000
from the Lord, but there's something that they think is right and okay.

462
00:35:53.000 --> 00:35:55.480
And my friend was like, I don't believe that it is.

463
00:35:55.480 --> 00:36:01.320
And so, so they watched me, um, through this thing anyway.

464
00:36:01.320 --> 00:36:03.720
Um, I was like, Oh, wow.

465
00:36:03.720 --> 00:36:09.820
I, I didn't know that that person still, you know, wonderful and sweet and whatever they

466
00:36:09.820 --> 00:36:11.720
had no malicious intent.

467
00:36:11.720 --> 00:36:18.080
Um, my, my other friend believes, um, and, and so we just lifted them up before the Lord

468
00:36:18.080 --> 00:36:24.640
and we're like, okay, well you are, um, you know, you love them and they are at a, one

469
00:36:24.800 --> 00:36:29.800
of my, um, brothers in Christ and, uh, brother, sister in Christ.

470
00:36:29.800 --> 00:36:34.840
Um, but I don't believe that what they walked me through was accurate.

471
00:36:34.840 --> 00:36:39.080
And I was the one who gave them the authority, even though I didn't know it.

472
00:36:39.080 --> 00:36:44.800
So I'm, I'm, I'm the one who takes it back so that I can still be around that other person,

473
00:36:44.800 --> 00:36:45.800
you know, I can do whatever.

474
00:36:45.800 --> 00:36:47.240
I just need to be aware.

475
00:36:47.240 --> 00:36:48.240
Okay.

476
00:36:48.240 --> 00:36:49.240
You know, whatever.

477
00:36:49.240 --> 00:36:53.280
But see, understand they weren't being malicious, right?

478
00:36:53.280 --> 00:36:59.960
Was it just, just a weird question, but does, does this person that you're talking about

479
00:36:59.960 --> 00:37:04.400
have anything to do with you being back in Colorado and going up to this place in the

480
00:37:04.400 --> 00:37:05.400
mountains?

481
00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:06.400
No, totally unrelated.

482
00:37:06.400 --> 00:37:07.400
Completely unrelated.

483
00:37:07.400 --> 00:37:08.400
Yeah.

484
00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:09.400
Yeah.

485
00:37:09.400 --> 00:37:15.400
In fact, in fact, that person wasn't even, um, uh, I need, well, hard to, hard to describe.

486
00:37:15.400 --> 00:37:16.400
Anyway.

487
00:37:16.400 --> 00:37:17.400
No, no, no connection whatsoever.

488
00:37:17.400 --> 00:37:18.400
Yeah.

489
00:37:18.400 --> 00:37:19.400
Okay.

490
00:37:19.400 --> 00:37:25.240
Um, no, I appreciate you sharing that because yeah, that's, that's good that you had somebody

491
00:37:25.240 --> 00:37:26.560
kind of recognize it.

492
00:37:26.560 --> 00:37:33.160
And the person who, who did this, did she like, was she just kind of trying to, trying

493
00:37:33.160 --> 00:37:37.480
to get to know you and trying to speak over you and be like, kind of in the spirit with

494
00:37:37.480 --> 00:37:40.240
you, but then it just wasn't like accurate.

495
00:37:40.240 --> 00:37:46.200
Like I'm trying to get a picture of kind of what she, what she said so that not that you

496
00:37:46.200 --> 00:37:50.480
have to tell me specifics, but I'm just kind of curious, like what, what was she doing

497
00:37:50.480 --> 00:37:58.040
exactly that was kind of looked at as not being right or not being good for you or whatever

498
00:37:58.040 --> 00:37:59.040
it was?

499
00:37:59.040 --> 00:38:13.080
Um, well, it's, it's hard to, it's, it's hard to, it's hard to describe, you know, and no,

500
00:38:13.080 --> 00:38:14.600
they, they, it was okay.

501
00:38:14.600 --> 00:38:16.200
So let me just say it like this.

502
00:38:16.200 --> 00:38:17.200
It was very general.

503
00:38:17.200 --> 00:38:20.400
It was very general to an entire room.

504
00:38:20.400 --> 00:38:25.800
It wasn't me specifically that person actually doesn't even know me, but it was just something

505
00:38:25.800 --> 00:38:34.240
that they were spiritually believing that they were encouraging people in and, um, to,

506
00:38:34.240 --> 00:38:36.080
to agree with and whatever.

507
00:38:36.080 --> 00:38:46.160
Well, by agreeing to it, it, um, there, it was, it was each of those people by agreeing

508
00:38:46.160 --> 00:38:51.640
to it, giving it was giving them access.

509
00:38:51.640 --> 00:38:56.520
So it's like, if I was standing in a group of people explaining, you know what, I think

510
00:38:56.520 --> 00:39:02.600
I, I think God put the coronavirus on the planet to, you know, wipe out the population

511
00:39:02.600 --> 00:39:05.560
and everyone's and I'm getting everyone to agree with me type of thing.

512
00:39:05.560 --> 00:39:06.560
And it's totally wrong.

513
00:39:06.560 --> 00:39:07.560
Is that kind of the idea?

514
00:39:07.560 --> 00:39:15.200
Not that that's what she said, but well, um, uh, the, it wasn't just talking.

515
00:39:15.200 --> 00:39:19.520
It was the, we had to, we had to do some actions.

516
00:39:19.520 --> 00:39:22.760
None of the actions were bad.

517
00:39:22.760 --> 00:39:27.560
That was not from, it was just like, we just, we all just had, so it's not just an agreement.

518
00:39:27.560 --> 00:39:33.840
It was like, you then had to act on the agreement and, um, uh, and they, it was all stuff that

519
00:39:33.840 --> 00:39:40.000
I've done before, you know, it's also all very normal and, and godly things, but doing

520
00:39:40.000 --> 00:39:50.560
it under there, um, under there, not instruction guidance, maybe, I don't know, was, um, was

521
00:39:50.560 --> 00:39:59.800
that making, um, was giving them access because I'm following their guidance.

522
00:39:59.800 --> 00:40:00.000
That is.

523
00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:06.560
giving them the authority. That's the problem. So it's not like being in the room. I was, I was,

524
00:40:06.560 --> 00:40:14.640
you know, I was subject to it. No, I have to actionably, I have to agree and, and step out

525
00:40:14.640 --> 00:40:21.760
on the fact that I believe this is true. And then, but it's in agreement with someone else.

526
00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:26.720
It's not, if I had just done it on my own, if I just like, oh, well, because I didn't do those

527
00:40:26.720 --> 00:40:31.280
things. I don't, I interact with the Lord, you know, that way on my own, but this was like

528
00:40:32.080 --> 00:40:38.720
doing it in agreement with this other person. And then like, uh, that was the, it was like this,

529
00:40:38.720 --> 00:40:42.720
this partnering of, Hey, let's do this together. Instead of you doing it on your own with the

530
00:40:42.720 --> 00:40:48.480
Lord and you doing it on your own. Okay. This wasn't it, but it's kind of like praying with

531
00:40:48.480 --> 00:40:53.040
someone or whatever is that this person and I were praying together as opposed to me praying

532
00:40:53.040 --> 00:40:57.120
to the Lord and then praying to the Lord. And then the two of us praying to the Lord together,

533
00:40:57.120 --> 00:41:02.080
it was that kind of thing. And they were leading the prayer. And I was like, oh, okay. Yeah, Lord,

534
00:41:02.080 --> 00:41:08.400
you know, we're here together for that. That was the agreement because we were coming together to

535
00:41:08.400 --> 00:41:12.560
the Lord. That's why when husband and wife pray together to the Lord is so it's so significant,

536
00:41:12.560 --> 00:41:16.160
you know, it's two people coming together, et cetera. So me doing it with that. There's

537
00:41:16.160 --> 00:41:19.600
this other person where they were like leading the prayer, guiding prayer, whatever. And me

538
00:41:19.680 --> 00:41:26.080
in agreement with them, um, uh, with what it is that they were saying, um, thinking,

539
00:41:26.080 --> 00:41:29.600
oh, they're further down the path than me to do that. You know, maybe there's things I need to

540
00:41:29.600 --> 00:41:36.080
learn to know. And there was no way for me to, for me to know, unless the Lord had prompted,

541
00:41:36.080 --> 00:41:41.280
um, my spirit about something, um, the Lord prompted my friends spirit, a couple of my

542
00:41:41.280 --> 00:41:45.200
friends spirits about it. I did not know that until last night. And so when they brought it

543
00:41:45.200 --> 00:41:49.200
up, it was like, oh, I didn't know that was something I needed to be thinking about. I

544
00:41:49.200 --> 00:41:56.560
didn't know there's something, you know, whatever. So interesting. And, and yeah, I mean, sometimes

545
00:41:56.560 --> 00:42:00.800
something, I don't know if this is your experience, but just kind of something that I thought of when

546
00:42:00.800 --> 00:42:06.640
you were talking is sometimes something can be so close to the truth and it can feel so aligned in

547
00:42:06.640 --> 00:42:12.080
the moment. And, but it's just a little bit off the mark, right? It's almost like the bullseye,

548
00:42:12.320 --> 00:42:15.680
and there's the market mill. It's just a little bit to the right or the left, right? But

549
00:42:16.320 --> 00:42:22.400
it's so close that it seems. Yeah. That's how Satan gets us. If it's too far off, he know it

550
00:42:22.400 --> 00:42:30.160
won't work. That's, that's exactly what happened to me because, and I, I, in a similar, like I let

551
00:42:30.160 --> 00:42:35.680
her in because she was mentoring me. She was coached me. She was somebody I looked to for

552
00:42:35.680 --> 00:42:42.080
guidance on purpose because she had all this wisdom. She seemed so much further along the

553
00:42:42.080 --> 00:42:47.840
path than me, mostly because she, you know, talked about it and the way she acted. It seemed like she,

554
00:42:48.800 --> 00:42:52.560
like, honestly, when I experienced her for the first time, I don't know if I told you this or

555
00:42:52.560 --> 00:42:57.200
not, it's kind of scary to say it, but she reminded me of like what Jesus would be like

556
00:42:57.200 --> 00:43:04.320
if he was walking. Okay. And that's, that's pretty freaky because she reminded me of that and I

557
00:43:04.320 --> 00:43:11.760
didn't catch it at the time, but I was like, she must be so much closer to, you know, him than I

558
00:43:11.760 --> 00:43:19.920
am because spiritually she's so like in tune and grounded and like joyful. And she had these soft

559
00:43:19.920 --> 00:43:26.720
eyes. Like I feel like he would have had just with love. And I bought into all of it and really

560
00:43:26.720 --> 00:43:32.480
believed that she was like the epitome of kind of who I would be if I was the closest to God as

561
00:43:32.480 --> 00:43:39.600
possible. And that this company, this group, their teachings were going to kind of save the world.

562
00:43:39.600 --> 00:43:44.800
And because they were Christians, it was from this biblical Christian perspective. And I was like,

563
00:43:44.800 --> 00:43:50.240
this is so perfect. I'm going to work for them. I'm going to spread this seed and like help their

564
00:43:50.240 --> 00:43:55.360
ministry. It's not a ministry, but that's kind of like what I thought of it as. And so I like,

565
00:43:55.360 --> 00:44:02.000
she was in my life like daily. And I was going to her at the end, like for every little decision.

566
00:44:02.000 --> 00:44:09.920
And I mean, I think I told you about the, how she even had like a way of controlling my sex life.

567
00:44:09.920 --> 00:44:17.600
Did I tell you about that? No. Oh my God. She, um, like my husband and I have struggled in that

568
00:44:17.600 --> 00:44:25.280
area of intimacy. I've, I've, I had my own stuff when we got married that like came up right away

569
00:44:25.280 --> 00:44:34.560
and it was pretty awful. Um, so she knew a lot about the history of us and how I was struggling

570
00:44:34.560 --> 00:44:39.600
and how it was something I really wanted to work on. And so in one of the programs we did, we could

571
00:44:39.600 --> 00:44:46.880
make a goal about, you know, an intimacy goal. So I was like, okay, my intimacy goal is going to be

572
00:44:46.880 --> 00:44:52.320
that sort of in this time period, we end up like sleeping together this many times because it's

573
00:44:52.320 --> 00:44:57.040
something we struggled with. And I knew I needed to take initiative and action on it because I was

574
00:44:57.040 --> 00:45:00.000
too scared. And she knew all that. And she approved.

575
00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:13.000
Well, when we went away for the first for the first weekend with all the other people, the 80 other people, we were all thinking of our goals and I had this one goal, we'd had a conversation a couple days before about it.

576
00:45:13.000 --> 00:45:17.000
And then that weekend she stood up in front of the whole group.

577
00:45:17.000 --> 00:45:30.000
And she started explaining why, like, somebody in the group has a goal around having sex, and that is, we're not going to be doing that we're not allowed to do that.

578
00:45:30.000 --> 00:45:40.000
And she basically completely kiboshed it in front of the whole group about me I went and talked to her about it afterwards and I was like why didn't you just tell me that personally.

579
00:45:40.000 --> 00:45:55.000
And she didn't really have a real reason for not telling me personally personally it was almost like this amazing display of grandiosity around, you know, we don't want it to come back on us, if you know something happened like it was so silly it was with my

580
00:45:55.000 --> 00:46:09.000
And so basically it was her way of at least what I've been told by the therapists I've worked with that was like her one of another ways of her controlling me and controlling my marriage because the more I moved away from Jason and

581
00:46:26.000 --> 00:46:36.000
Oh, there you are. Okay, you were frozen. Yeah, the last thing was the more that you moved away from Jason, then I didn't hear anything.

582
00:46:36.000 --> 00:46:54.000
Okay, the more I moved away from him the closer I would move to her and the more likely I would need to quit my family and go and work for her. And she and I were very close by that point and she she just kept pulling me in more and more and I kept following because I saw her as an authority.

583
00:46:55.000 --> 00:47:12.000
And I saw the company as a company that I wanted to help spread the word about. And so, when I, I ended up choosing a different goal. And then later on, you know, things got better between him and I in the intimacy area and I told her and she did not even

584
00:47:12.000 --> 00:47:20.000
sound happy about it like she just, she's like, Oh, that's good like just very.

