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Welcome to the empower you podcast.

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I have with me today, Michael, who's a former FBI agent who has worked exclusively in child

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and sex trafficking.

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And through getting to know Michael over the last few months, it's been apparent to me

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that he has such a unique position in relation to our society, our culture, that there's

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really big time demons at work.

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And as many of you know, because of the media, we had the movie come out, Sound of Freedom.

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And for that, we had taken with Liam Neeson.

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There's definitely been a widespread interest in this area.

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And I think most of us, myself included, would say we we knew something about it, Michael,

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but we didn't know that it was as widespread as it is.

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And we also didn't know that it's coming to our shore.

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I mean, it's it's it's almost comforting to think that it's out there.

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But now we're realizing more and more that it's actually in America in a big way in our

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even our cities here.

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But to get started, Michael, tell us a little bit about yourself.

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You you actually grew up in Colorado Springs and came from a Christian home.

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So sounds like you had a great upbringing.

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Yes.

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And Steve, thank you for letting me come here and speak with you all.

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I appreciate it very much.

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Yeah, so I did.

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I grew up in a Christian home, have, you know, parents who love Jesus and then serve in Jesus

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and in different missionary organizations for the last 40, 45 years now.

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And then we we moved here when I was in high school and went here to Colorado Springs Christian

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school for high school before going off to the military.

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So, Michael, you went on and you went to West Point.

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I did.

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So you wanted to have a military career.

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Yeah.

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And my dad has worked in military ministry for his entire life.

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So he was he was in the military himself and he was working with cadets quite a bit here

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at the Air Force Academy.

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So I grew up around cadets, grew up around Air Force guys, Navy, Army.

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When I started looking at where I wanted to go, I put in for all the all the academies.

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Only one took me.

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So that's where I went.

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Well, that's great.

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And so then how many how long were you in the Army?

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So after I graduated, I was in for about six years as an infantry officer.

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OK.

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And then how in the world did you go from Christian Army?

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The first part I get, OK, get that.

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But how did you get into the FBI and the bureau?

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I didn't know anything about law enforcement growing up.

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I didn't have any family members or anything like that that were in law enforcement.

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Even when I was in the military, I didn't know much about it.

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I didn't know anything about the FBI or DEA, ATF.

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I had no idea what the different organizations did.

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Back in one of my deployments, I was in Afghanistan and had three agents attached to my my platoon

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at the time.

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And they were just really good guys who I saw really had a heart for what they were

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doing.

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They talked throughout that deployment.

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They talked to me a lot about what the bureau does, what their mission is.

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Some of the specific organizations within the bureau that I might find of interest.

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And so over the I didn't actually at the time, I just I said, thank you.

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But I'm going to be staying in the Army for 20 years.

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And a couple of years later, after some more deployments and more time away, I decided

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I wanted I wanted to move on and be a be a good father, be a good husband, be home more.

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And then I started putting in applications for different places and decided, you know

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what?

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Let's let's put one into the FBI.

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I'm sure I'll not get in because it's pretty competitive.

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But ended up actually that was one of the first job offers I got.

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And so I prayed about it.

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And that's where the Lord took me.

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How many years were you in the FBI?

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15 years.

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15 years.

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So did you right out of the chute move into this arena of sex trafficking, child trafficking,

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this kind of arena?

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Or did that kind of gradually happen over time?

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I would say this started with my wife, really.

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She started getting just had a heart for what was going on back in like maybe 2010, 2012.

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She started partnering with some organizations that were already involved in helping women

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overseas.

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There's some some really good ones out there that do micro loans and help women build businesses

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internationally so that they don't get into a place, a cycle where they are now are desperate

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for money and they have other options.

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So she started partnering with some of those organizations.

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And then over the next four or five years, I was on I was on the hostage rescue team

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with the FBI.

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And I had a pretty unique just I got to see a lot of the world, got to see a lot of the

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United States.

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And over over those 10 years.

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The Lord kind of started putting more in my heart, like,

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hey, this is the direction I want you to go someday.

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I thought he meant at 50, when I could retire.

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And I did not plan on leaving early.

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And so when I came across the organization

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that I now work for, I argued with them about it

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because the timing was not,

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that was not the timing I was planning on.

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And then-

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So God's timing is a little bit different

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than ours sometimes, right?

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Oh yeah, quite a bit.

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And I was like, this can't be the right time to do this.

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But over six or eight months,

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he just kind of kept chipping away at me.

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This is the way I want you to go.

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I'm not gonna show you what it's gonna look like yet,

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but I do want you to obey me.

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And that was hard.

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I'll be honest, like walking away from,

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you know, 25 years of government without anything

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to show for it, if you will, that was a hard choice.

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I, you know, I have a family to provide for

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and I want to make sure I can still provide for them.

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So this was a pretty large leap of faith.

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So what was it?

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I mean, what was it that God was doing in your heart?

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What were you observing?

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What was ministering to your heart

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that you'd be willing to give up your retirement

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in order to go in and go with this ministry?

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Can you share what the ministry is?

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Yeah, so there's a couple different organizations

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that I work for, but the primary one

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that I left the Bureau to come work for

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is called Freedom Shield Foundation.

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What I'll tell you first off is that

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they love Jesus a lot.

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The executive director of Freedom Shield

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is a very godly woman who spent a lot of time

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with victims in the last 12 to 15 years now

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across multiple spectrums of trauma.

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She spent months in Iraq with ISIS victims,

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women who had been captured by ISIS,

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trafficked up into Syria, sold between ISIS fighters,

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and she spent a lot of time with those women

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trying to help them survive after they got back

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because what we started to see was that there were,

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you know, we had got them into a safe place.

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They were no longer in harm's way.

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They were no longer being trafficked and raped.

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However, the trauma of that was more than

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many of them could deal with.

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And so she, you know, as she likes to describe,

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sat in a tent with Jesus for about a month

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and asked him how to help them.

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And he gave her some, he gave her a plan,

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a program, if you will, and that's what she's been using

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ever since with victims across the world.

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But I see Jesus in her.

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The other person I work for is on another,

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our international arm, which is called Hawkwood Foundation,

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and Ro is the executive director of that.

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You know, I think in some ways,

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both he and Carrie, in their own ways,

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are some of the most godly people I've ever seen

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in a practical way in how to live out their faith,

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not just to people that they don't know,

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but to the people that work around them and for them.

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That was the first thing that attracted me, to be honest.

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The work is the other half of that,

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and that's rescuing people who can't rescue themselves.

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Like, they're in places where they can't

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get out of harm's way, and nobody's coming for them,

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and that's internationally and domestically.

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And I have, I do believe God has made me a protector.

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I do believe God's called me to that job,

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and that's what I've, I felt like I did

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for those 20, 25 years in the government,

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and I feel that he's given me the ability

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to take all that experience and all those lessons learned

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and apply it in a different way now.

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So tell me what you did with the FBI

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that's related to this that kinda was eye-opening

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and convicting to your heart as you did it.

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Yeah, so I did a variety of investigations.

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I worked counterterrorism investigations.

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I was on that tactical team.

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I mentioned HRT for about 10 years.

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During that time, you know, it is,

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HRT is a phenomenal organization within the FBI

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that has some of the most talented people

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I've ever had the privilege to work alongside of.

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Extremely motivated, outside the box,

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high-performing, HRT has the ability,

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they're responsible domestically

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for any kind of hostage situation or terrorism event

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as far as a tactical response goes.

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Local law enforcement often has to immediately respond,

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and then if the incident's still going on,

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HRT is usually brought in.

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What does HRT mean?

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Hostage Rescue Team.

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So it's the FBI's full-time tactical team.

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Think of them as the local federal law enforcement

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equivalent of many of the same responsibilities

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that Delta Force has and SEAL Team Six has.

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So anything from large-scale hostage situations

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to boat take-backs to aircraft take-back.

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You know, if there's an Alpine.

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incident, if they have a military free fall program,

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like, they do everything.

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They're a phenomenal group of people.

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So that's where a lot of that initial experience came from.

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When I moved here a couple years ago,

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I started working down in Pueblo,

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working with a partner of mine,

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actually a former teammate,

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phenomenal individual who taught me a lot.

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And he'd been here for a couple years

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and he'd work in gangs and dope and trafficking,

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child pornography, violent crimes against children,

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just everything.

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When you're in a small office,

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you kind of have to work everything.

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That's when I started getting more and more of a glimpse

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into what's going on locally.

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So is that surprising to you?

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That here we are in the United States,

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kind of, I would say, middle class,

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even upper middle class in Colorado Springs,

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probably lower middle class in Pueblo,

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that all this was going on with...

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Let me ask you something.

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I'm not even sure I'm saying it right.

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Would you call it child trafficking?

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Would you call it sex trafficking?

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Would you use both interchangeably?

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Sure.

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So within the realm of human trafficking,

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the four primary categories are sex trafficking,

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child soldiers, slave labor, and then organ trafficking.

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So sex trafficking would encompass any time

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that a person is being sold for money

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or for some sort of other compensation

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for sexual purposes.

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So whether it's an adult or a child,

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both would fall under sex trafficking.

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The legal parameters of sex trafficking for a child

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is different than it is for an adult,

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in the sense that a child cannot give consent for sex

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if they're being held against their will,

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whereas an adult has the ability to make a decision

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and actually say, I consent to this.