585
00:47:20.000 --> 00:47:36.000
I don't know it was weird and so just even little things like that the amount of control that she had over me physically, even like just the way she physically was around me was very controlling like you can't really explain it you would have had to probably experience

586
00:47:36.000 --> 00:47:42.000
it but lots of touching lots of, you know, just weird.

587
00:47:42.000 --> 00:47:50.000
And just felt like it was all consuming like it was just this person who I thought was so amazing who I thought was going to help me.

588
00:47:51.000 --> 00:48:16.000
And indirectly she helped me because God helped me overcome the damage that was done, but I gave her permission to come in and like come into my heart come into my soul I guess and manipulate things how she saw fit because I believed that she knew she knew best or she had the answers.

589
00:48:16.000 --> 00:48:18.000
So,

590
00:48:18.000 --> 00:48:22.000
yeah.

591
00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:24.000
And,

592
00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:40.000
yeah that that's interesting you know trying for her trying to get even into, because in order to control person you have to get, you know, down deep, and one of the elements of that is is intimacy and what's the deepest intimacy that you can have another person, you know, with

593
00:48:41.000 --> 00:48:49.000
So, yeah, that that's definitely that definitely makes sense it's interesting that you talked about the fact of like she would try to physically control.

594
00:48:49.000 --> 00:48:57.000
So, I've got about some ideas about what that can, what that can look like in a situation I definitely understand.

595
00:48:57.000 --> 00:49:17.000
So, but it, it, again, because there are an opening oneself up to someone else and giving them, you know, authority or access or whatever certain parts, there's connections, and there's still connections between the two of y'all.

596
00:49:17.000 --> 00:49:29.000
So, which is why it's like this. And, and I know that you don't that you don't think about, about this all the time or anything and think about the calls and think about her all of the time.

597
00:49:29.000 --> 00:49:38.000
And I think that if there's still such a, there's still such a, such a hurt. There's still such a,

598
00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:54.000
I don't know, a level, a certain level of focus, then it's indication that there are connections that are made in sometimes I've heard of people, you know, they can be referred to as soul ties that you heard of soul ties.

599
00:49:54.000 --> 00:50:00.000
So it's soul ties and stuff. And those can develop from being very vulnerable to someone else and being.

600
00:50:00.000 --> 00:50:05.860
vulnerable at such deep levels. And, um, uh, so, uh, I, again,

601
00:50:05.860 --> 00:50:09.180
I recommend that you go to the Lord and, and, you know,

602
00:50:09.180 --> 00:50:11.540
and declare because you have the right to,

603
00:50:12.260 --> 00:50:15.780
that those things are broken and that they have no more control over you.

604
00:50:16.020 --> 00:50:21.020
She has no access to that, any agreements that you've made or whatever. Um,

605
00:50:21.060 --> 00:50:24.140
and I'm not trying to make this all sound like complicated.

606
00:50:24.380 --> 00:50:27.780
I'm just trying to give you the concept and then you just take that concept and

607
00:50:27.780 --> 00:50:29.980
go to the Lord. And it's actually very, very easy.

608
00:50:30.900 --> 00:50:34.880
What's important is that we have the intentionality and we understand what it

609
00:50:34.880 --> 00:50:36.180
is we're intending to do,

610
00:50:36.180 --> 00:50:40.020
that there are connections and we're trying to break them regardless of what

611
00:50:40.020 --> 00:50:44.500
they look like and how they happened. And the fact that this, the,

612
00:50:44.700 --> 00:50:47.860
the access authority connections,

613
00:50:48.060 --> 00:50:52.980
whatever that create push pull, you know, that, that you've,

614
00:50:53.620 --> 00:50:56.820
um, and, uh, they allow someone visibility even,

615
00:50:57.580 --> 00:51:00.900
um, to, to see and to, because depending on the,

616
00:51:01.060 --> 00:51:05.660
to see into that all of those things are broken and that everything is closed

617
00:51:05.860 --> 00:51:11.180
and, um, that no one else has, has that, that access to you. Um,

618
00:51:11.740 --> 00:51:14.780
or something I was going to say about that, about her. Um,

619
00:51:16.660 --> 00:51:17.500
what was it?

620
00:51:17.740 --> 00:51:21.340
Well, you're thinking of that. I'll tell you. Um, yeah,

621
00:51:21.340 --> 00:51:25.900
I researched soul ties because I wondered about something like that.

622
00:51:25.980 --> 00:51:30.700
And I've definitely agree that there is a soul tie that I've been,

623
00:51:31.100 --> 00:51:35.740
you know, slowly breaking over time. It's been hard. Um, I think,

624
00:51:35.780 --> 00:51:39.060
I think what was probably the hardest in the end was I told you about that

625
00:51:39.060 --> 00:51:43.340
podcast I did on forgiveness kind of.

626
00:51:43.660 --> 00:51:47.420
She, I don't remember that one. Okay. I mean, you tell me about them.

627
00:51:48.100 --> 00:51:51.220
I did a podcast on forgiveness and my friend, um,

628
00:51:51.580 --> 00:51:55.780
she's like a big influencer on Instagram and stuff. And so she asked me,

629
00:51:55.780 --> 00:51:57.340
she was doing a new podcast. She's like,

630
00:51:57.340 --> 00:52:00.500
would you come and do an interview on forgiveness for this whole situation you

631
00:52:00.500 --> 00:52:04.100
just went through? So I was like, sure. She helped walk me through it.

632
00:52:04.180 --> 00:52:08.260
And so I did. And you know,

633
00:52:08.300 --> 00:52:11.140
somehow Kimberly got ahold of it.

634
00:52:13.860 --> 00:52:18.020
I have no idea how she would have found it because it's not like it was like,

635
00:52:18.180 --> 00:52:22.980
there's hundreds of thousands of podcasts. Like I was surprised. Um,

636
00:52:23.540 --> 00:52:27.140
but I mean, I think sometimes they have the flying monkeys that kind of,

637
00:52:29.940 --> 00:52:33.860
yeah, I'm not somebody who's quiet about things. It's like,

638
00:52:34.620 --> 00:52:37.620
I don't know if something happens and I want to be open about it.

639
00:52:37.620 --> 00:52:40.300
I'll be open about it. And so I, I,

640
00:52:40.380 --> 00:52:44.460
the whole podcast was well done as far as me just talking about forgiveness for

641
00:52:44.460 --> 00:52:49.460
someone who had hurt me. And I didn't even blame her necessarily.

642
00:52:49.580 --> 00:52:52.460
I talked a lot about my experience of it. Well, again,

643
00:52:52.460 --> 00:52:56.460
somehow she found it and I found out that she found it and heard it.

644
00:52:56.500 --> 00:52:57.860
And I,

645
00:52:58.740 --> 00:53:03.740
I think that was hard for me because all the information for

646
00:53:03.740 --> 00:53:05.060
her to hear was really good.

647
00:53:05.100 --> 00:53:08.260
If somebody was willing to actually listen and look at themselves.

648
00:53:09.180 --> 00:53:12.100
And I've had friends listen to it and counselors,

649
00:53:12.300 --> 00:53:15.380
counselor friends and counselors listen to it. And they're all like,

650
00:53:15.420 --> 00:53:18.780
you were so grounded. It was such a great interview. You were so,

651
00:53:18.980 --> 00:53:21.300
you were actually way kinder than you should have been.

652
00:53:21.820 --> 00:53:23.260
And cause I'm like, you know what,

653
00:53:23.260 --> 00:53:27.660
I can take responsibility for my part and the whole point of it was about

654
00:53:27.660 --> 00:53:28.340
forgiveness.

655
00:53:28.340 --> 00:53:32.180
So it's about me extending forgiveness through the Lord and not about blaming or

656
00:53:32.180 --> 00:53:36.540
shaming anybody. Well, when she heard it, she,

657
00:53:37.020 --> 00:53:40.380
you know, I was this wrong person. I was this awful person.

658
00:53:40.380 --> 00:53:43.020
I was this person she needed to protect herself from.

659
00:53:43.980 --> 00:53:48.060
And that was hard for me because she makes up this whole story around it about

660
00:53:48.060 --> 00:53:49.340
her being the victim.

661
00:53:50.140 --> 00:53:53.140
And I didn't even like purposely point fingers at her and this,

662
00:53:53.140 --> 00:53:56.620
I didn't mention her name. I didn't mention the name of the company,

663
00:53:57.140 --> 00:54:00.300
like nothing. So for anyone to even know, I was talking about her,

664
00:54:00.300 --> 00:54:02.900
they would have had to have been very close to the situation.

665
00:54:03.940 --> 00:54:08.340
And so that that's hard because number one,

666
00:54:09.380 --> 00:54:13.580
the belief around I'm this awful person that she needs to protect herself from.

667
00:54:14.140 --> 00:54:17.900
And also as crazy as it sounds,

668
00:54:17.900 --> 00:54:20.620
it's like there's never a chance that we'll be able to reconcile.

669
00:54:22.100 --> 00:54:24.780
Yeah. Yeah. And you know,

670
00:54:24.780 --> 00:54:28.300
having that heart for someone is good and,

671
00:54:28.380 --> 00:54:33.300
and a very, and a reflection of your,

672
00:54:34.220 --> 00:54:35.060
your

673
00:54:36.780 --> 00:54:40.300
the part of you, you know, the fact that you look like your father,

674
00:54:40.380 --> 00:54:44.460
that's what I'm trying to say. And so that's good. God has that heart for her.

675
00:54:46.540 --> 00:54:51.540
And, and he, it, she is his very, very precious child.

676
00:54:52.940 --> 00:54:56.300
He, he loves her. He looks on her fondly

677
00:54:57.380 --> 00:54:59.940
because of who it is that she is.

678
00:55:00.000 --> 00:55:02.440
you know, just, although in meaning like she came out of him.

679
00:55:02.440 --> 00:55:09.920
So, so he, she's very precious to him, but she she does not trust him.

680
00:55:10.480 --> 00:55:11.480
She does not.

681
00:55:12.000 --> 00:55:13.000
It's what it sounds like.

682
00:55:13.320 --> 00:55:13.880
It sounds like her.

683
00:55:13.880 --> 00:55:15.920
She lived according to, you know, the freedom of her life.

684
00:55:15.920 --> 00:55:17.760
It looks like she, you know, she does not trust him.

685
00:55:18.720 --> 00:55:22.280
She and she believes that he is the enemy.

686
00:55:22.280 --> 00:55:23.880
She has to look out for herself, et cetera.

687
00:55:23.880 --> 00:55:28.000
Even though she can say and believe in things, she believes all the right things.

688
00:55:28.720 --> 00:55:34.360
Um, and, uh, uh, and so he has a heart to see her restored and reconciled to him,

689
00:55:34.680 --> 00:55:41.680
but that is her choice and he will not honor and put up with the way that she

690
00:55:41.680 --> 00:55:46.080
is, um, the way that she's behaving with the animosity and accusation

691
00:55:46.080 --> 00:55:47.440
that she has against the Lord.

692
00:55:47.640 --> 00:55:52.760
He won't put up with any of that, but he still loves who it is that she really is.

693
00:55:53.040 --> 00:55:55.560
And so what you're talking about is a reflection of your father.

694
00:55:55.560 --> 00:55:57.920
You were looking like your father and that's what God desires.

695
00:55:58.320 --> 00:56:01.760
That was, you know, Lord, I desire for reconciliation.

696
00:56:02.520 --> 00:56:04.680
I see who it is that you've made her to be.

697
00:56:04.680 --> 00:56:06.440
And I would like to be reconciled with that.

698
00:56:07.040 --> 00:56:12.200
But the thing is that if that's not how she is, um, if she's not manifesting

699
00:56:12.200 --> 00:56:17.160
who it is that she is in spirit into her soul and her body, um, and then, um,

700
00:56:17.200 --> 00:56:19.240
and it's not honoring to the Lord.

701
00:56:19.480 --> 00:56:24.120
Well then, and, um, and, uh, there's a, an element of like threat and animosity.

702
00:56:24.600 --> 00:56:28.280
Um, then there's, there's a, there's a distance that needs to be

703
00:56:28.280 --> 00:56:30.360
catching on the soul and the body, et cetera.

704
00:56:30.360 --> 00:56:34.480
So what you can do is obviously, you know, you know, which you've already

705
00:56:34.480 --> 00:56:41.160
done, you're praying for forgiveness and all of that, but also, um, uh, I'm

706
00:56:41.160 --> 00:56:45.720
sorry, would you, um, let me use the restroom just really quick, sorry to

707
00:56:45.720 --> 00:56:48.440
interrupt, like right in the middle of that, but I drank a whole bunch of water

708
00:56:48.440 --> 00:56:50.840
before we got on and a whole cup of coffee.

709
00:56:51.360 --> 00:56:56.400
So after three and a half cups of water, glasses of water and cup of tea and a cup

710
00:56:56.400 --> 00:56:59.680
of coffee, my, my body is just kind of like, can you just give us a little bit

711
00:56:59.680 --> 00:57:02.280
of relief for a sec, just one second.

712
00:57:02.600 --> 00:57:02.960
Okay.

713
00:58:20.840 --> 00:58:21.160
Okay.

714
00:58:47.640 --> 00:58:48.160
Thank you.

715
00:58:48.600 --> 00:58:48.920
Okay.

716
00:58:49.040 --> 00:58:57.840
So, um, uh, the, um, okay.

717
00:58:57.840 --> 00:58:58.120
Yeah.

718
00:58:58.120 --> 00:59:01.720
About, about, um, you know, how to look like your father, you know, and

719
00:59:01.720 --> 00:59:03.760
proceed with what it is that you're feeling.

720
00:59:04.480 --> 00:59:10.040
Um, you know, and obviously, um, uh, forgiving, et cetera, but doing what I

721
00:59:10.040 --> 00:59:14.520
was explaining about like separating, you know, declaring all of the separation

722
00:59:15.000 --> 00:59:19.400
that someone can't have access to you, to, to see who it is, uh, to see into

723
00:59:19.400 --> 00:59:23.160
your soul or your spirit or whatever you want, um, et cetera.

724
00:59:23.440 --> 00:59:28.040
And then, and then, you know, praying for her, lifting her up before the Lord

725
00:59:28.040 --> 00:59:32.120
saying, Lord, I know who it is that you've created her to be, um, you know,

726
00:59:32.120 --> 00:59:36.760
to a certain extent and, and, um, you know, looking at her Lord with your

727
00:59:36.760 --> 00:59:42.920
heart, she is, um, you know, she's, she's got tremendous things that you want to

728
00:59:42.920 --> 00:59:48.520
do, uh, ways that you want to manifest from heaven into earth through her.

729
00:59:49.080 --> 00:59:50.480
And do that.

730
00:59:50.480 --> 00:59:53.240
And I, and I pray, pray, pray blessings on her life.

731
00:59:53.680 --> 00:59:59.960
I pray, you know, that, um, uh, that she, that you would reveal her.

732
01:00:00.000 --> 01:00:04.800
to her that she would see how good it is that you truly are, that she would turn to you and choose

733
01:00:04.800 --> 01:00:14.080
you, and so very intentionally, you know, bring your, the aspect of your heart that looks so much

734
01:00:14.080 --> 01:00:19.280
so much like the Father's heart and present her before the Lord like that. Say, Lord, I stand in

735
01:00:19.280 --> 01:00:24.880
the garden for her, and I'm asking that I don't know, Lord, if other people are praying for her

736
01:00:24.880 --> 01:00:31.200
like this, but you have given me the ability to see who it is that she is and, you know, what it

737
01:00:31.200 --> 01:00:39.280
is that she's doing, as well as who it is that she really is, and I'm asking you, Lord, that she be

738
01:00:39.280 --> 01:00:48.640
restored. I am asking that I'm praying for her in a way that maybe nobody else has or is praying for

739
01:00:48.640 --> 01:00:57.040
her, and I'm lifting her up before you, and so I recommend that you do that, and just, and you can

740
01:00:57.040 --> 01:01:02.640
sense in your spirit what it is that you think is appropriate, but just doing it one time very

741
01:01:02.640 --> 01:01:11.840
intentionally, bringing her before the Lord, and then after that, to either not do it again,

742
01:01:12.480 --> 01:01:17.120
or if you do it again, and again, these are just ideas you can take for the Lord. I'm telling you

743
01:01:17.120 --> 01:01:23.840
this is the only way to do it, and you're not doing it again, or because one time is enough.

744
01:01:25.360 --> 01:01:30.720
I mean, think about a king only has to say something once. He doesn't have to keep

745
01:01:30.720 --> 01:01:34.560
repeating it in order to make something happen. He's got enough authority that if he says it one

746
01:01:34.560 --> 01:01:40.080
time, it's enough, but so you can do it, just do it once, or if something, if God brings something to

747
01:01:40.080 --> 01:01:45.440
mind, and you feel in your spirit you need to lift her up again, generally speaking, unless you just

748
01:01:45.440 --> 01:01:48.960
feel something very, very heavy on your spirit that you're like, I think the Lord wants me to

749
01:01:48.960 --> 01:01:54.560
do something more substantial, unless it's like that, understand that what you did was sufficient

750
01:01:54.560 --> 01:02:01.040
the one time, and then from that point on, if you feel like you need to, it can be just short,

751
01:02:01.040 --> 01:02:11.600
sweet, just like, Lord, you know, I give her to you, and I declare that you are pursuing her heart,

752
01:02:11.680 --> 01:02:19.280
and open, make her vulnerable, Lord, to your love, you know, and that'd be it, and you go on about

753
01:02:19.280 --> 01:02:22.240
your day, and you don't think about it anymore, you don't think, you think about it for another

754
01:02:22.240 --> 01:02:28.800
however many months, etc. So I recommend, those are just some ways in which I, I recommend that you,

755
01:02:30.480 --> 01:02:35.520
what, what you do with how it is that you feel towards her, because those are good things,

756
01:02:36.480 --> 01:02:43.760
but keeping, but not, but separating all those ties, does that make sense? So it's a healthy

757
01:02:43.760 --> 01:02:51.440
way to present her before the Lord, without continuing to be emotionally,

758
01:02:53.840 --> 01:03:00.080
to emotionally respond to her in any way, the idea of her, the remembrance of her, the memory of her,

759
01:03:00.800 --> 01:03:04.720
whatever, because right now, there's a lot of emotional response, because there's still all

760
01:03:04.720 --> 01:03:12.720
those connections. So anyway, the, so those are some, those are some ideas.

761
01:03:18.160 --> 01:03:19.280
Oh, you're frozen.

762
01:03:19.280 --> 01:03:31.840
Are you there?

763
01:03:49.280 --> 01:03:57.840
Uh.

764
01:04:08.160 --> 01:04:08.480
Hey.

765
01:04:10.960 --> 01:04:14.960
Yeah, so sorry, as soon as I finished talking, you froze, and then you started talking,

766
01:04:14.960 --> 01:04:17.840
and I couldn't hear a thing that you said, so start all over.

767
01:04:18.400 --> 01:04:26.640
That's okay. Yeah, so I, I felt like, I don't think I've said it out loud, but I felt it in

768
01:04:26.640 --> 01:04:36.240
my spirit that, that kind of thing, like I really, part, partly my prayer is that the company that

769
01:04:36.240 --> 01:04:46.080
is called Clemmer, the company would end up somehow going under, and not because I don't

770
01:04:46.080 --> 01:04:50.240
think that the tools they teach are good, because I think there's a lot people can learn from them,

771
01:04:50.880 --> 01:04:59.920
but I actually legitimately care about her, and yeah, I have prayed that feeling like one of the

772
01:05:00.000 --> 01:05:05.840
the only way she's ever going to be broken free of this, whatever's going on inside her

773
01:05:05.840 --> 01:05:13.120
spiritually is if she's able to not have the company as the focus.

774
01:05:13.120 --> 01:05:19.960
As long as that's in her life, it's replacing Jesus because it's that compelling.

775
01:05:19.960 --> 01:05:22.480
And I'm like, I just want God to break her of that spirit.

776
01:05:22.480 --> 01:05:27.280
And I feel like deep down, like it's weird because she's gone for deliverance weekends

777
01:05:27.280 --> 01:05:28.280
and stuff.

778
01:05:28.280 --> 01:05:35.280
She knows something's not right, but she doesn't know how to break it.

779
01:05:35.280 --> 01:05:40.280
And I, and she won't admit it because I think, I don't know, like, I think she might be further

780
01:05:40.280 --> 01:05:43.800
along than some narcissists are who don't think they have any problem.

781
01:05:43.800 --> 01:05:48.680
I don't think she can admit that she has a problem because she's too fragile, but she,

782
01:05:48.680 --> 01:05:53.760
I think she knows something's not right because of her past and stuff that she went through.

783
01:05:53.760 --> 01:06:00.080
So I, I have prayed, I'm like, God, you know, I don't know how you're going to get to her,

784
01:06:00.080 --> 01:06:04.000
but whatever's going to, whatever it's going to take to open her heart and her soul to

785
01:06:04.000 --> 01:06:10.760
you instead of Clemmer being the thing that she's so focused on that pulled her out of

786
01:06:10.760 --> 01:06:13.600
the depths of despair that now she has to sell to everyone.

787
01:06:13.600 --> 01:06:19.920
But then she, you know, the way she does it is some people experience major transformation

788
01:06:19.920 --> 01:06:22.600
by the way she coaches them.

789
01:06:23.440 --> 01:06:28.320
And I, you know, again, I felt like it's so silly.

790
01:06:28.320 --> 01:06:33.280
And I told you this about watching The Chosen, how it was like, Jesus went around and chose

791
01:06:33.280 --> 01:06:34.800
his disciples.

792
01:06:34.800 --> 01:06:35.800
That's how I felt with her.

793
01:06:35.800 --> 01:06:41.600
I felt like she chose me, like, it's like, you are, I'm going to mentor you, I'm going

794
01:06:41.600 --> 01:06:42.600
to pour into you.

795
01:06:42.600 --> 01:06:46.400
And I was like, me out of all the people here, you're going to pick me.

796
01:06:46.400 --> 01:06:47.400
Yeah.

797
01:06:47.400 --> 01:06:50.600
Choose your, keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

798
01:06:51.600 --> 01:06:52.600
Yeah.

799
01:06:52.600 --> 01:06:53.600
Totally.

800
01:06:53.600 --> 01:06:58.840
And so, yeah, my prayer has definitely been that God would do what he needs to do to break

801
01:06:58.840 --> 01:06:59.840
her free.

802
01:06:59.840 --> 01:07:02.840
And so I've kind of kept tabs a little bit through friends that are still involved in

803
01:07:02.840 --> 01:07:06.840
the program and how they're doing with COVID.

804
01:07:06.840 --> 01:07:11.480
Because now they don't have people going through the whole series of seminars.

805
01:07:11.480 --> 01:07:15.080
Like they just came here last weekend, but I don't think it was a big class.

806
01:07:15.080 --> 01:07:18.960
Another girl, I found something out last night from my friend, April, who's a really close

807
01:07:18.960 --> 01:07:19.960
friend.

808
01:07:20.320 --> 01:07:22.320
And I think I told you about her.

809
01:07:22.320 --> 01:07:26.320
She had a baby about six months ago that was one pound, six ounces.

810
01:07:26.320 --> 01:07:27.320
Yeah.

811
01:07:27.320 --> 01:07:28.320
Crazy.

812
01:07:28.320 --> 01:07:34.320
So she was in the NICU for four and a half months, like crazy, but she's doing well now.

813
01:07:34.320 --> 01:07:42.320
She's like 10 pounds, but she, she still corresponds with quite a few people that are in the group.

814
01:07:42.320 --> 01:07:45.320
She's in a mastermind group with a few of them.

815
01:07:45.320 --> 01:07:49.320
And so I was talking to her last night about this one girl who I've never been able to

816
01:07:49.680 --> 01:07:50.680
figure out.

817
01:07:50.680 --> 01:07:54.680
And this girl tried to put on a personal mastery because personal mastery is kind of the way

818
01:07:54.680 --> 01:07:56.680
you get people in the door.

819
01:07:56.680 --> 01:08:02.680
So you bring that to your city, you pay your own money, like $1,200 to bring it to your

820
01:08:02.680 --> 01:08:05.680
city, guaranteeing you will have like 20 people in the class.

821
01:08:05.680 --> 01:08:09.680
And if you have 20 people in the class, you get your money back.

822
01:08:09.680 --> 01:08:11.680
But if you don't, then they keep your money.

823
01:08:11.680 --> 01:08:13.680
So interesting.

824
01:08:14.040 --> 01:08:20.040
So anyway, she had brought it to her city and she's a super strong Christian.

825
01:08:20.040 --> 01:08:24.040
And out of all the people that I experienced in the program, I felt like she was one of

826
01:08:24.040 --> 01:08:29.040
the strongest Christians and one of the closest women to the Lord in my experience.

827
01:08:29.040 --> 01:08:32.040
So I was like, how has she not woken up yet?

828
01:08:32.040 --> 01:08:38.040
How has she not figured out that this is not of God, that it's not living in the spirit,

829
01:08:38.040 --> 01:08:39.040
that there's an element.

830
01:08:39.040 --> 01:08:43.040
Now she's not really, people don't figure Kimberly out unless they get really close

831
01:08:43.399 --> 01:08:44.399
to her.

832
01:08:44.399 --> 01:08:45.399
This is part of the problem.

833
01:08:45.399 --> 01:08:47.399
They see the facade, they believe the facade, right?

834
01:08:47.399 --> 01:08:52.399
And so this girl, Lisa, I was talking to my friend April about her last night and she

835
01:08:52.399 --> 01:08:57.399
brought the personal mastery to her city, spent all her money on bringing it there,

836
01:08:57.399 --> 01:09:01.399
couldn't get like anybody that she was close to to do it.

837
01:09:01.399 --> 01:09:05.399
She's brought it before and people were doing it, but all of a sudden people weren't

838
01:09:05.399 --> 01:09:07.399
interested in doing it.

839
01:09:07.399 --> 01:09:09.399
I was like, really, that's so interesting.

840
01:09:09.399 --> 01:09:12.399
And I said, well, then why hasn't she woken up yet?

841
01:09:12.760 --> 01:09:14.760
Why, if she's so close to God, has she not woken up yet?

842
01:09:14.760 --> 01:09:17.760
And I could never, for years, have never been able to figure it out.

843
01:09:17.760 --> 01:09:22.760
Last night, my friend April told me, she's like, oh, well, before Clemmer, Lisa was in

844
01:09:22.760 --> 01:09:24.760
a cult.

845
01:09:24.760 --> 01:09:28.760
And I was like, oh, now it makes sense.

846
01:09:28.760 --> 01:09:34.760
She has gotten indoctrinated to the point where she has believed some cult belief systems.

847
01:09:34.760 --> 01:09:39.760
Now that cult might have looked or been more damaging than this one, but this one probably

848
01:09:40.120 --> 01:09:44.120
teaches similar things because it's personal development and like human potential movement,

849
01:09:44.120 --> 01:09:45.120
right?

850
01:09:45.120 --> 01:09:47.120
Like mind dynamics and everything.

851
01:09:47.120 --> 01:09:51.120
So when people get into a cult, they'll often cult hop.

852
01:09:51.120 --> 01:09:54.120
So they'll get out of that one and they'll find another one and then another one, another

853
01:09:54.120 --> 01:09:55.120
one.

854
01:09:55.120 --> 01:09:59.120
They might look a little different, but I finally realized she was indoctrinated back

855
01:09:59.120 --> 01:10:00.120
then.