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So from a legal point of view,

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sex trafficking of a minor is much easier to prove

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because you don't have to prove coercion,

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versus with an adult, you have to prove some sort of,

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some sort of coercion.

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It could be violence, could be you have their IDs.

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It could be, there's a whole bunch of different ways

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that you can coerce a person,

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but with adults, that proof is tougher to do

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versus with a child.

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If the child's in somebody's control and was being sold,

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like, that's fairly straightforward.

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So this is happening in America.

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00:12:21.800 --> 00:12:22.640
Yeah, it is.

255
00:12:22.640 --> 00:12:26.880
So I was talking to another individual

256
00:12:26.880 --> 00:12:30.520
in a similar background as yourself,

257
00:12:30.520 --> 00:12:34.520
and he was telling me that he felt that America

258
00:12:34.520 --> 00:12:37.440
was probably number one in the world

259
00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:42.440
as far as a purveyor of sex trafficking,

260
00:12:44.440 --> 00:12:48.160
human trafficking, and probably child trafficking.

261
00:12:48.160 --> 00:12:49.760
We didn't go through all those categories

262
00:12:49.760 --> 00:12:50.960
that you just mentioned,

263
00:12:51.120 --> 00:12:54.720
especially along the seaboard.

264
00:12:54.720 --> 00:12:57.520
So he was talking about it being around,

265
00:12:57.520 --> 00:13:00.520
like, Louisiana, Mississippi, Texas,

266
00:13:00.520 --> 00:13:03.240
coming all really packed in along there,

267
00:13:03.240 --> 00:13:05.040
and they have some kind of a code

268
00:13:06.480 --> 00:13:08.200
by which they track these things,

269
00:13:08.200 --> 00:13:10.840
and it's really red down in there.

270
00:13:12.160 --> 00:13:14.920
And then also on the border with Mexico and stuff.

271
00:13:14.920 --> 00:13:18.360
Is that, that seemed to fit with what you discovered too,

272
00:13:18.440 --> 00:13:22.440
or were you more international than national?

273
00:13:22.440 --> 00:13:25.600
So on the investigations that I was doing here

274
00:13:25.600 --> 00:13:28.600
local in Colorado, it was more local to Colorado.

275
00:13:28.600 --> 00:13:31.240
I would say the guys that are working on the border areas

276
00:13:31.240 --> 00:13:34.520
do see this more often because human smuggling

277
00:13:34.520 --> 00:13:36.680
often turns into human trafficking.

278
00:13:36.680 --> 00:13:37.880
So somebody who's-

279
00:13:37.880 --> 00:13:39.040
Tell us the difference.

280
00:13:39.040 --> 00:13:41.240
So smuggling is basically just getting someone

281
00:13:41.240 --> 00:13:44.000
across a border and moving them into a location

282
00:13:44.000 --> 00:13:47.080
that they, without proper paperwork, let's just say that,

283
00:13:47.960 --> 00:13:49.840
you know, a lot of the human smuggling routes

284
00:13:49.840 --> 00:13:51.440
are the same routes that people are using

285
00:13:51.440 --> 00:13:56.440
to smuggle in arms, drugs, all kinds of other stuff

286
00:13:57.440 --> 00:13:59.600
that they can sell in the black market.

287
00:13:59.600 --> 00:14:02.480
So a lot of these smuggling routes can be similar.

288
00:14:02.480 --> 00:14:04.560
What often happens with someone who's smuggled

289
00:14:04.560 --> 00:14:06.760
into another country is that they often

290
00:14:06.760 --> 00:14:10.080
have had their documents taken, or they have no documents,

291
00:14:10.080 --> 00:14:11.720
and then in order to get documents

292
00:14:11.720 --> 00:14:15.360
or to get their documents back, they often have to pay, right?

293
00:14:15.360 --> 00:14:16.760
And so if they couldn't pay up front,

294
00:14:17.440 --> 00:14:18.280
then they pay afterwards.

295
00:14:18.280 --> 00:14:19.960
If they have to pay afterwards,

296
00:14:19.960 --> 00:14:22.000
that usually involves some sort of service.

297
00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:23.440
It could be slave labor.

298
00:14:23.440 --> 00:14:26.160
It could be working in a kitchen and being paid nothing.

299
00:14:26.160 --> 00:14:28.600
It could be sex trafficking.

300
00:14:28.600 --> 00:14:30.720
Even sometimes there's times where folks

301
00:14:30.720 --> 00:14:32.320
are maybe giving up an organ

302
00:14:32.320 --> 00:14:35.160
in order to repay their smuggling.

303
00:14:35.160 --> 00:14:38.480
So what happens is that can easily turn into trafficking.

304
00:14:38.480 --> 00:14:40.840
So smuggling, there's a lot of smuggling going on

305
00:14:40.840 --> 00:14:42.480
and starting all the way from South America

306
00:14:42.480 --> 00:14:44.320
through Central America and then up.

307
00:14:44.320 --> 00:14:46.500
And a lot of these, what we're seeing

308
00:14:47.240 --> 00:14:49.980
is a lot of these women specifically, but also families,

309
00:14:49.980 --> 00:14:53.620
they are being brought in and they're getting trafficked

310
00:14:53.620 --> 00:14:55.460
in locations along the route

311
00:14:55.460 --> 00:14:57.460
and then brought up to the United States.

312
00:14:57.460 --> 00:14:59.620
So as far as, and I've heard the same statistic,

313
00:14:59.620 --> 00:15:00.460
the United.

314
00:15:00.000 --> 00:15:02.400
States is first, I can't speak to that.

315
00:15:02.400 --> 00:15:05.040
I think that's a very hard thing to prove.

316
00:15:05.040 --> 00:15:06.040
Quantitate, yeah.

317
00:15:06.040 --> 00:15:08.920
Because if you look at our number of prosecutions

318
00:15:08.920 --> 00:15:12.600
against human trafficking, we don't have a lot going on.

319
00:15:12.600 --> 00:15:14.800
In fact, I think in the state of Colorado,

320
00:15:14.800 --> 00:15:17.480
we didn't even have one convicted person

321
00:15:17.480 --> 00:15:19.380
in the last 12 months.

322
00:15:19.380 --> 00:15:21.480
So if you look at that across the spectrum

323
00:15:21.480 --> 00:15:25.320
of the United States, that's, I think,

324
00:15:25.320 --> 00:15:27.400
telling that it is going on.

325
00:15:27.400 --> 00:15:28.440
It is a huge problem.

326
00:15:28.440 --> 00:15:30.640
We are huge consumers.

327
00:15:30.640 --> 00:15:32.840
As far as the numbers go, that's a tough,

328
00:15:32.840 --> 00:15:34.080
I think that's tough to prove.

329
00:15:34.080 --> 00:15:35.320
Right, right.

330
00:15:35.320 --> 00:15:38.720
So you said Oregon.

331
00:15:38.720 --> 00:15:41.200
Now, Oregon smuggling.

332
00:15:41.200 --> 00:15:45.300
Now, I could see that happening maybe with abortions

333
00:15:45.300 --> 00:15:46.400
and stuff like that.

334
00:15:46.400 --> 00:15:49.160
But you mentioned then someone who's maybe having

335
00:15:49.160 --> 00:15:52.560
to pay back someone who's kind of almost

336
00:15:52.560 --> 00:15:56.340
like an indentured servant or slave to you.

337
00:15:57.060 --> 00:15:59.620
Explain to me more about what that is

338
00:15:59.620 --> 00:16:01.100
and what happens there.

339
00:16:01.100 --> 00:16:03.900
So Oregon trafficking has been going on for a while now,

340
00:16:03.900 --> 00:16:06.020
but it's getting more public.

341
00:16:06.020 --> 00:16:07.700
I think what's been going on,

342
00:16:07.700 --> 00:16:09.380
we know that there's quite a bit of Oregon trafficking

343
00:16:09.380 --> 00:16:12.640
that's been occurring in China for quite some time.

344
00:16:12.640 --> 00:16:16.260
But what we're also starting to see is people who need,

345
00:16:17.220 --> 00:16:22.220
people with means, Americans, Russians, Chinese,

346
00:16:22.600 --> 00:16:26.020
Europeans that need organs and they're on a waiting list.

347
00:16:26.920 --> 00:16:28.660
They want that organ sooner.

348
00:16:28.660 --> 00:16:29.780
They don't want to be on a waiting list.

349
00:16:29.780 --> 00:16:31.020
And so they can pay.

350
00:16:31.020 --> 00:16:35.780
On the black market, there's quite a few websites,

351
00:16:35.780 --> 00:16:38.180
I'm sorry, on the black web, dark web,

352
00:16:38.180 --> 00:16:40.580
that are sold, if you will, on the black market

353
00:16:40.580 --> 00:16:44.220
for maybe you get a heart for $250,000

354
00:16:44.220 --> 00:16:47.420
or maybe you get a lung for $200,000.

355
00:16:47.420 --> 00:16:50.980
This stuff's being sold regularly on the dark web.

356
00:16:50.980 --> 00:16:52.780
Well, if it's a heart, they're gonna die, right?

357
00:16:52.780 --> 00:16:53.620
Yeah.

358
00:16:53.620 --> 00:16:57.660
So they're doing that maybe for their family

359
00:16:57.660 --> 00:16:59.980
so that everybody in the family is off the hook.

360
00:16:59.980 --> 00:17:04.980
I mean, they're allowing themselves to die, basically.

361
00:17:05.260 --> 00:17:06.980
I would tell you that I don't think

362
00:17:06.980 --> 00:17:09.940
that the majority of them are allowing themselves to die.

363
00:17:09.940 --> 00:17:11.900
I think that people are being targeted.

364
00:17:12.819 --> 00:17:15.500
Maybe there's homeless people, they could be runaways,

365
00:17:15.500 --> 00:17:18.260
they could be people that no one knows or cares about.

366
00:17:18.260 --> 00:17:20.380
So they're coerced maybe, or they're kidnapped,

367
00:17:20.380 --> 00:17:22.220
and then they are just used for that.

368
00:17:22.220 --> 00:17:24.420
We have people that'll go down, for instance,

369
00:17:24.420 --> 00:17:27.859
down to the Caribbean for plastic surgery

370
00:17:27.859 --> 00:17:30.340
because it'll be less expensive down there,

371
00:17:30.340 --> 00:17:34.020
show up, go into a clinic, and then wake up,

372
00:17:34.020 --> 00:17:36.500
and the clinic's suddenly been closed up

373
00:17:36.500 --> 00:17:39.020
and they're missing a kidney, right?

374
00:17:39.020 --> 00:17:41.060
So they didn't get any plastic surgery,

375
00:17:41.060 --> 00:17:42.780
and something was taken from them.

376
00:17:42.780 --> 00:17:45.380
So this stuff is happening.

377
00:17:45.380 --> 00:17:48.380
It's happening in legitimate hospitals,

378
00:17:49.220 --> 00:17:51.340
and it's a dark world, yeah.

379
00:17:52.060 --> 00:17:54.060
So tell me what you did.

380
00:17:54.060 --> 00:17:57.340
What was your, like the last few years here locally,

381
00:17:57.340 --> 00:17:59.940
what did you find yourself involved in the most

382
00:18:00.980 --> 00:18:03.940
through the FBI work that you were doing?

383
00:18:03.940 --> 00:18:05.740
The majority of what we're doing down in Pueblo

384
00:18:05.740 --> 00:18:09.220
had to do with gangs and drugs and guns.

385
00:18:10.220 --> 00:18:12.820
There's a lot of violence down there.

386
00:18:12.820 --> 00:18:14.620
It's finding its way up into the springs.

387
00:18:14.620 --> 00:18:16.740
It's not isolated anymore.

388
00:18:16.740 --> 00:18:18.780
But we did work a lot of that stuff.

389
00:18:18.780 --> 00:18:20.820
We have just a phenomenal relationship

390
00:18:20.820 --> 00:18:22.900
with the police department down there.

391
00:18:22.900 --> 00:18:26.740
The Pueblo PD, they're fantastic officers

392
00:18:26.740 --> 00:18:29.220
and lieutenants and captains.

393
00:18:29.220 --> 00:18:31.380
They're extremely hardworking.

394
00:18:31.380 --> 00:18:32.460
They care about the community,

395
00:18:32.460 --> 00:18:34.260
and they're doing a fantastic job down there.

396
00:18:34.260 --> 00:18:35.820
So we had a really good relationship with them.

397
00:18:35.820 --> 00:18:38.580
We would often help them with some of their cases,

398
00:18:38.580 --> 00:18:41.100
and sometimes they would bring their cases to us

399
00:18:41.100 --> 00:18:43.140
because it was more beneficial

400
00:18:43.140 --> 00:18:45.220
to look at it from a federal perspective.

401
00:18:45.220 --> 00:18:46.900
And so I worked, again, during that time

402
00:18:46.900 --> 00:18:47.740
was working those things,

403
00:18:47.740 --> 00:18:50.980
and we started to get some human trafficking glimpses,

404
00:18:50.980 --> 00:18:52.620
but not a lot.

405
00:18:52.620 --> 00:18:54.140
We also have to work, again,

406
00:18:54.140 --> 00:18:56.700
some of that child pornography-type stuff.

407
00:18:56.700 --> 00:18:59.220
We have specific people who work those cases,

408
00:19:01.020 --> 00:19:04.020
but we end up having to,

409
00:19:04.020 --> 00:19:06.900
I end up having to work through some of that stuff.

410
00:19:06.900 --> 00:19:08.420
And then, again, child,

411
00:19:08.420 --> 00:19:09.900
so you have child pornography,

412
00:19:09.900 --> 00:19:13.260
and then you have child abuse, sexual abuse material.

413
00:19:13.260 --> 00:19:15.500
So there's one thing to take photos,

414
00:19:15.540 --> 00:19:17.620
and then child sexual abuse

415
00:19:17.620 --> 00:19:22.580
moves into some sort of violation sexually of the child.

416
00:19:22.580 --> 00:19:25.540
So we had to work some of that stuff, too.

417
00:19:25.540 --> 00:19:27.460
So how did God use this?

418
00:19:27.460 --> 00:19:30.060
Because it sounds like it was actually more indirect

419
00:19:30.060 --> 00:19:32.100
in relation to human trafficking.

420
00:19:32.100 --> 00:19:33.820
You were more focused on the gangs,

421
00:19:33.820 --> 00:19:34.820
and the guns, and all that,

422
00:19:34.820 --> 00:19:38.700
but obviously there was something happening in you

423
00:19:38.700 --> 00:19:42.820
that was making you more and more sensitive to that.

424
00:19:42.820 --> 00:19:44.220
How did that happen?

425
00:19:44.220 --> 00:19:46.900
And that started for me several years back

426
00:19:46.900 --> 00:19:50.660
where I felt I have a heart for folks

427
00:19:50.660 --> 00:19:53.260
that have gone through a significant amount of trauma

428
00:19:53.260 --> 00:19:54.420
and have nowhere to go.

429
00:19:54.420 --> 00:19:59.420
So one of the places that I think has been unaddressed

430
00:19:59.660 --> 00:20:00.500
in our country.

431
00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:05.800
is the police officers that deal with PTS, and I have a real heart for those

432
00:20:05.800 --> 00:20:09.140
guys because they do this day in and day out. I was a soldier, I did

433
00:20:09.140 --> 00:20:14.120
multiple deployments, I've seen combat, and I have my own trauma from

434
00:20:14.120 --> 00:20:18.160
that, so I'm not trying to take away from the veterans because they've

435
00:20:18.160 --> 00:20:22.080
seen a lot in the last 20 years. I would also argue though that police

436
00:20:22.080 --> 00:20:27.960
officers do this every day, and they see things every day that are hard for

437
00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:32.360
them to see. They deal with trauma every single day, and so unfortunately a lot of

438
00:20:32.360 --> 00:20:36.480
law enforcement I don't believe are being taken care of real well, and after

439
00:20:36.480 --> 00:20:40.600
the fact, I think the last time I looked it up, the average statistic for law

440
00:20:40.600 --> 00:20:45.040
enforcement across the full spectrum of federal, state, local, is around two to

441
00:20:45.040 --> 00:20:49.640
three years post-retirement. Now that's not a long time, that's really

442
00:20:49.640 --> 00:20:53.520
quick, and I think a lot of times that comes from unaddressed trauma that these

443
00:20:53.520 --> 00:20:56.520
guys are having to fight through, and they're trying to do it by themselves, so

444
00:20:56.560 --> 00:21:00.280
part of my hope someday is to have a place, I don't know, somewhere out in the

445
00:21:00.280 --> 00:21:03.880
mountains where these guys can come and recover for a couple months, and they can

446
00:21:03.880 --> 00:21:08.200
have people give back into them, pour into them, and

447
00:21:08.200 --> 00:21:12.480
help them get out of the place that they're in. I'd also like to have a place

448
00:21:12.480 --> 00:21:15.800
where we can do that for trafficking victims, so those are kind of the two

449
00:21:15.800 --> 00:21:21.760
demographics where, like Jesus said, serving widows and

450
00:21:21.800 --> 00:21:27.080
orphans, like that is true religion, and that's where Roe, when he started off

451
00:21:27.080 --> 00:21:31.560
about 15 years ago in this world, he actually started off with an

452
00:21:31.560 --> 00:21:36.480
organization called Orphan Secure, and their job was to internationally go to

453
00:21:36.480 --> 00:21:40.680
orphanages that were having trouble with people breaking in to their facility and

454
00:21:40.680 --> 00:21:44.000
taking kids, and so he would go around the world, and he'd do this down in Mexico

455
00:21:44.000 --> 00:21:49.840
quite a bit, and help prevent those facilities from being broken into. Part

456
00:21:49.840 --> 00:21:55.720
of what we do down in Dallas, which is where Freedom Shield is based, is also we

457
00:21:55.720 --> 00:21:59.280
have a widows program down there, we have a feeding program down there where we

458
00:21:59.280 --> 00:22:03.600
feed on a, we're trying to do it on a quarterly basis, but the most impoverished

459
00:22:03.600 --> 00:22:10.240
zip code down in Dallas, and just again being the hands and feet. So I say

460
00:22:10.240 --> 00:22:14.560
that's a lot, I probably didn't answer your question directly, but it's been