856
01:10:00.000 --> 01:10:06.240
and she's still probably so indoctrinated with the belief that she's not able to

857
01:10:07.280 --> 01:10:12.800
kind of see the forest for the trees or see what's really going on because whatever spirit has kind

858
01:10:12.800 --> 01:10:16.880
of latched onto her a little bit or maybe you can word this better than me but I feel like

859
01:10:17.440 --> 01:10:21.680
a spirit has come in through the indoctrination or through the mind control or through whatever

860
01:10:21.680 --> 01:10:27.120
abuse or whatever she's been through and but she wants to be a part of it and when you're a human

861
01:10:27.120 --> 01:10:33.200
being and you're part of a human being movement or a human being group it feels really good and

862
01:10:33.200 --> 01:10:37.920
you almost like I think want to match it up with your beliefs because they're christians who run

863
01:10:37.920 --> 01:10:43.520
this company so you feel like oh like it aligns with the bible right yeah your sense of belonging

864
01:10:43.520 --> 01:10:50.640
community identity yeah but I but the fact that she was in another cult I was like so how would

865
01:10:50.640 --> 01:10:56.960
you explain that would you say because I think in a way like spirits when we leave like an opening

866
01:10:57.360 --> 01:11:03.680
spirits that are not of god can come in somehow like almost like the enemy will when there's like

867
01:11:03.680 --> 01:11:10.320
a foot he'll get a foothold or something and kind of come in and affect us in a way that keeps us

868
01:11:10.320 --> 01:11:15.280
blinded or hardened to what god wants us to see so maybe you can explain that better than me

869
01:11:17.040 --> 01:11:25.920
um yeah and then also what you said um along with the fact that um the the reason that people are

870
01:11:25.920 --> 01:11:33.360
cult hop etc um yeah they're similar they're familiar spirits um in in each in each cult

871
01:11:33.360 --> 01:11:38.400
and it's meeting some need that they're looking for because they're not they're not finding it

872
01:11:38.400 --> 01:11:44.800
they're not looking for it and being satisfied in it from the lord so they need something else

873
01:11:44.800 --> 01:11:51.120
because we're created to need certain things um we're created needing certain things and all of

874
01:11:51.120 --> 01:12:00.800
those things are especially met with met in by the lord um so that the cult identity belonging um

875
01:12:02.000 --> 01:12:10.000
purpose um explanations that's one of the things that people love about cults it's answers um uh

876
01:12:10.000 --> 01:12:18.080
security because the answers give us security um and uh anyway and and just knowing that whatever

877
01:12:18.080 --> 01:12:21.280
things that you don't necessarily have answers for at least you're all in it together

878
01:12:22.560 --> 01:12:30.160
um and uh so like i said there's just a sense of support and structure that makes people feel safe

879
01:12:30.160 --> 01:12:34.880
um so yeah that makes sense that people called hot because they realize that oh something's not

880
01:12:34.880 --> 01:12:40.720
quite right they still look to other cults to fulfill this need that they have because they've

881
01:12:40.720 --> 01:12:46.720
decided this is how i can must rut this is i'm most familiar with getting this need met like this

882
01:12:47.360 --> 01:12:54.960
so yeah yeah no that's true and do you think so do you think in the middle of that cult experience

883
01:12:54.960 --> 01:12:59.920
because it's not of god i don't believe god you know approves of cults or approves of

884
01:12:59.920 --> 01:13:05.120
mind control and all of that so do you think the enemy gets some kind of a foothold in people when

885
01:13:05.120 --> 01:13:10.720
they're in a cult that causes them to be like blinded or hardened yeah it's like what we were

886
01:13:10.720 --> 01:13:20.800
talking about earlier with um with that kimberly is the fact that um is is that it's us giving you

887
01:13:20.800 --> 01:13:32.240
know the enemy access so to speak and um where we can be affected and we we give um uh there and

888
01:13:32.240 --> 01:13:38.400
then there's a blindness that comes over us we've come into agreement with something and the the

889
01:13:38.400 --> 01:13:45.520
agreement is is a very serious thing now yes it can be broken because we declare it to be so

890
01:13:46.240 --> 01:13:52.000
i say that it's broken it's um it's already broken and the fact that you know we're a spirit and

891
01:13:52.000 --> 01:13:59.760
we're in god and all of that but the way that we're operating is that there's this agreement

892
01:14:00.720 --> 01:14:08.880
and it's kind of like um kind of a blood covenant that we've made with a lie with something that's

893
01:14:08.880 --> 01:14:14.640
not of god and that's of this other spirit and that's what coming into agreement is and it's

894
01:14:14.640 --> 01:14:22.800
not just simply like oh and that's why it has its power it it's got the power of a legal binding

895
01:14:22.880 --> 01:14:30.480
document um that that's how powerful and how much authority that what it is that we come into

896
01:14:30.480 --> 01:14:36.480
agreement with has um because or that we have and therefore when we come into agreement it's

897
01:14:36.480 --> 01:14:41.040
it's not just something like okay well this is what i'm going to do today no it's it's this

898
01:14:41.040 --> 01:14:48.000
binding thing to us we can very easily acknowledge that that is not of us and that we're of god's

899
01:14:48.000 --> 01:14:53.760
bloodline and not of somebody else you know and we're not tainted etc so i'm talking about how it

900
01:14:53.760 --> 01:14:59.840
operates in our lives in the soul in the spirit i'm not talking about the fact that it actually

901
01:15:00.000 --> 01:15:08.000
legally binds us in such a way that we can't get out of it. No, God says that it has nothing

902
01:15:08.000 --> 01:15:14.080
whatsoever to do with us, but we think that it does, and therefore it manifests like we think

903
01:15:14.080 --> 01:15:21.040
that it does. That's my point. But it manifests in a very strong way. And so that's what it is

904
01:15:21.040 --> 01:15:26.320
with these familiar spirits is they can get in because we're coming to agreement with things

905
01:15:26.320 --> 01:15:32.000
that are not of God and that are trying to, where we're trying to find, we're trying to

906
01:15:33.840 --> 01:15:40.160
look for provision and protection elsewhere. And coming into agreement with those things,

907
01:15:40.880 --> 01:15:49.760
then it comes into that, that makes a connection between us and those spirits. And

908
01:15:50.560 --> 01:15:59.280
we're going to go find those spirits elsewhere. It's making, it's like what Kimberly,

909
01:16:00.000 --> 01:16:04.960
sounds like Kimberly's doing is, or I should say people, I don't want to declare something

910
01:16:04.960 --> 01:16:14.000
ever so much. What people like Kimberly do is they have made an idol out of the thing that's

911
01:16:14.960 --> 01:16:23.360
out of the process that they went through to heal or to provide for themselves, protect themselves,

912
01:16:23.360 --> 01:16:30.960
et cetera. Like this whole mindset shift in transformation process, it's making an idol out

913
01:16:30.960 --> 01:16:37.680
of it. Where that is now our, we're now looking, it's a golden calf. We're now believing this is

914
01:16:37.760 --> 01:16:48.080
what saved us out of Egypt. And it is, it's making an idol of it, meaning that it is replacing it,

915
01:16:48.080 --> 01:16:53.120
we're replacing God as our protection, provision, identity, and declaring that this thing gives us

916
01:16:53.120 --> 01:17:01.520
our protection, our provision, and our identity. Yeah, that makes sense. I think, yeah,

917
01:17:02.400 --> 01:17:06.800
it's interesting because it is very spiritual. Like my experience of getting out of it was very

918
01:17:06.800 --> 01:17:11.600
spiritual. And my experience of my friends going in and seeing what was happening was very spiritual.

919
01:17:11.600 --> 01:17:19.040
And I, you know, I have learned because now, I mean, even though in some ways, like I feel like,

920
01:17:19.040 --> 01:17:25.520
you know, we're friends, you and I like could be, you know, friends. I also feel like in a sense,

921
01:17:25.520 --> 01:17:30.720
you're mentoring me because you're teaching me a lot, right? So there's some guidance there.

922
01:17:30.720 --> 01:17:38.320
There's some element of me trusting that you are gonna guide me in the right direction, right?

923
01:17:38.320 --> 01:17:46.320
And so what's interesting about that is, I think I've learned so much from that experience with her

924
01:17:46.320 --> 01:17:53.600
that with you, like, there's no unhealthy soul tie. There's no me looking to you thinking that you

925
01:17:53.600 --> 01:17:58.800
have all the answers. There's, it's not like, oh my gosh, I need to talk to Ashley because

926
01:17:58.880 --> 01:18:03.120
she's gonna help me figure myself out so I can be the person I want to be like, there's none of that.

927
01:18:03.120 --> 01:18:10.880
It's like, I, what I didn't do with her was like, test and approve kind of what she was saying back

928
01:18:10.880 --> 01:18:18.240
to the Bible and really in my spirit feel right about it. And so with you, like, I feel that I've

929
01:18:18.240 --> 01:18:25.440
learned now not to give so much, like not, not that I get, like, I'm very vulnerable with you. I'm very

930
01:18:25.440 --> 01:18:31.440
open with you. I feel connected to you. I give you a lot of myself, right? And being vulnerable

931
01:18:31.440 --> 01:18:37.920
and authentic. And I don't, it's like, it's different. Like, I don't have that soul tie.

932
01:18:37.920 --> 01:18:43.520
It's not unhealthy. And I think I learned what unhealthy looked like in that relationship. And

933
01:18:43.520 --> 01:18:50.400
now I can make sure that if I saw myself going there, I'd be able to catch myself or when I feel

934
01:18:50.400 --> 01:18:56.080
that discernment coming up and I, you know, I need to pay attention to it. And obviously with

935
01:18:56.080 --> 01:19:00.880
you, like, I haven't felt any red flags or anything, but with her, I felt red flags right

936
01:19:00.880 --> 01:19:06.880
away and didn't trust myself. And again, like you've mentioned, trust myself. And for whatever

937
01:19:06.880 --> 01:19:14.320
reason, I felt a lot of things in my life that I have not trusted. And now I think that that's the

938
01:19:14.320 --> 01:19:20.160
next, maybe the next place God is bringing me into is a season of trusting myself more and

939
01:19:20.160 --> 01:19:26.240
trusting the things that I feel like he's saying to me or bringing into my life. And, you know,

940
01:19:26.240 --> 01:19:32.000
obviously like I have lots of areas I could grow in. And I just wonder, maybe right now he's trying

941
01:19:32.000 --> 01:19:39.680
to give me some insight into, I don't know, trusting what's going on inside me somehow,

942
01:19:39.680 --> 01:19:51.520
trusting that God can use that or, I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And yeah, it's just this

943
01:19:51.520 --> 01:19:59.840
process that we go through learning what does it mean to trust ourselves? And I had to go.

944
01:20:00.000 --> 01:20:05.000
through that process, trying to think,

945
01:20:06.320 --> 01:20:08.880
what are some of the things that I did that helped?

946
01:20:11.080 --> 01:20:16.080
I would, if I thought something was a good idea,

947
01:20:19.560 --> 01:20:21.560
and it could be whatever, it could be business,

948
01:20:21.560 --> 01:20:22.920
it could be with a friendship,

949
01:20:22.920 --> 01:20:25.840
it could be, I don't know, whatever.

950
01:20:25.840 --> 01:20:28.560
If I thought it was a good idea, not logically,

951
01:20:28.600 --> 01:20:30.960
but if it was like this desire within me,

952
01:20:31.920 --> 01:20:34.920
then I would step out on it.

953
01:20:36.960 --> 01:20:39.360
And I just began to do that if I thought,

954
01:20:39.360 --> 01:20:40.760
this is what I want to eat.

955
01:20:41.720 --> 01:20:43.440
And it's a desire of my heart,

956
01:20:43.440 --> 01:20:44.720
not like this selfish desire,

957
01:20:44.720 --> 01:20:47.240
but just kind of like living life.

958
01:20:47.240 --> 01:20:52.240
And how, if I believe that God is a good God,

959
01:20:53.560 --> 01:20:55.640
what do I think that goodness would look like

960
01:20:55.640 --> 01:20:57.200
in this situation?

961
01:20:57.200 --> 01:20:59.520
And then I would let myself do it.

962
01:21:01.000 --> 01:21:06.000
Believing and trusting that if I desire God

963
01:21:06.880 --> 01:21:09.280
to see God's goodness in my life,

964
01:21:09.280 --> 01:21:13.120
if I desire to live a life that is just full

965
01:21:13.120 --> 01:21:16.800
of the manifestation of God being the goodness

966
01:21:16.800 --> 01:21:18.520
of who it is that he says that he is,

967
01:21:18.520 --> 01:21:21.680
and to a vast degree,

968
01:21:21.680 --> 01:21:24.440
and then he said that he loves me, et cetera,

969
01:21:24.440 --> 01:21:27.280
then what would that look like?

970
01:21:27.280 --> 01:21:28.480
What decisions would I make?

971
01:21:28.480 --> 01:21:31.600
Would I eat this or would I not eat this?

972
01:21:31.600 --> 01:21:34.720
And would I call that friend

973
01:21:34.720 --> 01:21:36.240
or would I not call that friend?

974
01:21:36.240 --> 01:21:38.120
As opposed to constantly doubting myself,

975
01:21:38.120 --> 01:21:40.360
thinking maybe I shouldn't do that.

976
01:21:40.360 --> 01:21:42.920
Maybe I shouldn't call them, they might be busy.

977
01:21:42.920 --> 01:21:45.880
Maybe I shouldn't eat that

978
01:21:45.880 --> 01:21:47.800
because it's probably just very, very unhealthy

979
01:21:47.800 --> 01:21:49.440
for me or whatever.

980
01:21:49.440 --> 01:21:54.440
If I began to intentionally choose to trust the Lord

981
01:21:56.160 --> 01:21:57.400
and just understand, okay,

982
01:21:57.400 --> 01:21:58.800
the Lord's my protection or vision.

983
01:21:58.800 --> 01:22:00.000
I'm not in a place of lack.

984
01:22:00.000 --> 01:22:04.240
I don't need to worry that I'm constantly

985
01:22:04.240 --> 01:22:08.880
being beset against and I've got to be on guard

986
01:22:08.880 --> 01:22:10.120
and I've got to be defensive.

987
01:22:10.120 --> 01:22:12.320
If I started letting all of that go,

988
01:22:12.320 --> 01:22:15.600
then I realized that these desires that I had,

989
01:22:15.880 --> 01:22:20.880
I had to learn to trust that they were good things

990
01:22:22.080 --> 01:22:27.040
as opposed to things that I wanted to do

991
01:22:27.040 --> 01:22:29.400
because I was in self-protection mode.

992
01:22:30.720 --> 01:22:34.520
I was scared and I was doing something out of fear.

993
01:22:34.520 --> 01:22:39.360
I began to trust myself when I wasn't in a place of fear

994
01:22:39.360 --> 01:22:41.880
or didn't believe I was in a place of fear

995
01:22:41.880 --> 01:22:45.120
and I wanted something, then I would do it.