461
00:22:14.560 --> 00:22:19.280
something on my own heart, now having family, having daughters, and looking at

462
00:22:19.280 --> 00:22:23.440
some of these situations where these people are stuck, and they don't have a

463
00:22:23.440 --> 00:22:28.520
great way to get out of it, and I feel called to help. So Michael, tell us what

464
00:22:28.520 --> 00:22:32.720
Freedom Shield is doing in the Dallas area, because I know you have a desire to

465
00:22:32.720 --> 00:22:39.040
see it happen in Colorado Springs, but tell us how long that's been going, and

466
00:22:39.040 --> 00:22:43.080
what exactly they do in the Dallas area. Yeah, thank you. So Freedom Shield

467
00:22:43.080 --> 00:22:49.160
started off, it moved into Freedom Shield around that 2000, 2013, 14 range. At that

468
00:22:49.160 --> 00:22:53.120
time we started, we were in the Philippines, working there, primarily

469
00:22:53.120 --> 00:22:57.680
trying to get help to get these child soldiers out of these camps. I think

470
00:22:57.680 --> 00:23:01.320
we're in, I don't know, several thousand kids that we've been able to help

471
00:23:01.320 --> 00:23:04.280
facilitate getting out of these camps where they were being forced to fight

472
00:23:04.280 --> 00:23:09.640
against each other. Then we moved into Iraq. We were in Iraq heavy for about

473
00:23:09.640 --> 00:23:13.200
three years. We've been in Afghanistan for the last three years, helping out

474
00:23:13.200 --> 00:23:16.840
with a lot of folks who were left behind, who were being targeted by the Taliban

475
00:23:16.840 --> 00:23:20.520
after we left. About the same time we got into Afghanistan, back in

476
00:23:20.520 --> 00:23:27.760
2020-21, Cary wanted to start opening safe houses for human trafficking

477
00:23:27.760 --> 00:23:34.040
victims. So within the human trafficking aftercare, there's short-term care,

478
00:23:34.040 --> 00:23:37.840
emergency care, short-term care, and then long-term care. That long-term care is

479
00:23:37.840 --> 00:23:42.440
six months to 24 months, maybe. That short-term care is like within a couple

480
00:23:42.560 --> 00:23:48.680
days, getting off the street, post-detox, getting into someplace where they can be

481
00:23:48.680 --> 00:23:55.800
safe for a couple weeks. What we've seen is in the long-term care, a lot of

482
00:23:55.800 --> 00:24:03.040
girls fail. Upwards of 75% to 80% of women fail or quit that

483
00:24:03.040 --> 00:24:07.600
long-term care in the first couple weeks. It's a very volatile time for

484
00:24:07.600 --> 00:24:11.760
them. So what Cary started focusing on, based on all those women that she was

485
00:24:11.760 --> 00:24:17.200
helping coming out of ISIS control, and how God really gave her a program to

486
00:24:17.200 --> 00:24:21.360
help these women, she started doing the same thing in the short-term, we call it

487
00:24:21.360 --> 00:24:27.120
stabilization phase. So we have two of those down in Dallas. We only serve one

488
00:24:27.120 --> 00:24:32.560
girl per safe house at a time. We have people with them 24-7.

489
00:24:32.560 --> 00:24:36.600
We're not keeping them there. They volunteer to come, but we stay

490
00:24:36.600 --> 00:24:40.720
with them 24-7 so that they always have somebody with them. The biggest thing

491
00:24:40.720 --> 00:24:44.480
that we do down there in that stabilization phase is get them sleeping

492
00:24:44.480 --> 00:24:48.600
again. We're trying to give them some basic coping skills, some life skills,

493
00:24:48.600 --> 00:24:52.960
trying to give them the ability to get through the night if they're having

494
00:24:52.960 --> 00:24:58.320
nightmares, and really just showing them Jesus. We're not

495
00:24:58.320 --> 00:25:02.040
beating them over the head with the Bible.

496
00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:01.800
making them pray with us every day.

497
00:25:01.800 --> 00:25:02.620
We're not doing that.

498
00:25:02.620 --> 00:25:05.200
However, they're being prayed for every single day

499
00:25:05.200 --> 00:25:09.080
by multiple people outside of the safe house,

500
00:25:09.080 --> 00:25:11.360
and they're also practically seeing Jesus every day

501
00:25:11.360 --> 00:25:12.760
because all the women that surround them

502
00:25:12.760 --> 00:25:13.960
know Jesus and love him.

503
00:25:15.020 --> 00:25:19.400
So I know that as a social worker,

504
00:25:19.400 --> 00:25:23.040
which is what I did after college briefly

505
00:25:23.040 --> 00:25:24.400
and then went on in the mission field,

506
00:25:24.400 --> 00:25:25.520
so I didn't do it for very long,

507
00:25:25.520 --> 00:25:28.520
but I know in the social work area,

508
00:25:29.040 --> 00:25:32.760
who you get and how long they've been involved in stuff

509
00:25:32.760 --> 00:25:35.840
has a lot to do with how quickly they can come out of it.

510
00:25:35.840 --> 00:25:40.680
I know that's true in AA, porn, and drug addiction

511
00:25:40.680 --> 00:25:43.640
is that if they've been in it for a really long time,

512
00:25:43.640 --> 00:25:45.000
it's pretty ingrained.

513
00:25:45.000 --> 00:25:48.280
It's almost like that prefrontal cortex

514
00:25:48.280 --> 00:25:52.080
has got the ditches so deep through the dopamine fix

515
00:25:52.080 --> 00:25:54.320
that they're on that they really have a hard time

516
00:25:54.320 --> 00:25:56.960
getting set free, but if the ditches aren't as deep,

517
00:25:56.960 --> 00:25:58.300
there's a chance.

518
00:25:59.140 --> 00:26:03.540
I know in one sense, you're still learning and growing

519
00:26:03.540 --> 00:26:04.380
in all of this.

520
00:26:04.380 --> 00:26:06.900
You'll know a lot more a year or two from now,

521
00:26:06.900 --> 00:26:08.380
but from what you know right now,

522
00:26:08.380 --> 00:26:11.860
is there a certain type of woman,

523
00:26:11.860 --> 00:26:14.020
I'm assuming it's mainly women,

524
00:26:14.020 --> 00:26:17.620
that you guys do get into the safe house that do well

525
00:26:17.620 --> 00:26:21.940
versus those who drop out or even go back to the lifestyle?

526
00:26:21.940 --> 00:26:24.180
Yeah, so part of our process,

527
00:26:24.180 --> 00:26:28.100
we call it our intake process, is a PTS screening.

528
00:26:29.300 --> 00:26:31.820
PTS meaning like PTSD, like post-trauma?

529
00:26:31.820 --> 00:26:32.660
Yeah. Okay.

530
00:26:32.660 --> 00:26:34.920
So we do a screening for these ladies beforehand.

531
00:26:36.300 --> 00:26:40.020
So there's that, and there haven't been too many times

532
00:26:40.020 --> 00:26:40.860
where we've said no.

533
00:26:40.860 --> 00:26:42.660
There have been a couple.

534
00:26:42.660 --> 00:26:45.940
If they have a history of running away as a child

535
00:26:45.940 --> 00:26:48.020
and they've been on the street for a long time

536
00:26:48.020 --> 00:26:50.180
and they like to run away from places that they go,

537
00:26:50.700 --> 00:26:54.220
that may be hard because we have to protect

538
00:26:54.220 --> 00:26:55.340
the places where we do this.

539
00:26:55.340 --> 00:26:57.820
We have to protect the people, our people that are there.

540
00:26:57.820 --> 00:27:00.860
And so if someone is unwilling to,

541
00:27:00.860 --> 00:27:03.620
if we think there's a high likelihood where they will leave

542
00:27:03.620 --> 00:27:05.520
and then they could compromise that location,

543
00:27:05.520 --> 00:27:07.560
then we have to be aware of that beforehand.

544
00:27:07.560 --> 00:27:08.760
So there's that.

545
00:27:08.760 --> 00:27:11.140
There's, again, a level of trauma.

546
00:27:11.140 --> 00:27:16.140
We have dealt with some very significant trauma.

547
00:27:17.020 --> 00:27:19.820
It is, you know, things that I probably don't want to,

548
00:27:19.820 --> 00:27:20.660
I don't want to share today,

549
00:27:20.660 --> 00:27:22.940
just some of the awful things that have been done

550
00:27:22.940 --> 00:27:24.100
to some of these women.

551
00:27:25.220 --> 00:27:27.780
So yes, that is a concern.

552
00:27:27.780 --> 00:27:31.460
What I will say is that there's no human wisdom

553
00:27:31.460 --> 00:27:33.380
that's going to put people back together.

554
00:27:33.380 --> 00:27:35.300
There's no human program that's going to put a soul

555
00:27:35.300 --> 00:27:36.260
back together.

556
00:27:36.260 --> 00:27:38.420
The only person who can do that is Jesus.

557
00:27:38.420 --> 00:27:40.860
And so what we're seeing is that Christ is the one

558
00:27:40.860 --> 00:27:42.740
that's putting these ladies back together.

559
00:27:42.740 --> 00:27:43.920
Again, we're not preaching at them.

560
00:27:43.920 --> 00:27:44.800
We're not making them pray with us,

561
00:27:44.840 --> 00:27:47.280
but I tell you, like, I think we're around 50%

562
00:27:47.280 --> 00:27:49.560
of these women during their time with us,

563
00:27:49.560 --> 00:27:50.600
right after their time with us,

564
00:27:50.600 --> 00:27:53.200
or in long-term care, come to know Christ.

565
00:27:53.200 --> 00:27:56.440
And that's not because we're phenomenal people

566
00:27:56.440 --> 00:27:57.720
and they just saw, you know,

567
00:27:57.720 --> 00:27:58.780
oh, I just want to be like them.

568
00:27:58.780 --> 00:28:00.920
But I do think they see something in these ladies.

569
00:28:00.920 --> 00:28:03.080
They see something in these advocates

570
00:28:03.080 --> 00:28:04.760
that they haven't seen before.

571
00:28:04.760 --> 00:28:07.520
It may be the first time they were ever actually

572
00:28:07.520 --> 00:28:11.040
given something without being asked for anything in return.

573
00:28:11.040 --> 00:28:12.640
It's a lot of times the first time

574
00:28:12.680 --> 00:28:16.240
that they've ever seen practically what love looks like.

575
00:28:16.240 --> 00:28:18.880
And so, you know, I do think you're right,

576
00:28:18.880 --> 00:28:20.480
that there are certain kinds of trauma

577
00:28:20.480 --> 00:28:23.480
that's harder than others,

578
00:28:23.480 --> 00:28:26.000
but I know Christ can put anyone back together

579
00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:27.880
and that regardless of their trauma.

580
00:28:27.880 --> 00:28:30.480
And we saw him do that time and time again in scripture.

581
00:28:30.480 --> 00:28:35.480
So what do you do with those that decide

582
00:28:35.480 --> 00:28:38.520
to pursue the program?

583
00:28:38.520 --> 00:28:39.600
They're going to stick to it.

584
00:28:39.600 --> 00:28:41.040
They're going to work on it.

585
00:28:41.080 --> 00:28:44.760
Do they kind of ever like graduate out?

586
00:28:44.760 --> 00:28:45.600
Like how does that,

587
00:28:45.600 --> 00:28:48.000
what's been the track record there in Dallas?

588
00:28:48.000 --> 00:28:49.560
Yeah, that's a great question too.

589
00:28:49.560 --> 00:28:54.560
So we have, we typically have helped around 15 women a year,

590
00:28:55.320 --> 00:28:56.920
12 to 15, depends on the year.

591
00:28:56.920 --> 00:28:58.320
Sometimes they've stayed for a week.

592
00:28:58.320 --> 00:29:00.720
Sometimes they've stayed for a couple of months.

593
00:29:01.920 --> 00:29:04.720
I think we're at around 56 women currently.

594
00:29:04.720 --> 00:29:05.840
I think we have someone right now.

595
00:29:05.840 --> 00:29:08.680
So there were 56, 57 women in the last three years

596
00:29:08.680 --> 00:29:10.120
that we've been able to serve.

597
00:29:10.120 --> 00:29:13.840
They, the goal of the stabilization with us

598
00:29:13.840 --> 00:29:16.440
in the safe house is to get them to a place where,

599
00:29:16.440 --> 00:29:17.280
again, they're sleeping,

600
00:29:17.280 --> 00:29:18.600
they're able to take care of themselves.

601
00:29:18.600 --> 00:29:20.240
They've got their voice back.

602
00:29:20.240 --> 00:29:21.760
You know, they lost their voice.

603
00:29:21.760 --> 00:29:23.720
They didn't have a voice for a long time.

604
00:29:23.720 --> 00:29:25.480
They didn't have, they didn't get to make choices.

605
00:29:25.480 --> 00:29:28.360
So, you know, hey, let's, what do you want to eat today?

606
00:29:28.360 --> 00:29:29.480
Let's cook together.

607
00:29:29.480 --> 00:29:30.640
Let's go for a walk together.

608
00:29:30.640 --> 00:29:33.640
Let's go, you know, go grocery shopping together.

609
00:29:33.640 --> 00:29:35.720
Again, not huge things,

610
00:29:35.720 --> 00:29:39.560
but given those ladies, their voice back is huge for them.

611
00:29:40.600 --> 00:29:43.800
And I think a lot of us take for granted our freedom.

612
00:29:43.800 --> 00:29:46.080
We don't recognize when you don't have a choice

613
00:29:46.080 --> 00:29:51.080
and you are stuck because of an addiction to drugs,

614
00:29:51.200 --> 00:29:53.520
because of a grooming that occurred,

615
00:29:53.520 --> 00:29:55.840
because these girls look at their,

616
00:29:55.840 --> 00:29:59.000
they can often look at their pimps as their boyfriends.

617
00:29:59.000 --> 00:29:59.840
They love me.

618
00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:03.180
you know, and there's a bond that has, it's a trauma bond.

619
00:30:03.200 --> 00:30:06.120
They've literally have a trauma bond with a lot of these, these men.

620
00:30:06.600 --> 00:30:10.440
So getting them out of that is, it's a long process. When we,

621
00:30:10.640 --> 00:30:14.360
what we're focusing on is just getting them through the most volatile time,

622
00:30:14.760 --> 00:30:16.400
which is usually that first month or so,

623
00:30:17.040 --> 00:30:20.360
but we're also helping them get to a longterm facility. So there's,

624
00:30:20.800 --> 00:30:22.400
we know if there's anywhere between 50,

625
00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:25.840
60 or so longterm facilities in the country,

626
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:30.640
a lot of open and close all the time because of support or lack of staff.

627
00:30:31.120 --> 00:30:34.960
But we partner with around 13, I think right now of those 50.

628
00:30:35.760 --> 00:30:38.880
And we partner with those because Carrie's and her team have vetted

629
00:30:40.160 --> 00:30:41.480
those organizations.

630
00:30:41.640 --> 00:30:44.760
They know that Jesus is involved in those organizations.

631
00:30:44.760 --> 00:30:49.200
They know that the program that they're going to take the women through works

632
00:30:49.220 --> 00:30:51.800
well. And so when she partners with somebody,

633
00:30:51.800 --> 00:30:54.640
she does a lot of vetting beforehand. So the goal is to get them,

634
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:56.800
if they want to go and some women don't want to,

635
00:30:57.320 --> 00:31:00.440
but the goal is to get them to longterm care where they can,

636
00:31:00.800 --> 00:31:03.920
they can actually have months, maybe a year,

637
00:31:04.280 --> 00:31:08.720
maybe longer of being able to be cared for and be restored.

638
00:31:09.240 --> 00:31:13.920
So how does a young girl find Freedom Shield?

639
00:31:13.960 --> 00:31:18.520
How does she get in the queue as it were to be accepted

640
00:31:18.880 --> 00:31:22.000
into say a restoration process?

641
00:31:22.320 --> 00:31:25.320
So referrals come through a variety of ways. You know,

642
00:31:25.320 --> 00:31:28.920
once we have our safe house here in the Springs, you know, I'll, I'll be very,

643
00:31:29.440 --> 00:31:33.280
I'll be talking to CSPD, the Bureau, Pueblo PD, you know,

644
00:31:33.280 --> 00:31:36.000
I'll be talking with all the law enforcement agencies and saying, Hey guys,

645
00:31:36.240 --> 00:31:40.640
if you come across somebody, call me and or call our team.

646
00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:42.920
I'm not going to be running the safe house that we'll have.

647
00:31:43.000 --> 00:31:45.640
We're going to hire some, some ladies who have experience in that,

648
00:31:45.640 --> 00:31:49.680
to run that here, but we'll call me, call them. And so we have referrals,

649
00:31:49.680 --> 00:31:52.720
through law enforcement, obviously down in Houston, I'm sorry, down in Dallas.

650
00:31:52.720 --> 00:31:57.600
We have a fantastic relationship with HSI and we get a lot of referrals through

651
00:31:57.600 --> 00:32:00.840
them. Sometimes we'll get referrals. Actually,

652
00:32:00.840 --> 00:32:03.880
we have quite a few through another good partner of ours called Rescue America.

653
00:32:04.600 --> 00:32:06.840
They run a national hotline and they have it all.

654
00:32:06.880 --> 00:32:11.320
They have it staffed 24 seven with dozens of people who answer the phone when it,

655
00:32:11.360 --> 00:32:14.000
when it rings. And, and so these, these ladies, these women,

656
00:32:14.000 --> 00:32:18.240
these girls can call. And a lot of times it's not like, Hey, I need out now.

657
00:32:18.880 --> 00:32:19.640
It's sometime.

658
00:32:19.640 --> 00:32:24.240
A lot of times it's a process for them to make that decision to leave because of

659
00:32:24.720 --> 00:32:28.120
the things that I told you about for the trauma bond addiction.

660
00:32:28.920 --> 00:32:31.760
Maybe they have a child and they don't know what to do. They don't know how to,

661
00:32:31.840 --> 00:32:35.760
how to handle that situation. They've got some custody battle or custody issues.

662
00:32:36.080 --> 00:32:40.680
So it may take a lot of these ladies a while to talk with folks to,

663
00:32:40.800 --> 00:32:42.640
to get them to the point where they're ready to leave.

664
00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:46.200
So we get quite a few referrals through Rescue America as well.