996
01:22:46.360 --> 01:22:50.160
Choosing to believe that this is what goodness looks like,

997
01:22:50.160 --> 01:22:52.680
this is what the character of God looks like

998
01:22:52.680 --> 01:22:54.200
and I didn't make this super spiritual.

999
01:22:54.200 --> 01:22:58.320
My point is that just believing in general goodness

1000
01:22:58.320 --> 01:23:00.920
and the character of God

1001
01:23:00.920 --> 01:23:02.920
and that I house the character of God within me

1002
01:23:02.920 --> 01:23:05.160
because I am of his very DNA.

1003
01:23:05.160 --> 01:23:07.640
So the character of God and love and goodness

1004
01:23:07.640 --> 01:23:11.560
is who I am made up of.

1005
01:23:11.560 --> 01:23:13.600
It's not something I took on.

1006
01:23:13.600 --> 01:23:15.480
It's something I am made up of.

1007
01:23:16.360 --> 01:23:17.680
I can't be separated from it

1008
01:23:17.680 --> 01:23:20.640
because it is what identifies and defines me

1009
01:23:20.640 --> 01:23:24.440
is the fact that I have this DNA of God,

1010
01:23:25.840 --> 01:23:28.080
not that I am God, you know what I'm saying?

1011
01:23:29.280 --> 01:23:34.240
And so therefore, I always like to clarify that

1012
01:23:34.240 --> 01:23:37.080
because the language that I use can sound very extreme

1013
01:23:37.080 --> 01:23:38.600
and so I didn't wanna clarify.

1014
01:23:38.960 --> 01:23:43.960
Anyway, and so I began to actually act

1015
01:23:48.440 --> 01:23:53.440
on desires of my heart, I say desires of my heart,

1016
01:23:53.640 --> 01:23:57.440
things that I thought would be a good idea

1017
01:23:57.440 --> 01:24:01.240
or that sounded fun or that I wanted to do or whatever.

1018
01:24:02.680 --> 01:24:06.960
While in the background, I was filling my life,

1019
01:24:07.000 --> 01:24:09.640
choosing, okay, Ashley, you're not,

1020
01:24:09.640 --> 01:24:11.240
there's no need to be afraid.

1021
01:24:11.240 --> 01:24:12.920
There's no need to be afraid.

1022
01:24:12.920 --> 01:24:14.560
And so now I've dealt with this whole thing of,

1023
01:24:14.560 --> 01:24:16.120
okay, Ashley, you're choosing to believe

1024
01:24:16.120 --> 01:24:18.080
that there's nothing to be afraid of.

1025
01:24:18.080 --> 01:24:21.360
Therefore, I'm not less likely to make decisions

1026
01:24:21.360 --> 01:24:22.920
out of a place of fear

1027
01:24:22.920 --> 01:24:25.200
and therefore I'm less likely to,

1028
01:24:25.200 --> 01:24:27.240
that something it is that I wanna do

1029
01:24:27.240 --> 01:24:31.080
is grounded in me trying to provide for and protect myself.

1030
01:24:31.080 --> 01:24:33.200
So therefore, if I'm not trying to provide

1031
01:24:33.200 --> 01:24:34.880
for and protect myself,

1032
01:24:34.880 --> 01:24:37.040
then it's just something I naturally wanna do

1033
01:24:37.040 --> 01:24:42.040
that must be a very good thing born of God that I can trust.

1034
01:24:42.520 --> 01:24:43.680
Does that make sense?

1035
01:24:43.680 --> 01:24:47.400
So, because otherwise, and until I learned that,

1036
01:24:47.400 --> 01:24:50.640
I just thought that anything that I wanted to do

1037
01:24:50.640 --> 01:24:52.120
must be coming out of my soul

1038
01:24:52.120 --> 01:24:54.160
and that my soul was always depraved

1039
01:24:54.160 --> 01:24:56.360
and my soul always wanted to do the opposite

1040
01:24:56.360 --> 01:24:57.600
of what God wanted me to do

1041
01:24:57.600 --> 01:24:59.320
and that's why I couldn't trust it.

1042
01:24:59.320 --> 01:25:00.160
But that's only,

1043
01:25:00.000 --> 01:25:07.140
if I was living from a, from a, from a mindset and a belief that I was of a fear.

1044
01:25:07.140 --> 01:25:11.560
So if I'm getting rid of that, if I am, I'm choosing, nope, there's nothing to be afraid

1045
01:25:11.560 --> 01:25:12.560
of.

1046
01:25:12.560 --> 01:25:13.560
Okay.

1047
01:25:13.560 --> 01:25:15.720
Actually, now that you, now that you believe that there is nothing to be afraid of, I'm

1048
01:25:15.720 --> 01:25:17.080
standing here at my kitchen sink.

1049
01:25:17.080 --> 01:25:18.880
There is nothing to be afraid of.

1050
01:25:18.880 --> 01:25:22.520
So if there's nothing that I need to be afraid of, there's nothing to fear.

1051
01:25:22.520 --> 01:25:23.960
What do I want to do?

1052
01:25:23.960 --> 01:25:28.120
And I discovered that you didn't want to do different things than you want to do if you're

1053
01:25:28.120 --> 01:25:29.880
in fear.

1054
01:25:29.880 --> 01:25:33.960
If you want to eat a whole bunch of peanut butter, if you're in fear or a whole, or all

1055
01:25:33.960 --> 01:25:37.440
these cookies, if you're, if you're in fear, you know, because it's, you're, you're feeding

1056
01:25:37.440 --> 01:25:43.160
some emotional, some emotional turmoil in place of lack and whatever.

1057
01:25:43.160 --> 01:25:48.240
So if you no longer, if you think, okay, there's no longer anything for me to be afraid of,

1058
01:25:48.240 --> 01:25:49.240
what do I want to do?

1059
01:25:49.240 --> 01:25:53.800
Well, I'd still want to eat a little bit of peanut butter, eat whatever amount of peanut

1060
01:25:53.800 --> 01:25:57.440
butter you want to, because it's from a good place.

1061
01:25:57.440 --> 01:26:00.760
It's from a good place in your heart because God delights in peanut butter.

1062
01:26:00.760 --> 01:26:02.320
He delights in nature.

1063
01:26:02.320 --> 01:26:07.280
He delights in food, delights in, you know, animals.

1064
01:26:07.280 --> 01:26:09.240
He delights in us doing fun events.

1065
01:26:09.240 --> 01:26:13.240
He delights in us taking a nap, delights in us watching Netflix.

1066
01:26:13.240 --> 01:26:19.720
As long as we're doing it where we're not afraid, believing that everything's out to

1067
01:26:19.720 --> 01:26:22.360
get me and I have to protect myself.

1068
01:26:22.360 --> 01:26:24.040
I'm trying to escape work.

1069
01:26:24.040 --> 01:26:27.440
I'm trying to escape this, but that's fear.

1070
01:26:27.440 --> 01:26:35.000
So if, so anyway, that and, and I, I wasn't a hundred percent sure when I was doing things

1071
01:26:35.000 --> 01:26:39.360
and I was making decisions, I wasn't a hundred percent sure if I was in fear or not.

1072
01:26:39.360 --> 01:26:45.720
So I just had to try and God had grace for me, providing me with a protective environment

1073
01:26:45.720 --> 01:26:51.160
spiritually that as long as the intention of my heart was, okay, God, I'm trying to

1074
01:26:51.160 --> 01:26:54.320
find you and I'm trying to find me.

1075
01:26:54.320 --> 01:26:55.320
Who am I?

1076
01:26:55.320 --> 01:26:57.640
What do I want?

1077
01:26:57.640 --> 01:27:03.920
You know, and so that, and, and so anyway, I trusting it is learning to actually step

1078
01:27:03.920 --> 01:27:08.120
is actually choosing to step out and act on it.

1079
01:27:08.120 --> 01:27:09.120
Anyway.

1080
01:27:09.120 --> 01:27:11.120
No, that's good.

1081
01:27:11.120 --> 01:27:16.760
I, yeah, I definitely want to, I like that idea of like, if it's good, if it's not in

1082
01:27:16.760 --> 01:27:19.360
fear, cause I'll often, you know, think about that.

1083
01:27:19.360 --> 01:27:24.880
Like I've thought about, you know, it's kind of done and I'm, I'm kind of okay that it's

1084
01:27:24.880 --> 01:27:31.600
done, but my friend Julia, who just ended our friendship, she there have been times

1085
01:27:31.600 --> 01:27:37.800
once in a while where I think, oh, I just want to reach out to her, but I'm never compelled

1086
01:27:37.800 --> 01:27:40.400
that deeply to reach out to her for whatever reason.

1087
01:27:40.400 --> 01:27:44.880
I just feel like that's something I get to let rest right now.

1088
01:27:44.880 --> 01:27:51.880
And I haven't, you know, I don't know if, I don't even know what the motivation is,

1089
01:27:51.880 --> 01:27:55.560
if it's a good place that I want to do it from, or if it's a fear place I want to do

1090
01:27:55.560 --> 01:28:01.240
it from, or if it's a partially a, I want to help her see the truth of what she's involved

1091
01:28:01.240 --> 01:28:06.480
in and that's why I want to like, it's hard to know.

1092
01:28:06.480 --> 01:28:12.820
And so some situations I feel like I can tell and other situations I don't know.

1093
01:28:12.820 --> 01:28:19.700
So then I, if I'm not overly compelled, I figure it's not the right time and then I

1094
01:28:19.700 --> 01:28:20.980
just let it sit.

1095
01:28:20.980 --> 01:28:26.060
Like there were times, there were times after, you know, even after like Kimberly and my

1096
01:28:26.060 --> 01:28:29.740
friendship kind of ended, there were times when I still felt compelled to reach out to

1097
01:28:29.740 --> 01:28:30.740
her.

1098
01:28:30.740 --> 01:28:37.180
And every time I did and we communicated again, I learned something more and I saw the reason

1099
01:28:37.180 --> 01:28:38.180
in it.

1100
01:28:38.180 --> 01:28:42.460
And I didn't do it out of fear, I did it out of a place of there was something compelling

1101
01:28:43.100 --> 01:28:48.420
me to still finish something that felt unfinished or understand something on a deeper level

1102
01:28:48.420 --> 01:28:52.060
in my spirit that I didn't quite grasp at the time.

1103
01:28:52.060 --> 01:28:58.020
And I knew that if I, if I pressed into that a little bit and wasn't afraid to press into

1104
01:28:58.020 --> 01:29:02.780
it because I knew it didn't still have control over me to that degree that it did, then I

1105
01:29:02.780 --> 01:29:10.200
would discover something that could help my spirit, that could help me kind of be maybe

1106
01:29:10.280 --> 01:29:15.720
in a better place with God because I think there were still things I wanted to work through

1107
01:29:15.720 --> 01:29:16.720
around it.

1108
01:29:16.720 --> 01:29:17.720
I don't know if that makes sense.

1109
01:29:17.720 --> 01:29:18.720
Yeah.

1110
01:29:18.720 --> 01:29:27.880
I mean, that's, I mean, it is one of those things where sometimes when our interactions

1111
01:29:27.880 --> 01:29:31.200
with other people are something that we're trying to heal in ourselves.

1112
01:29:31.200 --> 01:29:33.200
Is that what you're talking about?

1113
01:29:33.200 --> 01:29:34.200
Yeah.

1114
01:29:34.200 --> 01:29:35.200
Yeah.

1115
01:29:35.200 --> 01:29:36.200
I think that that's what it was.

1116
01:29:37.200 --> 01:29:41.320
See, with Julia, I figure I've healed everything I want to heal in myself.

1117
01:29:41.320 --> 01:29:45.920
And if she really wanted to talk to me, she would reach out to me and she's the one who

1118
01:29:45.920 --> 01:29:46.920
ended it.

1119
01:29:46.920 --> 01:29:52.040
So I'm like, okay, the ball's in your court, unless I really feel like there's something

1120
01:29:52.040 --> 01:29:53.480
that I need to heal.

1121
01:29:53.480 --> 01:29:58.560
With Kimberly, I still felt like there were things I hadn't healed yet that I knew I still

1122
01:29:58.560 --> 01:30:00.040
needed to press in and finish.

1123
01:30:00.000 --> 01:30:17.000
And I probably didn't. I probably could have gone to God with it and he could have done it too but for whatever reason he used her as this like catalyst in my life for great change, like great change, and I don't

1124
01:30:18.000 --> 01:30:34.000
like I, I, if I was willing to bend over and like do whatever she wanted me to do, and just worship her and let her control me I'm guarantee you she would let me come back in her life if I was like, I'm so sorry I've realized like how wrong I was

1125
01:30:35.000 --> 01:30:49.000
requires. Yeah, that's what it requires it requires like going and groveling and like begging and I'm just not prepared to do that like I wanted to be able to stand on my own two feet as like my own separate human being, and someone else to, but I feel

1126
01:30:49.000 --> 01:31:05.000
like I'm separated enough that I was able to, you know, reach out a few times and communicate from a place of strength to see. I think part of it was just to even know that I had done what I could to try and reconcile a situation that, you know, seemed

1127
01:31:05.000 --> 01:31:13.000
like it couldn't be healed and I'm like but God can do anything and if it's meant to be like, I'll do my, I'll put my part in to see if it's possible.

1128
01:31:13.000 --> 01:31:24.000
And it wasn't at the time and now I mean I've had her number blocked in my phone for several months now so she's, she's not able to get ahold of me unless she like sends a letter in the mail.

1129
01:31:25.000 --> 01:31:42.000
And sometimes that's hard on me too because I'm like, is that okay? Is it, is it out of spirit to block somebody from my life? Is that a healthy choice or should I be leaving it open for God to do what he's going to do or is that like controlling of me to block somebody on my phone? Do you know what I mean?

1130
01:31:42.000 --> 01:31:44.000
No, it's not.

1131
01:31:44.000 --> 01:31:46.000
No.

1132
01:31:46.000 --> 01:31:48.000
I've done that.

1133
01:31:48.000 --> 01:31:50.000
Oh really?