665
00:32:46.480 --> 00:32:49.040
So there's a variety of referrals that we can come across.

666
00:32:49.040 --> 00:32:52.920
I've had old friends call me out of the blue recently who had heard what I was

667
00:32:52.920 --> 00:32:55.760
doing and you're like, Hey, I've got a situation, you know,

668
00:32:55.760 --> 00:32:59.280
so I keep seeing God's hand in it. I don't, like I said,

669
00:32:59.280 --> 00:33:00.480
I can't see the longterm.

670
00:33:00.480 --> 00:33:03.440
I don't exactly know what this is going to look like and in five years,

671
00:33:03.480 --> 00:33:06.840
but I do know that I'm seeing his hand and I'm just trying to try not to get

672
00:33:06.840 --> 00:33:09.480
ahead of him, trying to stay with him. Yeah. That's hard for me sometimes.

673
00:33:09.880 --> 00:33:12.720
I like to sprint and he's like, Hey man, you missed the turn.

674
00:33:12.720 --> 00:33:13.560
Wake way back here.

675
00:33:13.840 --> 00:33:17.240
Yeah. Well, this is a whole nother area for you.

676
00:33:17.640 --> 00:33:21.320
I mean, you're really trying to raise finances and raise awareness.

677
00:33:22.480 --> 00:33:25.920
It's stuff where you've been more of an operator out there doing the job.

678
00:33:25.920 --> 00:33:29.520
So that's kind of, it's a different role. It's a hard role for me. I, I,

679
00:33:29.920 --> 00:33:34.360
I, I, again, a lot of my job is on the international side.

680
00:33:34.360 --> 00:33:38.720
So I do keep waiting for the Lord to say, all right,

681
00:33:38.720 --> 00:33:42.320
I'm ready to get ready to send you off to a number of things.

682
00:33:43.000 --> 00:33:45.960
Project. We raise money for projects. So we don't raise money. Like my,

683
00:33:46.000 --> 00:33:49.440
my salary, all the guys salaries are paid for by our business that we have.

684
00:33:50.160 --> 00:33:53.160
So I don't have to fundraise for myself, which is nice. I, when I,

685
00:33:53.200 --> 00:33:56.320
and I've never fundraised in my life. You know, our conversation, you know,

686
00:33:56.320 --> 00:34:00.960
a couple of months ago is one of the first ones I've ever had. And but the beauty

687
00:34:00.960 --> 00:34:02.080
of what we do is like, Hey, we,

688
00:34:02.080 --> 00:34:05.920
we have a country that we're going to go build capacity in. We have a,

689
00:34:06.160 --> 00:34:09.040
like right now we're looking at what we can do in Israel.

690
00:34:09.800 --> 00:34:11.800
So we've been in a lot of places.

691
00:34:11.840 --> 00:34:15.360
Usually they're some of the more difficult locations at the time.

692
00:34:15.920 --> 00:34:19.560
And so I'm ready when the Lord's ready to start sending me to do that.

693
00:34:19.560 --> 00:34:20.080
I'll do that too.

694
00:34:20.080 --> 00:34:24.320
Freedom shield has been only in Dallas, right?

695
00:34:24.880 --> 00:34:27.679
Yeah. Now they're trying to go international.

696
00:34:27.679 --> 00:34:29.239
And that's one of the reasons why they hired you.

697
00:34:29.400 --> 00:34:32.199
No. So I apologize if I miscommunicated.

698
00:34:32.199 --> 00:34:35.280
They they've had offices internationally for over a 10 years now.

699
00:34:36.679 --> 00:34:38.040
The U S they're in Dallas.

700
00:34:38.159 --> 00:34:39.360
Yes, sir. Okay. Yeah, they are.

701
00:34:39.360 --> 00:34:42.159
And then we have another gentleman who works with me here.

702
00:34:42.159 --> 00:34:44.639
And I think a couple other folks that we're going to bring on in the next 12

703
00:34:44.639 --> 00:34:47.960
months. So I think we will have a team here within the next year.

704
00:34:47.960 --> 00:34:50.840
We're going to have five or six people that are going to be on involved in this,

705
00:34:50.840 --> 00:34:51.679
that are on staff.

706
00:34:52.080 --> 00:34:55.199
And then we've been meeting with like with self people like yourself and other

707
00:34:55.199 --> 00:34:58.280
pastors and I'm in growing our,

708
00:34:58.360 --> 00:35:00.000
our volunteer pool for.

709
00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:02.880
a safe house, and I think that's going to, it's going really well.

710
00:35:02.880 --> 00:35:07.280
We've got about 16 or 17 women who have stepped up and put their applications in and said,

711
00:35:07.280 --> 00:35:08.280
I want to help.

712
00:35:08.280 --> 00:35:09.280
What can I do?

713
00:35:09.280 --> 00:35:10.520
So it's going well.

714
00:35:10.520 --> 00:35:12.200
So Michael, who's doing this?

715
00:35:12.200 --> 00:35:17.080
I mean, let's just talk in terms of, let's start international and then we'll do national.

716
00:35:17.080 --> 00:35:28.120
But on the international, human trafficking, organ trafficking, sex trafficking, in those

717
00:35:28.120 --> 00:35:39.680
realms, is there a type of organization or individual or both that seems to be the kind

718
00:35:39.680 --> 00:35:45.880
that benefits the most from doing this kind of stuff?

719
00:35:45.880 --> 00:35:46.880
Across the world, it's big.

720
00:35:46.880 --> 00:35:47.880
Sure.

721
00:35:47.880 --> 00:35:48.880
Absolutely.

722
00:35:48.880 --> 00:35:53.200
I mean, I think we have more human slaves today than any other time in the history of

723
00:35:53.200 --> 00:35:54.200
the world.

724
00:35:54.200 --> 00:35:55.440
It's like crazy.

725
00:35:55.440 --> 00:35:57.480
So who's doing it?

726
00:35:57.480 --> 00:35:58.480
What's happening with that?

727
00:35:58.480 --> 00:36:01.360
You know, I think that's a hard question.

728
00:36:01.360 --> 00:36:04.800
Organized crime, by and large, controls the majority of the trafficking, whether it's

729
00:36:04.800 --> 00:36:09.760
drug trafficking, human trafficking, gun running, I mean, organized crime generally, that is

730
00:36:09.760 --> 00:36:15.580
who we're dealing with, whether it's American gangs in organized crime or Russians or Chinese

731
00:36:16.280 --> 00:36:20.980
or, you know, there's organized crime in every single country in the world, in some manner.

732
00:36:20.980 --> 00:36:26.020
So, but a lot of the trafficking, I would say, internationally is being done by organized

733
00:36:26.020 --> 00:36:28.100
crime within those countries.

734
00:36:28.100 --> 00:36:32.900
But anytime that there's a conflict and there's an opportunity to make money, it's going to

735
00:36:32.900 --> 00:36:33.900
happen.

736
00:36:33.900 --> 00:36:37.340
You know, there's going to be trafficking that's going, there's going to be trafficking

737
00:36:37.340 --> 00:36:41.660
right now, it's probably going on somehow in the conflict in Israel and Palestine, you

738
00:36:41.660 --> 00:36:45.340
know, somebody will find a way to make money off the situation, sadly.

739
00:36:46.100 --> 00:36:49.100
Turkey, after the earthquake, that was, that was a huge problem.

740
00:36:49.100 --> 00:36:53.820
You've got a bunch of missing people, you know, missing moms and dads, but they found

741
00:36:53.820 --> 00:36:56.740
some kids and your mom and dad are missing, what do we do?

742
00:36:56.740 --> 00:36:57.740
We can make money on this.

743
00:36:57.740 --> 00:37:01.260
So, like, anytime you have a huge conflict, you're going to have the opportunity to make

744
00:37:01.260 --> 00:37:02.260
money.

745
00:37:02.260 --> 00:37:04.860
Where you have the opportunity to make money, somebody's going to find a way to do it.

746
00:37:04.860 --> 00:37:09.260
So we think of organized crime sometimes in America as being like the mafia or something

747
00:37:09.260 --> 00:37:10.260
like that.

748
00:37:10.260 --> 00:37:11.260
Sure.

749
00:37:11.260 --> 00:37:15.940
So you're talking more about local gangs, right, that are involved in this kind of stuff

750
00:37:15.940 --> 00:37:16.940
to make money.

751
00:37:16.940 --> 00:37:17.940
Yeah, absolutely.

752
00:37:17.940 --> 00:37:18.940
Local gangs.

753
00:37:18.940 --> 00:37:23.100
But I mean, it can be Mexican cartel, it could be affiliates of cartel, it could be MS-13.

754
00:37:23.100 --> 00:37:25.180
You know, there's a large variety of gangs out there.

755
00:37:25.180 --> 00:37:28.620
It's gotten to the point now where, you know, I don't even know how many gang, current gangs

756
00:37:28.620 --> 00:37:30.100
we have running in the United States.

757
00:37:30.100 --> 00:37:35.480
But there are, there are organizations, criminal organizations that will not traffic humans.

758
00:37:35.480 --> 00:37:38.960
There are organizations that say, we'll do these things, but we won't do this.

759
00:37:38.960 --> 00:37:40.580
So those do exist.