1134
01:31:51.000 --> 01:32:10.000
Yeah, I mean when people just don't respect your, your boundaries and they keep trying to get at you, you know, and you've tried to handle the situation in a particular way, then it's, it's, it's, you've set your, you've already set your boundary.

1135
01:32:10.000 --> 01:32:17.000
And blocking is just, is just, it's an extent.

1136
01:32:17.000 --> 01:32:25.000
It is that it's a physical way in which your boundary is being expressed, but you've already said it.

1137
01:32:25.000 --> 01:32:29.000
It's just reflecting it, that's my point, it's reflecting.

1138
01:32:29.000 --> 01:32:43.000
So it's not like because I wonder, I'm like, is it a decision out of fear that I'm like, I'm afraid that I might reach out to her again or she might reach out to me again and then this would pick up again and I'm not ready for that or is it?

1139
01:32:44.000 --> 01:33:05.000
Well, I mean, even, not, not necessarily, but even if it is, that's okay. Remember that we're on a journey and so God doesn't expect us to do all, all this, you know, a child grows up and goes through various phases.

1140
01:33:05.000 --> 01:33:21.000
And, and there's this process of maturing and it's like, how do I mature and how do I grow into this other. So, even if you were, even if we do certain things out of fear sometimes it really is, it really is okay.

1141
01:33:21.000 --> 01:33:23.000
It's part of the journey.

1142
01:33:23.000 --> 01:33:32.000
It's just that ultimately what we need to always be doing is, hey Lord, I choose that you are my protection provision. I'm just learning to walk this out.

1143
01:33:32.000 --> 01:33:40.000
And because he doesn't expect us to expose ourselves completely, just because we don't know how to completely be here.

1144
01:33:40.000 --> 01:33:58.000
Just do what we can, you know, do, do what we're, what we're, what we're able to do. And so the fear is the, is our best understanding. I mean, like, so if you were blocking out of fear, not saying that that's, that that's the case, but if I'm addressing the fact that you, you were questioning it.

1145
01:33:58.000 --> 01:34:18.000
If you are blocking it out of fear, it is a measure, God recognizes it and honors it as a measure in which you are, it is you are stepping out into what it is that he, that you believe that he is calling you to do and how he's calling you to live to the best of your ability of knowing how to step out into it.

1146
01:34:18.000 --> 01:34:21.000
Does that make sense.

1147
01:34:22.000 --> 01:34:40.000
Recognize God recognizes and honors the intention of our heart that we're trying to look like our father, as opposed to God's not going to help me. And so therefore I'm doing this, you know, yeah, no, that makes sense because I was thinking, you know, when we know that God's our protection and our provision.

1148
01:34:41.000 --> 01:34:59.000
So with the protection element, if I know he's my protection, why, why can't I just leave that open and be okay with whatever happens, you know, whether nothing ever happens again and there's never any contact or there is contact for whatever reason.

1149
01:34:59.000 --> 01:35:00.000
I know God's protecting me.

1150
01:35:00.000 --> 01:35:06.560
So why am I not strong enough in myself to be able to have that just an opening there?

1151
01:35:07.440 --> 01:35:12.640
Or is that, I guess I struggle with that because I'm like, if I was stronger in the Lord,

1152
01:35:12.640 --> 01:35:17.040
or I really believed he was my protection, then maybe I wouldn't have to take that measure.

1153
01:35:17.040 --> 01:35:21.920
Maybe I would, it's not like she's harassing me or anything. Like, it's more just, I want to close

1154
01:35:21.920 --> 01:35:26.480
that door. You need it for your soul. It's a leverage for your soul.

1155
01:35:27.440 --> 01:35:27.840
There's something.

1156
01:35:28.960 --> 01:35:32.800
And that's, that's okay. It's not saying that God's not my protection when I do that.

1157
01:35:34.000 --> 01:35:40.400
Well, remember that, um, that you are, you're, you're choosing to, it's important for us,

1158
01:35:40.400 --> 01:35:45.200
for you to just act wherever your soul is at. So Lord, I choose to believe this.

1159
01:35:46.160 --> 01:35:52.080
And this is, and, um, but this is where my, this is the level to which my soul has faith.

1160
01:35:52.880 --> 01:36:00.320
This is the degree to which I believe. Uh, what, what, um, uh, this is the degree to which I have,

1161
01:36:00.320 --> 01:36:05.360
I have peace in order to do this and it's okay. It's kind of like this. Do we believe that God

1162
01:36:05.360 --> 01:36:12.080
heals? Absolutely. When we have a headache, do we take Tylenol? Yeah, that's what it is.

1163
01:36:12.080 --> 01:36:17.040
It's just, it's just, uh, uh, a leverage for our soul is choosing to believe that God's your

1164
01:36:17.040 --> 01:36:20.800
healer and God, I know that you're my healer. And I, and I thank you for providing me with

1165
01:36:20.800 --> 01:36:27.760
multiple ways, um, uh, through which you can, um, give me relief and I'm choosing to take

1166
01:36:27.760 --> 01:36:32.880
Tylenol and eventually one day, you know, we're going, cause we're journeying right now. I'm on

1167
01:36:32.880 --> 01:36:36.880
the part of the journey where I take Tylenol. And then eventually I can get to the part of

1168
01:36:36.880 --> 01:36:41.040
the journey where I can, I can manage the headache to go away. And so we're currently,

1169
01:36:41.040 --> 01:36:48.080
I'm in that transition and sometimes I command, sometimes I take Tylenol and, um, then, uh,

1170
01:36:48.080 --> 01:36:52.800
then, you know, eventually, um, it'll be to a point where I just like, nope,

1171
01:36:52.800 --> 01:36:57.520
I don't have headaches because I always know I'm spirit, I'm spirit and son of God.

1172
01:36:58.560 --> 01:37:03.200
And it's just this journey is this, is this, is this process. So it's always choosing to

1173
01:37:03.200 --> 01:37:09.760
believe that what he says is true and then acting wherever our faith is at. And so then we're,

1174
01:37:09.760 --> 01:37:15.440
so we're a son of God, regardless of what it is that we're doing. We're, and we're choosing that

1175
01:37:15.440 --> 01:37:21.040
we're a son of God, regardless of where it is that we are on the journey. Um, so like if someone

1176
01:37:21.040 --> 01:37:27.520
is, uh, uh, if someone is, it's a dog, well, they're a dog in a car. They're a dog on a plane.

1177
01:37:28.080 --> 01:37:35.040
They're a dog, um, wearing a tutu. They're, they're always a dog. It doesn't matter. And so

1178
01:37:35.040 --> 01:37:38.800
it's the same thing with us. It doesn't matter. We, and we're coming into agreement with who it

1179
01:37:38.800 --> 01:37:43.360
is that God says that we are, and then we're operating according and operating according

1180
01:37:43.360 --> 01:37:48.000
to the level of faith that we're currently at. And we're constantly progressing. We don't have

1181
01:37:48.000 --> 01:37:54.320
to, it doesn't God doesn't debt as long as we're, as we're choosing this God, this is who it is

1182
01:37:54.320 --> 01:37:59.840
that I say that this, this is who it is that you say that I am and that I believe therefore that I

1183
01:37:59.840 --> 01:38:07.360
am within, we make a choice on, on, um, you know, as to where our faith is that we make a choice

1184
01:38:07.360 --> 01:38:13.280
over here. And what God does is he looks at it and he's pleased that we believed him to that degree.

1185
01:38:13.280 --> 01:38:19.120
He doesn't look at it saying you didn't believe me to this degree. He degree, he looks at it as

1186
01:38:19.120 --> 01:38:25.040
the glass half full, not half empty. He looks at what measure of faith in degree that you do believe

1187
01:38:25.040 --> 01:38:31.200
him and how far that you have stepped out. And he's pleased. They believed me to that much.

1188
01:38:31.200 --> 01:38:37.600
I'm so glad as opposed to, they didn't believe me enough. We're journeying. We're getting there.

1189
01:38:38.560 --> 01:38:45.120
So would, would, uh, would like the ultimate faith be kind of like the epitome of faith?

1190
01:38:45.120 --> 01:38:52.080
Would it just be allowing things to come in and out as they do and not trying to block or control

1191
01:38:52.080 --> 01:38:58.880
or manipulate anything, but just going, I'm open to whatever comes. If a message comes or doesn't

1192
01:38:58.880 --> 01:39:03.680
come, if I, you know, get in the car and it works or it doesn't, like, I'm not going to be in fear

1193
01:39:03.680 --> 01:39:08.400
of anything. I'm just going to live my life and be open to the spirit and whatever happens. And I

1194
01:39:08.400 --> 01:39:16.880
don't need to have any barriers necessarily. Like, like boundaries. Yeah. Um, uh, that one, um,

1195
01:39:18.960 --> 01:39:23.920
well, see Jesus had, Jesus had boundaries. There were certain things that he would let people do

1196
01:39:23.920 --> 01:39:31.200
and not let people do in certain, um, he would heal some people and, um, that and, uh, leave

1197
01:39:31.200 --> 01:39:40.720
others where it, um, people have read and where it looks like he, he, how do I describe it? Um,

1198
01:39:41.440 --> 01:39:47.360
that Jesus chose what he did and didn't do. And he chose who he didn't, didn't, didn't interact

1199
01:39:47.360 --> 01:39:56.240
with. Um, but, uh, and what, what flack he would and wouldn't take. Um, so he even had his own

1200
01:39:56.240 --> 01:39:59.840
boundaries. So what we're doing is we are learning how.

1201
01:40:00.000 --> 01:40:06.280
all those boundaries look when we're operating out of love, because love isn't a free for

1202
01:40:06.280 --> 01:40:08.600
all fest.

1203
01:40:08.600 --> 01:40:15.680
Love has and has is very free flowing, but there's a structure within the free flowingness.

1204
01:40:15.680 --> 01:40:16.680
It's like a river.

1205
01:40:16.680 --> 01:40:24.280
I mean, there's, there's water can do whatever it wants to do, but there's still structure

1206
01:40:24.280 --> 01:40:26.120
in the element that it's still water.

1207
01:40:26.120 --> 01:40:31.840
So it's the same thing with like love and how it operates and how it manifests particular

1208
01:40:31.840 --> 01:40:34.760
boundaries is our interactions with other people.

1209
01:40:34.760 --> 01:40:39.720
We do have boundaries, what it is that they are and are not allowed to do, what we are,

1210
01:40:39.720 --> 01:40:46.000
what we will and will not choose to allow someone to do in their interactions with us.

1211
01:40:46.000 --> 01:40:50.280
And if we don't allow it, well, then we remove them, remove those people, if they're not

1212
01:40:50.280 --> 01:40:54.560
respecting those boundaries, because that their decision.

1213
01:40:54.560 --> 01:41:00.800
And so we are just, we're just expressing a boundary that we've all, that we already

1214
01:41:00.800 --> 01:41:01.800
have.

1215
01:41:01.800 --> 01:41:09.920
And so people can't do whatever they want to, to me, like people can't come and, and

1216
01:41:09.920 --> 01:41:16.440
sexually assault me just because they want to like, nope.

1217
01:41:16.440 --> 01:41:23.440
And and so, and I could, I can fight back, I can do whatever I had a stalker.

1218
01:41:23.440 --> 01:41:27.080
And, and I think I probably told you that.

1219
01:41:27.080 --> 01:41:31.760
So I had a stalker and I had, I've had a blog, I've had to block him on multiple channels

1220
01:41:31.760 --> 01:41:37.200
and I've had to do it more than once, because he just won't respect my boundaries.

1221
01:41:37.200 --> 01:41:46.840
And, and so I went, unfortunately too long because in, in expressing the boundaries that

1222
01:41:46.840 --> 01:41:54.400
I was verbally expressing, I went too long, actually blocking them than I should have.

1223
01:41:54.400 --> 01:41:57.280
And anyway, so lesson learned.

1224
01:41:57.280 --> 01:41:59.760
And I had someone questioned my boundaries.

1225
01:41:59.760 --> 01:42:04.960
He contacted me after I told him not to, I literally told him to never contact me again,

1226
01:42:04.960 --> 01:42:07.480
because the situation went on for years.

1227
01:42:07.480 --> 01:42:11.520
He didn't stalk me for years, but the situation went on for years where he was pursuing me

1228
01:42:11.520 --> 01:42:14.400
and it was just getting worse and worse and worse and worse.

1229
01:42:14.480 --> 01:42:20.720
And so I told him, I, it, things got like to here and they had been like that for a

1230
01:42:20.720 --> 01:42:21.720
long time.

1231
01:42:21.720 --> 01:42:27.960
And finally though, I drew my, I, I finally drew the last straw and he contacted me and

1232
01:42:27.960 --> 01:42:31.600
I told him to never contact me again.

1233
01:42:31.600 --> 01:42:33.480
And my dad told him that too.

1234
01:42:33.480 --> 01:42:38.440
And he didn't respect either me or my dad's requirement.

1235
01:42:38.440 --> 01:42:48.240
And he then, I think six months later, maybe, maybe a year later, he wrote, he used a different

1236
01:42:48.240 --> 01:42:51.000
email address than he'd had.

1237
01:42:51.000 --> 01:42:56.560
And so therefore it wasn't blocked, use a different email address and, and reached out

1238
01:42:56.560 --> 01:42:57.560
to me.

1239
01:42:57.560 --> 01:43:00.120
Well, I immediately deleted it without even reading it.

1240
01:43:00.120 --> 01:43:04.040
I didn't need to read it because I told him not to contact me anymore.

1241
01:43:04.040 --> 01:43:06.360
Now I didn't, I don't wish ill on him.

1242
01:43:06.360 --> 01:43:10.400
You know, I've submitted him to the Lord, Lord, he's your precious child, whatever you

1243
01:43:10.400 --> 01:43:13.400
want to do with, you know, pray that, you know, that you heal him.

1244
01:43:13.400 --> 01:43:16.400
He needs tremendous healing, all of that stuff.

1245
01:43:16.400 --> 01:43:20.880
You know, like what I was recommending that you do with Kimberly, send it to the Lord,

1246
01:43:20.880 --> 01:43:22.880
that he wasn't mine.

1247
01:43:22.880 --> 01:43:26.120
He had not been given to me by God to carry.

1248
01:43:26.120 --> 01:43:29.720
And so therefore I just, I submitted him.

1249
01:43:29.720 --> 01:43:34.920
I prayed for him in a way that I thought maybe nobody else would pray for him, give him Lord.

1250
01:43:34.920 --> 01:43:42.200
And then, but so when he contacted me, like, I don't need to worry about that.

1251
01:43:42.200 --> 01:43:43.200
I just delete it.

1252
01:43:43.200 --> 01:43:44.640
I'm not the only person who's live.

1253
01:43:44.640 --> 01:43:47.520
If he needs something, he can contact somebody else.

1254
01:43:47.520 --> 01:43:50.320
I don't need to know what he said.

1255
01:43:50.320 --> 01:43:56.200
Well, I mentioned it to somebody and I was like, oh yeah, well, so-and-so contacted me

1256
01:43:56.200 --> 01:44:00.600
again today and I just deleted it without even reading it.

1257
01:44:00.600 --> 01:44:04.000
And they were, they were upset at me.

1258
01:44:04.080 --> 01:44:09.920
The very first thing that they said was, Ashley, what if he was writing to ask you for forgiveness?

1259
01:44:09.920 --> 01:44:14.120
Are you never going to let him contact you to ask you for forgiveness?

1260
01:44:14.120 --> 01:44:21.040
No, because it's not that I don't forgive him, I already forgive him.

1261
01:44:21.040 --> 01:44:26.520
That he does not need to receive forgiveness from me in order to be forgiven.

1262
01:44:26.520 --> 01:44:28.400
God can give him that.

1263
01:44:28.400 --> 01:44:29.400
He does not.

1264
01:44:29.400 --> 01:44:34.080
So he's violating it in order for a godly reason.

1265
01:44:34.080 --> 01:44:35.080
Absolutely not.

1266
01:44:35.080 --> 01:44:38.400
I'm not saying that that's the way I would handle every situation.

1267
01:44:38.400 --> 01:44:40.400
Certain situations I would handle with girlfriends.

1268
01:44:40.400 --> 01:44:42.480
I don't know about your situation.

1269
01:44:42.480 --> 01:44:43.480
I don't know.

1270
01:44:43.480 --> 01:44:44.840
That one's, that one's a bit different.

1271
01:44:44.840 --> 01:44:46.640
I'm not saying that I know about that situation.

1272
01:44:46.640 --> 01:44:52.720
I'm just saying yours is a very extreme one because that was control and soulish access

1273
01:44:52.720 --> 01:44:54.120
that she had and all of that.

1274
01:44:54.120 --> 01:44:56.360
So I'm not saying that I'm, I'm not talking about your situation.

1275
01:44:56.360 --> 01:44:59.800
I'm just talking about like a friend hurt me or whatever.

1276
01:45:00.000 --> 01:45:04.040
you know, their situation, you know, that situation would be

1277
01:45:04.040 --> 01:45:11.240
different. But with this man, I finally just knew that I had

1278
01:45:11.240 --> 01:45:15.760
the right to draw these specific boundaries, and that he was

1279
01:45:15.760 --> 01:45:20.820
continually disrespecting. And so no, I didn't, I didn't, he

1280
01:45:20.820 --> 01:45:27.160
didn't need to. I didn't need to. Someone does not get access

1281
01:45:27.160 --> 01:45:32.920
to me, just because they want it. And even if they have a

1282
01:45:32.920 --> 01:45:36.560
quote unquote, godly reason that they're you're using a they're

1283
01:45:36.560 --> 01:45:41.760
using godly terms, like, I need forgiveness, I want you to you

1284
01:45:41.760 --> 01:45:48.440
because I, I have already released them. And that and they

1285
01:45:48.440 --> 01:45:52.600
can get and even if I hadn't released them, they are not

1286
01:45:52.600 --> 01:45:56.520
held in bondage, because someone else out there won't forgive

1287
01:45:56.520 --> 01:46:00.520
them. God can forgive them. God is the one who can release them

1288
01:46:00.520 --> 01:46:05.920
from their from from their, their situation. So my point is,

1289
01:46:06.920 --> 01:46:11.160
I've had to learn over over my life. And that's just one

1290
01:46:11.160 --> 01:46:16.800
example of where you can draw particular boundaries. One of

1291
01:46:16.800 --> 01:46:18.800
the things that I learned, though, is that I did wait too

1292
01:46:18.800 --> 01:46:23.400
long. I didn't even have to wait as long as I did. I could have

1293
01:46:23.400 --> 01:46:26.480
done it and been justified in doing so justified before the

1294
01:46:26.480 --> 01:46:32.840
Lord meaning a long time ago. But I didn't know that. And my,

1295
01:46:33.480 --> 01:46:36.320
I didn't know that I had the right to draw boundaries like

1296
01:46:36.320 --> 01:46:39.160
that, because I didn't think that was love. And we've done

1297
01:46:39.160 --> 01:46:43.040
ourselves a tremendous disservice in the church by not

1298
01:46:43.080 --> 01:46:46.680
understanding boundaries and thinking that it's all or

1299
01:46:46.680 --> 01:46:50.920
nothing. And, and that's not true. Even Jesus had boundaries.

1300
01:46:51.040 --> 01:46:56.800
He didn't write people off. But he gave them over to the Lord.

1301
01:46:57.040 --> 01:47:03.480
But it didn't mean that everyone had chosen and how they

1302
01:47:03.480 --> 01:47:13.200
interacted with him to what would you say that they had

1303
01:47:13.200 --> 01:47:23.360
given themselves to him in a way that respected, respected

1304
01:47:23.360 --> 01:47:26.360
his boundaries, and how they were and were not allowed to

1305
01:47:26.360 --> 01:47:30.680
interact with him. Like if someone who receives love, you

1306
01:47:30.680 --> 01:47:35.120
know, is looking to receive love doesn't mean that they need to

1307
01:47:35.120 --> 01:47:40.360
go and abuse somebody else sexually. Like, you see,

1308
01:47:40.360 --> 01:47:43.080
there's just boundaries. And anyway, and I know that that's

1309
01:47:43.080 --> 01:47:46.400
a very extreme example. But my point is to just, I was just

1310
01:47:46.400 --> 01:47:46.960
trying to make point.

1311
01:47:47.840 --> 01:47:50.840
I think and I appreciate that, because that totally makes sense.

1312
01:47:50.840 --> 01:47:54.720
And I, I think part of me, it's almost like a fear of me not

1313
01:47:54.720 --> 01:47:59.960
having the strength if she if she, when she has reached out to

1314
01:47:59.960 --> 01:48:04.400
me, and I've had the strong boundaries, there's something

1315
01:48:04.400 --> 01:48:10.160
about that relationship that I don't have the strength to keep

1316
01:48:10.160 --> 01:48:13.560
the boundary strong when she does certain things, which is

1317
01:48:13.560 --> 01:48:18.760
so I feel like, is that fear is am I making the blocking

1318
01:48:18.760 --> 01:48:22.960
decision from fear from not being strong enough, like if I

1319
01:48:22.960 --> 01:48:27.560
was strong enough, and I was love based and not in fear, I

1320
01:48:27.560 --> 01:48:30.080
feel like I would be able to have the number unblocked and

1321
01:48:30.080 --> 01:48:33.800
not worry about it, it would just be like another person, but

1322
01:48:33.800 --> 01:48:35.200
it still has power over me.

1323
01:48:35.840 --> 01:48:37.920
Well, yeah, but you're still growing in that. And you're

1324
01:48:37.920 --> 01:48:39.960
still learning that. And that's what I was explaining about the

1325
01:48:39.960 --> 01:48:43.120
you just act wherever your faith is at. And that's okay,

1326
01:48:43.360 --> 01:48:45.840
you're not going to be there forever. But you are right now,

1327
01:48:46.040 --> 01:48:47.920
which is more than you were yesterday.

1328
01:48:49.280 --> 01:48:53.440
More than you were 10 years ago. So it's this process and we did

1329
01:48:53.440 --> 01:48:56.200
and God doesn't look at us as lack of like, see, she's not

1330
01:48:56.200 --> 01:49:00.640
strong enough. He's like, see, she is now strong enough that

1331
01:49:00.640 --> 01:49:05.120
she and believes me enough that she's now doing this. Because

1332
01:49:05.120 --> 01:49:11.160
and so it is you acting on who it is that that you have heard

1333
01:49:11.160 --> 01:49:14.760
from the Lord that he is and that you are, and you're acting

1334
01:49:14.760 --> 01:49:19.080
in the measure that you understand it. And to this

1335
01:49:19.080 --> 01:49:22.480
point, and you're going to understand it more later. And

1336
01:49:22.480 --> 01:49:28.520
so my point is, God honors it. So it's important that you honor

1337
01:49:28.520 --> 01:49:31.960
it, that you honor that in yourself, because we're not a

1338
01:49:31.960 --> 01:49:32.640
better judge.

1339
01:49:36.240 --> 01:49:39.520
Yeah, I was gonna say like, not trying to be further along,

1340
01:49:39.520 --> 01:49:42.520
maybe then we are maybe that's part of the problem is I want to

1341
01:49:42.520 --> 01:49:46.280
be. I want to be so faithful that that stuff doesn't bother

1342
01:49:46.280 --> 01:49:48.200
me. And maybe I'm not quite

1343
01:49:48.240 --> 01:49:52.600
which is good. But which is but it's a desire for you know, of

1344
01:49:52.600 --> 01:49:55.560
your heart that the Lord is going to fulfill. But it doesn't

1345
01:49:55.560 --> 01:49:58.000
mean that we need to see ourselves as a problem until

1346
01:49:58.000 --> 01:50:00.040
then. It's just something someplace

1347
01:50:00.000 --> 01:50:05.760
that we're going. Um, if, if you are, my brother told me this one time, he's like, Ashley,

1348
01:50:05.760 --> 01:50:13.440
he's like, you're always trying to be so much more, um, than your age. And he didn't mean

1349
01:50:13.440 --> 01:50:19.040
this like literally like how old I was, he was referring to like decisions I would make action.

1350
01:50:19.040 --> 01:50:22.400
Um, my faith, I was always down on myself. It was always, you know, it was just getting

1351
01:50:22.400 --> 01:50:26.080
onto myself. I wasn't enough. I wasn't strong enough hearing you talk. I'm like, oh, my word,

1352
01:50:26.080 --> 01:50:31.680
that sounds like me talking. Um, uh, and he told me, and so he told me this and it just

1353
01:50:31.680 --> 01:50:36.640
really stuck with me. He told me this maybe two years ago, he said, Ashley, he said,

1354
01:50:37.760 --> 01:50:44.080
if you're five, it's okay to be five. You don't need to be six. You're not six yet.

1355
01:50:44.800 --> 01:50:51.520
He said, if you are five years old, it is appropriate for you to be five. It is not

1356
01:50:51.520 --> 01:50:58.800
appropriate for you to be six. And if you are six before you allow yourself to be five

1357
01:50:59.680 --> 01:51:04.720
developmentally, you will have gaps. It's like you are very wise.

1358
01:51:06.160 --> 01:51:13.040
Good point. Very good point. Yeah, I know. And why do you think that you wanted to be

1359
01:51:14.240 --> 01:51:19.040
older than you were like, or wiser or like, why do you, where was the motivation in that?

1360
01:51:19.120 --> 01:51:26.320
Do you think? Because I thought that anything short of what I saw as, um, perfection or as

1361
01:51:26.320 --> 01:51:30.960
believing, um, having complete faith, you know, all the things that you've been talking about,

1362
01:51:30.960 --> 01:51:37.600
anything short of that wasn't, um, meant that I was in a place of lack and that I, um, I was

1363
01:51:37.600 --> 01:51:45.040
without God's full approval, love and pleasure. And that I wanted more of it because I felt I

1364
01:51:45.040 --> 01:51:51.440
didn't have enough to sustain me. And I didn't know that I already had all of it. And that by

1365
01:51:51.440 --> 01:51:59.360
maturing, I didn't gain anymore because you can't gain on an eternal love. You can't gain on the

1366
01:51:59.360 --> 01:52:08.240
fact that you already have all of the love that God is not just has, but is, and that I personally

1367
01:52:08.240 --> 01:52:14.320
believe it's ever expanding that it kind of like the universe is always expanding. I believe that

1368
01:52:14.320 --> 01:52:20.400
God, um, is, is ever expanding. Um, I don't have a scripture I can give you for that. It's just my,

1369
01:52:20.400 --> 01:52:25.440
my personal belief. And, um, that is something that we're never going to come to the end to,

1370
01:52:25.440 --> 01:52:29.840
um, and, uh, which I know that that doesn't really sound like it makes sense because it's

1371
01:52:29.840 --> 01:52:33.920
kind of like, well, isn't God already is, and he didn't like grow, whatever. I don't fully

1372
01:52:33.920 --> 01:52:38.080
understand how to describe it. I just, you get this sense that if he created the universe where

1373
01:52:38.080 --> 01:52:43.840
it's ever expanding, why wouldn't he be ever expanding where we could never get to the end

1374
01:52:43.840 --> 01:52:50.640
of them? Um, not because he's so vast and we're so small and they're so far to go that like it's

1375
01:52:50.640 --> 01:52:57.200
always, it's always expanding. Um, so anyway, my point is that if I'm already all of the love that

1376
01:52:57.200 --> 01:53:03.760
he ever, and his love towards me, his attention, his pleasure, his delight is, you know, his favor,

1377
01:53:03.760 --> 01:53:09.840
his eyes on me, whatever is already to the fullest of the, his very being the essence of its very

1378
01:53:09.840 --> 01:53:17.520
being will be in, um, uh, why, uh, then there's nothing else for me to attain to. I'm not in a

1379
01:53:17.520 --> 01:53:22.800
place of black. And so therefore it's the kindness of God. Like if he is all of those things, and if

1380
01:53:22.800 --> 01:53:30.400
he thinks that way towards me already, you know, why don't I want to mature more if I already have

1381
01:53:30.400 --> 01:53:37.680
everything because I'm not gaining anything else. I already have it. Um, I just get to operate in

1382
01:53:37.680 --> 01:53:43.600
more and more and more. Um, anyway, but yeah, it was, it was feeling, I was in a place of lack and

1383
01:53:43.600 --> 01:53:48.400
he wasn't, um, he wasn't pleased with me and I always needed more. And I was always that anything

1384
01:53:48.400 --> 01:53:54.720
short of perfection meant that I was a problem. And so I always had to be more than what I was.