760
00:37:40.580 --> 00:37:46.580
But by and large, most people, if they can make money doing it, they can, they're going

761
00:37:46.580 --> 00:37:47.580
to do it.

762
00:37:47.580 --> 00:37:48.580
And especially with the drug trafficking.

763
00:37:48.580 --> 00:37:54.060
I mean, a lot of the folks who are involved in drug trafficking are also involved in sex

764
00:37:54.060 --> 00:37:55.580
trafficking as well.

765
00:37:55.580 --> 00:37:56.740
Okay.

766
00:37:56.740 --> 00:38:01.780
So when you were working in Pueblo, were you working mainly with, in the realm of local,

767
00:38:01.780 --> 00:38:05.060
kind of local gangs versus syndicates?

768
00:38:05.060 --> 00:38:10.580
I think of like syndicates being big and quite a hierarchy.

769
00:38:10.580 --> 00:38:16.380
Is it, is it more local thugs kind of folks or is it syndicates?

770
00:38:16.380 --> 00:38:21.260
So yeah, I would say down in Pueblo, it's more local gangs.

771
00:38:21.260 --> 00:38:24.980
In the Springs, you start to have more, if you will, franchise gangs.

772
00:38:24.980 --> 00:38:29.500
So gangs that have members in other places that were started in other places and they

773
00:38:29.500 --> 00:38:34.140
now have an operation here in the Springs or definitely in Denver.

774
00:38:34.220 --> 00:38:39.100
I mean, the I-25 corridor obviously is a long one that goes north and south pretty far.

775
00:38:39.100 --> 00:38:40.580
You also in Denver have 70.

776
00:38:40.580 --> 00:38:45.500
So you've got an east-west primary route and you've got a north-south one as well.

777
00:38:45.500 --> 00:38:49.380
So as far as the movement of people, I mean, there's people being moved through Colorado

778
00:38:49.380 --> 00:38:52.020
Springs every day that people probably don't know.

779
00:38:52.020 --> 00:38:54.540
They're never going to know that somebody was getting moved.

780
00:38:54.540 --> 00:39:00.940
It could have been a person who is from Texas and Dallas and he, he's got two girls in the

781
00:39:00.940 --> 00:39:01.940
car with him.

782
00:39:01.940 --> 00:39:06.020
And you know, oh yeah, these is my girlfriend and my sister is if they ever to get stopped.

783
00:39:06.020 --> 00:39:10.340
But the reality is, is he taking them from city to city to city and trafficking or different

784
00:39:10.340 --> 00:39:11.340
locations.

785
00:39:11.340 --> 00:39:15.640
So, I mean, it can be anything from that small of a scale to, you know, a larger scale.

786
00:39:15.640 --> 00:39:17.140
So how do they transport them?

787
00:39:17.140 --> 00:39:21.460
I mean, you know, you got, we've got a couple of big truck stops.

788
00:39:21.460 --> 00:39:22.460
Sure.

789
00:39:22.460 --> 00:39:23.460
Locally.

790
00:39:23.460 --> 00:39:30.060
My sense from talking to a lot of people has been that a lot of the truckers are actually

791
00:39:30.180 --> 00:39:31.180
on the lookout.

792
00:39:31.180 --> 00:39:32.580
I mean, they're trying to help.

793
00:39:32.580 --> 00:39:34.980
These are good guys or honest guys.

794
00:39:34.980 --> 00:39:36.700
They're salt of the earth guys.

795
00:39:36.700 --> 00:39:37.700
Yeah.

796
00:39:37.700 --> 00:39:42.180
But I'm sure there's, I mean, in any group you've got, you got your centers, right?

797
00:39:42.180 --> 00:39:43.180
Sure.

798
00:39:43.180 --> 00:39:46.860
So is it through, is it through that or is it just more like what you just said?

799
00:39:46.860 --> 00:39:52.660
And it's, it's an individual who's got just several cause it's just easier to hide.

800
00:39:52.660 --> 00:39:55.500
I know it's both, but you are in it.

801
00:39:55.500 --> 00:39:59.980
I mean, so what would you say was more of the, um,

802
00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:02.960
the composite of what you're looking for.

803
00:40:02.960 --> 00:40:04.040
Yeah.

804
00:40:04.040 --> 00:40:06.520
So again, what we were seeing and what we find,

805
00:40:06.520 --> 00:40:07.440
you can find online.

806
00:40:07.440 --> 00:40:10.680
I mean, you can, you know, there's most of the advertisements

807
00:40:10.680 --> 00:40:12.960
you can find online are from individuals

808
00:40:12.960 --> 00:40:16.340
who are either getting taken around the country

809
00:40:16.340 --> 00:40:19.880
or from folks, you know, that are in a specific city

810
00:40:19.880 --> 00:40:21.600
and someone is putting their advertisement up

811
00:40:21.600 --> 00:40:23.360
in a different city and then has-

812
00:40:23.360 --> 00:40:25.120
What do you mean their advertisement or their-

813
00:40:25.120 --> 00:40:27.920
So, you know, there's multiple sites out,

814
00:40:27.920 --> 00:40:31.760
websites out there that sell sex.

815
00:40:31.760 --> 00:40:33.600
So women go on and say,

816
00:40:33.600 --> 00:40:35.280
hey, I'm willing to come to your place

817
00:40:35.280 --> 00:40:37.240
or you come to mine, meet you in a hotel,

818
00:40:37.240 --> 00:40:39.440
here's my services, here's the price.

819
00:40:39.440 --> 00:40:42.480
That stuff has become very common now, unfortunately.

820
00:40:42.480 --> 00:40:45.440
And so these women are being sold, many of them.

821
00:40:45.440 --> 00:40:47.140
Some are independents and some are, you know,

822
00:40:47.140 --> 00:40:48.400
doing it on their own.

823
00:40:48.400 --> 00:40:50.280
But a lot of times they end up,

824
00:40:50.280 --> 00:40:54.080
they end up having someone do their advertising for them

825
00:40:54.080 --> 00:40:55.560
or someone to protect them.

826
00:40:55.560 --> 00:40:57.760
And so they, you know, if they get into a situation,

827
00:40:58.600 --> 00:40:59.800
they have someone that can back them up, I guess,

828
00:40:59.800 --> 00:41:01.760
if you want to call it that.

829
00:41:01.760 --> 00:41:03.160
So that's when you start to get into the,

830
00:41:03.160 --> 00:41:05.240
like you have a trafficker, you have a pimp,

831
00:41:05.240 --> 00:41:07.120
you have someone who's controlling you

832
00:41:07.120 --> 00:41:08.980
and who's managing, you know, taking the money,

833
00:41:08.980 --> 00:41:10.360
taking part of the money,

834
00:41:10.360 --> 00:41:13.320
setting up your appointments, that kind of stuff.

835
00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:14.160
But yeah, it does go on-

836
00:41:14.160 --> 00:41:15.560
But how do they transport them?

837
00:41:15.560 --> 00:41:17.840
I mean, could you mention the I-25 corridor?

838
00:41:17.840 --> 00:41:18.680
Sure.

839
00:41:18.680 --> 00:41:20.760
I-70 is going to be more your East-West.

840
00:41:20.760 --> 00:41:22.760
Somebody's driving the plane, right?

841
00:41:22.760 --> 00:41:24.560
So what's-

842
00:41:24.560 --> 00:41:25.720
They might fly them, you know,

843
00:41:25.720 --> 00:41:26.560
they might be flying together.

844
00:41:26.560 --> 00:41:27.400
Flying, okay.

845
00:41:28.040 --> 00:41:30.520
They could absolutely, I mean, a lot of,

846
00:41:30.520 --> 00:41:32.720
I think the situations we, and again,

847
00:41:32.720 --> 00:41:35.560
like my experience doing this was only a couple of years.

848
00:41:35.560 --> 00:41:38.320
There's guys, like HSI here does a really good job

849
00:41:38.320 --> 00:41:40.080
with trafficking and they work really hard on this.

850
00:41:40.080 --> 00:41:43.960
I know some of the guys over there and they're fantastic.

851
00:41:43.960 --> 00:41:46.520
But, you know, we're seeing everything from,

852
00:41:46.520 --> 00:41:48.440
we've heard, yeah, there was a, I think,

853
00:41:48.440 --> 00:41:50.680
I heard a, I think it was recently,

854
00:41:50.680 --> 00:41:53.000
there was a truck that was pulled over

855
00:41:53.000 --> 00:41:55.080
that had a group of people in it.

856
00:41:55.080 --> 00:41:56.120
I think it was in Monument.

857
00:41:56.120 --> 00:41:57.200
It might've been at a truck stop

858
00:41:57.200 --> 00:41:59.200
in the last six or seven months.

859
00:41:59.200 --> 00:42:00.840
I've also heard of, you know, again,

860
00:42:00.840 --> 00:42:03.480
situations where literally it's just people in a car

861
00:42:03.480 --> 00:42:05.520
driving from city to city to city.

862
00:42:05.520 --> 00:42:07.400
So you, you know, you would look at

863
00:42:07.400 --> 00:42:10.560
just a normal passenger car or a truck or a van.

864
00:42:10.560 --> 00:42:12.200
It could, yeah, I mean, the idea of like,

865
00:42:12.200 --> 00:42:13.880
hey, we've got 50 people in a panel van

866
00:42:13.880 --> 00:42:16.520
that's just constantly going up and down I-25.