1385
01:53:55.760 --> 01:54:00.720
Well, and I love, I love your image about like the universe expanding and God expanding. Cause

1386
01:54:00.720 --> 01:54:06.800
it makes me think if God's ever expanding, then doesn't it make sense that we would be ever

1387
01:54:06.800 --> 01:54:11.120
expanding too, right? Correct. Cause we're in him. So we're ever expanding. Correct.

1388
01:54:13.600 --> 01:54:21.120
They're not, they're not like boxed. Maybe there is no like finish line necessarily. Maybe it's

1389
01:54:21.120 --> 01:54:28.880
just like being, being in agreement might kind of be the finish line, but I don't know. I mean,

1390
01:54:28.880 --> 01:54:35.200
if God's always expanding, I feel like if we could live every moment of every day in agreement,

1391
01:54:35.200 --> 01:54:40.560
that would kind of be in my eyes, like the epitome of being in Christ, like abiding in

1392
01:54:40.560 --> 01:54:46.240
him is just being in agreement. Right. Yeah. So, and then probably that agreement keeps expanding

1393
01:54:46.240 --> 01:54:50.800
because we keep agreeing to new things because new circumstances come into our lives, new

1394
01:54:50.800 --> 01:54:56.160
opportunities to keep agreeing. Right. Right. And then we, we mature to the point where we

1395
01:54:56.160 --> 01:54:59.840
understand, begin to understand how to start co-creating with the Lord.

1396
01:55:00.000 --> 01:55:04.000
If he is, if he creates and we're made in his image, then we're creators.

1397
01:55:04.000 --> 01:55:13.000
And so how do we do that? How do we do that with the Lord and then so we'll be able to over and over, you know, eternity and create more with them.

1398
01:55:13.000 --> 01:55:26.000
That's what I personally believe. So, interesting. So it goes from like being in agreement with him. And once we are kind of in agreement with him to this like degree, whatever that is.

1399
01:55:26.000 --> 01:55:40.000
Then we co-create with him even more kind of like part of his purpose for us in is coming into agreement and then, because then we are agreeing we're an overcomer we're agreeing that we're victorious.

1400
01:55:40.000 --> 01:55:51.000
And then we co create because we're like how would you explain that because he's in us and we're in him, therefore we can because we've come into agreement fully is that is that the idea.

1401
01:55:51.000 --> 01:55:59.000
Well, personally, I believe that we co create with him according to, and we can do it right now, according to the degree that we're in agreement with him.

1402
01:55:59.000 --> 01:56:03.000
So in our agreement with him, if we're ever expanding.

1403
01:56:03.000 --> 01:56:16.000
He's ever expanding we're ever expanding our agreement with him is ever expanding, then our, our maturing to being able to levels of co creating with him is ever expanding and eternity.

1404
01:56:16.000 --> 01:56:23.000
Does that make sense. So, where it's not something it's not like okay we agree with him to an extent and once that's done well then this starts.

1405
01:56:23.000 --> 01:56:33.000
I think it's that it's it's parallel and it's layered it's like we are we co create with him according to the degree to which we're in agreement with him.

1406
01:56:33.000 --> 01:56:46.000
So yes, there's more that will be able to do is we mature and our maturity is the level to which we agree with him and we manifest it and we walk it out and we manifest it into our soul and our body, which is a result of the green.

1407
01:56:46.000 --> 01:56:51.000
And then we agree with them is the level to which we can create.

1408
01:56:51.000 --> 01:56:54.000
Therefore, if we're already in agreement with him to a certain extent.

1409
01:56:54.000 --> 01:57:01.000
There's, we can currently currently are already creating him.

1410
01:57:01.000 --> 01:57:05.000
I love our deep conversations.

1411
01:57:05.000 --> 01:57:06.000
Yeah.

1412
01:57:06.000 --> 01:57:12.000
Yeah, we go like deep deep deep right deep deep that's right. That's the types of conversations I enjoy.

1413
01:57:12.000 --> 01:57:19.000
Yeah, me too, for sure. And so you, you're in Colorado now which is right here in Colorado now.

1414
01:57:19.000 --> 01:57:25.000
Yeah, which is, I don't know if you can see, you probably can't see a little bit.

1415
01:57:26.000 --> 01:57:36.000
I'm up on a mountain in a six bedroom six bath chalet up in the mountains.

1416
01:57:36.000 --> 01:57:39.000
It is huge.

1417
01:57:39.000 --> 01:57:53.000
And the ski room below it below so it's got five levels. The ski room below is, is, is the size of an apartment all by itself and it's just this.

1418
01:57:53.000 --> 01:58:00.000
Anyway, so some new friends that I've made, who invited me up. So there's like one.

1419
01:58:00.000 --> 01:58:12.000
I think there's six of us currently I think there's six men, six women, and we're all here at her grandparents chalet.

1420
01:58:12.000 --> 01:58:18.000
Yeah, that they built for their family. So anyway, I just got where.

1421
01:58:18.000 --> 01:58:26.000
So, it's so funny because whenever you talk about Colorado that's where I did like all of my almost all my climbers summit.

1422
01:58:26.000 --> 01:58:33.000
So, it was like we would fly into Denver and then from Denver we would drive up to the Silver Cliff Ranch which was in.

1423
01:58:33.000 --> 01:58:37.000
I can't even tell you is way up in the mountains like three hours from the airport.

1424
01:58:37.000 --> 01:58:43.000
But, but it's funny because because Kimberly lives in Durango. Okay.

1425
01:58:43.000 --> 01:58:50.000
And if you ever stop in Durango and you, you know, run into someone who looks like that woman in the video.

1426
01:58:50.000 --> 01:58:53.000
Now I know.

1427
01:58:53.000 --> 01:58:57.000
I wonder how I know Durango Colorado. I wonder if I've been to drink.

1428
01:58:57.000 --> 01:58:59.000
I don't remember.

1429
01:58:59.000 --> 01:59:05.000
Yeah, like I have friends who live kind of in that area I love Colorado it's just the memories.

1430
01:59:06.000 --> 01:59:24.000
I'm sorry, but you were, but ask the Lord as much as how to that he would redeem all of those things as much as possible, because all of those things that you've experienced and all of those, those traumas and ways that you were violated.

1431
01:59:25.000 --> 01:59:28.000
Those things are not.

1432
01:59:28.000 --> 01:59:34.000
Those things are not you. And those things are not.

1433
01:59:34.000 --> 01:59:48.000
They don't, they don't have any ownership over you. And there's no reason for you to not be able to go certain places do certain things, whatever.

1434
01:59:48.000 --> 01:59:52.000
You are a son of God that has your own free will.

1435
01:59:52.000 --> 02:00:00.000
And, and, and God delights in one of his greatest delights is that we execute. According to our faith.

1436
02:00:00.000 --> 02:00:03.760
well. So anyway, just something for you to be praying to him and talk to him about that,

1437
02:00:03.760 --> 02:00:09.520
because I, I know what that's like where we're, um, um, and hopefully Colorado is not like that

1438
02:00:09.520 --> 02:00:18.720
for you, but for me, certain places are tainted because, um, I still haven't owned the fact that

1439
02:00:18.720 --> 02:00:25.200
I am a son of God, my own free will, and that those, that those places do not own me for the

1440
02:00:25.200 --> 02:00:31.760
memories. And, and therefore I can't be around them or whatever. Um, and I'm allowing it to

1441
02:00:31.760 --> 02:00:36.800
have too much power. Same thing with like, like, like Kimberly right now, there's entirely too

1442
02:00:36.800 --> 02:00:42.560
much power that she still holds over you, like, even without being in connection. And that

1443
02:00:42.560 --> 02:00:47.440
thankfully that's something that you have a choice, uh, meaning that's not in condemnation.

1444
02:00:47.440 --> 02:00:51.920
That's meant as a good thing of like, well, that's according to my choice. And so therefore

1445
02:00:51.920 --> 02:00:57.120
I can free myself because God has already declared me to be free. So I can come into

1446
02:00:57.120 --> 02:01:01.040
agreement with it. And that's that whole like breaking connections, et cetera. So the reason

1447
02:01:01.040 --> 02:01:07.440
I thought about all that is the memories related to Colorado is, um, I've just had, and, um, I've

1448
02:01:07.440 --> 02:01:12.640
had memories connected to certain things and I still have memories connected to certain things

1449
02:01:12.640 --> 02:01:18.480
that certain places that bring memory that bring those things up in me and they, and they trigger

1450
02:01:18.480 --> 02:01:23.120
and God's like, yeah, it's that Ashley, I understand because I do understand.

1451
02:01:23.120 --> 02:01:29.760
And so I allow you to have distance from this things now, but no, eventually that I desire

1452
02:01:29.760 --> 02:01:34.320
for you to operate in the freedom that you already are in. And I want you to know that you have that

1453
02:01:34.320 --> 02:01:39.360
much freedom, but until you know that you have that much freedom and allow distance in order

1454
02:01:39.360 --> 02:01:45.280
to make sure that you, you live knowing what freedom is like, meaning you don't have to have

1455
02:01:45.280 --> 02:01:50.720
pain because you're not being triggered. But then eventually it's like, I want you to understand

1456
02:01:50.720 --> 02:01:54.560
that you don't even have to be triggered now that you know what it's like to have freedom

1457
02:01:54.560 --> 02:01:57.840
now experience freedom in the place where you used to feel enslaved.

1458
02:01:59.840 --> 02:02:03.760
So interesting. It reminds me of this story. So, you know, the story about like John F. Kennedy,

1459
02:02:03.760 --> 02:02:12.080
Jr. and his assassination in Texas and, um, No, I don't remember. Wasn't John F. Kennedy,

1460
02:02:12.080 --> 02:02:19.280
Jr. or John F. Kennedy? The president. Yeah. The president. Cause I was going to say,

1461
02:02:19.280 --> 02:02:24.400
I think that John F. Kennedy, Jr. wasn't that his son. Okay. Yeah. Sorry. I apologize. Um,

1462
02:02:26.560 --> 02:02:32.880
Martin Luther King Jr. and anyway, JFK. Yes. When he was assassinated in like the Dallas area,

1463
02:02:32.880 --> 02:02:38.800
right. Correct. Yeah. I used to drive on that street across the X on this street every day.

1464
02:02:39.600 --> 02:02:45.280
Yeah. It's like crazy. I remember when we went to, um, that conference last summer,

1465
02:02:45.280 --> 02:02:48.800
we went there cause we were going around Dallas. I'd never been there before.

1466
02:02:48.800 --> 02:02:57.600
And so we, um, the guy, I watched a documentary once on the guy who was the bodyguard for JFK

1467
02:02:57.600 --> 02:03:03.600
and Jackie on the car. He was the guy that was like on the back of the car and he climbed on

1468
02:03:03.680 --> 02:03:10.080
the back of the car. So there was watching this documentary of him sharing that experience and

1469
02:03:10.080 --> 02:03:16.880
how he didn't, he couldn't go back to that site for like, I think it was 30 years or 40 years.

1470
02:03:17.600 --> 02:03:25.920
He was so scared to go back. And he was saying that when, when he did after whatever it was 30,

1471
02:03:25.920 --> 02:03:32.480
40 years, he's like, I should have done it so much sooner because it was so like,

1472
02:03:33.360 --> 02:03:39.520
it took away a lot of the power it had over me. I couldn't be there. I couldn't go back to that

1473
02:03:39.520 --> 02:03:44.000
place. But once I did, once I looked at the window where the shooter was, once I looked at the spot,

1474
02:03:44.720 --> 02:03:50.560
it took the power away from me or the power over me away. And I was like, that's so interesting.

1475
02:03:50.560 --> 02:03:57.120
It's almost like when we face it and like go into that moment where it does lose its power,

1476
02:03:57.120 --> 02:04:02.880
it's like feeling the fear and getting it anyway. Right. Yeah, correct. So I feel like at some

1477
02:04:02.880 --> 02:04:08.400
point, you know, I'll end up in Colorado again to visit friends or something. And it would be nice

1478
02:04:09.280 --> 02:04:15.280
to go back there and not have those triggers of like flying into Denver. And because again,

1479
02:04:15.280 --> 02:04:19.920
like it was such an amazing time of my life and such an awful time of my life at the same time.

1480
02:04:20.640 --> 02:04:26.080
So you have great memories of it. And I have awful memories of it. So it's like, really,

1481
02:04:26.080 --> 02:04:32.880
it's weird, right? It's very strange. So I'm, I'm in that place. Like, I don't want these things to

1482
02:04:32.880 --> 02:04:38.240
have power over me. So yeah, I'll just be, I'll definitely be seeking God on that. Because I know

1483
02:04:38.240 --> 02:04:43.360
he's breaking it day by day, week by week, month by month. He's been breaking this like,

1484
02:04:43.360 --> 02:04:47.040
if you would have talked to me two years ago, oh my gosh, you probably wouldn't have even

1485
02:04:47.040 --> 02:04:54.240
recognized me. I was still very indoctrinated, still, like beginning of the healing. So I'm

1486
02:04:54.240 --> 02:04:58.800
much better now. So I'm grateful for that. And I think it's just not being hard on myself about

1487
02:04:58.800 --> 02:05:00.000
the fact that I might not be where

1488
02:05:00.000 --> 02:05:05.760
I'd like to be but I'm still on the journey of this is where I am now. I'm five. I don't want

1489
02:05:05.760 --> 02:05:10.640
to skip that because that gap that picture was really good from your brother so thank you for

1490
02:05:10.640 --> 02:05:18.320
that. You're welcome. Yeah so well have fun. How long are you there for? Almost a week.

1491
02:05:20.480 --> 02:05:27.440
Cool well have a good time. I'm sure you will and yeah thanks for the chat. I appreciate all

1492
02:05:27.440 --> 02:05:33.600
your insight and wisdom. Thank you. You're welcome. It's good to visit with you. You too

1493
02:05:33.600 --> 02:05:44.960
and I'm sure we'll talk soon. Yeah sounds good. You take care. Thank you. You too. Bye. Bye.