867
00:42:16.520 --> 00:42:20.480
I think that is possible and I think that does happen.

868
00:42:20.480 --> 00:42:23.720
I don't think it's as common as we,

869
00:42:23.720 --> 00:42:25.880
some people seem to think it is.

870
00:42:26.640 --> 00:42:29.320
But again, this is going on in our backyard.

871
00:42:29.320 --> 00:42:32.480
This is going on in every neighborhood in Colorado Springs.

872
00:42:32.480 --> 00:42:33.880
It doesn't matter if you're on the South,

873
00:42:33.880 --> 00:42:35.040
North, East, West side.

874
00:42:35.040 --> 00:42:35.880
Every neighborhood?

875
00:42:35.880 --> 00:42:37.280
It's going on in all neighborhoods.

876
00:42:37.280 --> 00:42:39.560
Like there are people that are,

877
00:42:39.560 --> 00:42:41.120
again, if you can make money doing it,

878
00:42:41.120 --> 00:42:42.320
you're gonna do it.

879
00:42:42.320 --> 00:42:46.160
And so it's, I think people would be very surprised

880
00:42:46.160 --> 00:42:49.360
if they were to realize what to look for.

881
00:42:49.360 --> 00:42:53.080
And if they started looking for people

882
00:42:53.080 --> 00:42:54.600
that don't have control of their cell phone,

883
00:42:54.600 --> 00:42:56.120
people who don't have control of their money,

884
00:42:56.120 --> 00:42:58.120
people who don't have control of their IDs.

885
00:42:58.120 --> 00:43:01.160
These are some of the ways that we could notice things.

886
00:43:01.160 --> 00:43:02.600
You can start to see,

887
00:43:02.600 --> 00:43:04.160
this person doesn't seem to have a voice.

888
00:43:04.160 --> 00:43:07.000
Why does that man always speak for her when she's addressed?

889
00:43:07.000 --> 00:43:07.840
Like things like that,

890
00:43:07.840 --> 00:43:09.320
I'm not saying every situation's like that,

891
00:43:09.320 --> 00:43:11.640
but those are small things that I think we

892
00:43:11.640 --> 00:43:13.640
maybe don't even pay attention to.

893
00:43:13.640 --> 00:43:16.240
And the more we know about what to look for,

894
00:43:16.240 --> 00:43:19.520
the more likely we are to identify that kind of situation.

895
00:43:19.520 --> 00:43:24.520
Do you feel like there's a lot of kids being kidnapped

896
00:43:25.080 --> 00:43:28.320
taken from their homes or on the street

897
00:43:28.320 --> 00:43:31.280
or after school or something like that in America?

898
00:43:31.280 --> 00:43:33.360
Do you think that, or let's just say Colorado Springs.

899
00:43:33.360 --> 00:43:34.320
Do you think that's happening?

900
00:43:34.320 --> 00:43:37.480
Active kidnappings, I think, are more on the low side.

901
00:43:37.480 --> 00:43:39.960
However, what we do have is a lot of at-risk youth.

902
00:43:39.960 --> 00:43:41.480
We have a lot of kids that run away.

903
00:43:41.480 --> 00:43:46.160
And so these guys that are trafficking people,

904
00:43:46.160 --> 00:43:48.680
they're predators, they're wolves.

905
00:43:48.680 --> 00:43:50.840
And they know what vulnerable looks like.

906
00:43:50.840 --> 00:43:53.640
And they know how to identify that person quickly.

907
00:43:53.640 --> 00:43:55.280
And they know how to manipulate that person

908
00:43:55.280 --> 00:43:56.560
and come alongside and,

909
00:43:56.560 --> 00:43:58.720
hey, let me buy some meat, let me buy a meal.

910
00:43:58.720 --> 00:43:59.760
Are you, oh, you're by yourself.

911
00:43:59.760 --> 00:44:00.600
Where are you?

912
00:44:00.600 --> 00:44:01.960
Whoa, okay, well, how old are you?

913
00:44:01.960 --> 00:44:03.520
And that stuff happens.

914
00:44:03.520 --> 00:44:05.080
It absolutely is happening.

915
00:44:05.080 --> 00:44:08.640
So it's not, I wouldn't call it an active kidnapping case

916
00:44:08.640 --> 00:44:11.680
on a regular basis, but there's a lot of runaways.

917
00:44:11.680 --> 00:44:12.520
More grooming.

918
00:44:12.520 --> 00:44:13.360
A lot of grooming.

919
00:44:13.360 --> 00:44:15.520
And there's a lot of missing children in the United States.

920
00:44:15.520 --> 00:44:16.360
Yeah, I know.

921
00:44:16.360 --> 00:44:19.240
A lot of missing kids that just disappeared.

922
00:44:19.240 --> 00:44:20.080
Yeah.

923
00:44:20.080 --> 00:44:21.680
So I think that, again,

924
00:44:21.680 --> 00:44:23.200
can we prove they're being trafficked?

925
00:44:23.200 --> 00:44:25.560
Not always, not necessarily.

926
00:44:25.560 --> 00:44:28.400
But if you look at the increase in child pornography

927
00:44:28.400 --> 00:44:30.160
in the last several years since COVID,

928
00:44:30.160 --> 00:44:32.680
it's gone through the roof several thousand percent

929
00:44:32.680 --> 00:44:35.840
of material that's been produced.

930
00:44:35.840 --> 00:44:39.040
So while you can't say, hey,

931
00:44:39.040 --> 00:44:41.080
we know exactly how many kids are being trafficked.

932
00:44:41.080 --> 00:44:43.240
If we have seen an increase in the production

933
00:44:43.240 --> 00:44:46.000
of child pornography and CSAM,

934
00:44:46.000 --> 00:44:48.560
the child sexual abuse material,

935
00:44:48.560 --> 00:44:50.480
then we know that there's a lot more kids

936
00:44:50.520 --> 00:44:51.920
that are getting hurt.

937
00:44:51.920 --> 00:44:53.000
Are they getting trafficked?

938
00:44:53.000 --> 00:44:54.160
Maybe, maybe not.

939
00:44:54.160 --> 00:44:55.240
But we know they're getting hurt.

940
00:44:55.240 --> 00:44:58.440
And so once you go down that road

941
00:44:59.400 --> 00:45:00.240
of

942
00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:02.000
Taking pictures of kids or hurting kids

943
00:45:02.360 --> 00:45:05.600
Again, they're doing it for money if they can make money doing it. It's gonna happen

944
00:45:06.400 --> 00:45:08.960
well, Michael, thank you for being with us today and

945
00:45:10.120 --> 00:45:16.400
man, god bless you as you endeavor to bring freedom shield to even our city and

946
00:45:18.400 --> 00:45:22.280
God's put you in this place for such a time as this and your unique

947
00:45:22.920 --> 00:45:25.360
skill gifting anointing talents is

948
00:45:26.000 --> 00:45:28.000
Seems like it's tailor-made

949
00:45:28.160 --> 00:45:30.960
To begin to make a dent in

950
00:45:31.880 --> 00:45:33.000
demonic

951
00:45:33.000 --> 00:45:37.480
Territorial stuff that's happening in this region and I think around the world

952
00:45:37.480 --> 00:45:41.080
I think that's more what you're gonna be doing is more international

953
00:45:41.080 --> 00:45:44.440
but thank you for being with us today taking time to be with us and

954
00:45:45.240 --> 00:45:52.460
Can I pray for you? Absolutely. Thank you. Appreciate that. Yeah. Well, thank you Lord for my brother. Thank you for his passion

955
00:45:53.200 --> 00:45:55.200
for the kingdom of God

956
00:45:55.360 --> 00:45:57.440
for being a protector wanting to

957
00:45:58.040 --> 00:46:00.960
Be in a sense kind of an angel

958
00:46:00.960 --> 00:46:02.960
I always think of an angel as a messenger

959
00:46:03.120 --> 00:46:09.960
Who comes and brings good news and I just pray that you'd use Michael to bring good news and set the captives free

960
00:46:09.960 --> 00:46:11.960
That's the vision of Jesus

961
00:46:12.560 --> 00:46:19.320
So we asked Lord that freedom shield could be developed here in this area and around the world in greater and greater measure give them

962
00:46:20.120 --> 00:46:22.120
influence give them

963
00:46:22.120 --> 00:46:29.440
Wisdom and anointing Lord you say we seek we shall find if we ask the door will be open and so father

964
00:46:29.440 --> 00:46:32.960
we're asking we're knocking we're seeking for you to

965
00:46:34.560 --> 00:46:37.600
Elevate the the work of freedom shield

966
00:46:38.320 --> 00:46:41.280
Around the world. So thank you for my brother

967
00:46:41.280 --> 00:46:46.880
Thank you for Michael and I pray Lord a blessing over him and his wife and his family protect them

968
00:46:47.480 --> 00:46:52.000
Give them lots of joy in the midst of this kind of

969
00:46:52.520 --> 00:46:56.040
Exposure, I pray Lord that the joy of the Lord will be their strength

970
00:46:56.640 --> 00:46:59.200
Thank you God in your name. We pray. Amen

971
00:46:59.840 --> 00:47:01.840
Thank you, Steve

972
00:47:12.960 --> 00:47:14.960
You