WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.360 Hey, welcome back to the Barry Farrow Show. It's great to have you with us today. 2 00:00:03.360 --> 00:00:06.720 Today, we're going to talk with a religious freedom expert. 3 00:00:21.440 --> 00:00:25.600 You know, on every level, we see this religious exemption being threatened, 4 00:00:25.600 --> 00:00:29.840 challenged. But first, before we jump into that, let's just take a quick moment to review 5 00:00:29.840 --> 00:00:35.440 the latest YouTube policy. You know, they were already censoring anyone that said anything about 6 00:00:35.440 --> 00:00:40.960 vaccine passports that spoke against the vaccine in any explicit way. But now they've gone to a 7 00:00:40.960 --> 00:00:46.880 whole new level. Now, they're expanding to any argument, no matter how factual it is, 8 00:00:46.880 --> 00:00:52.160 that's in conflict with the CDC narrative, even from around the world with respected 9 00:00:52.960 --> 00:00:58.240 scientists and medical doctors. The problem with the position that YouTube is taking 10 00:00:58.240 --> 00:01:05.120 is they've expanded to the presumption that they know everything. And as smart as those guys are, 11 00:01:05.120 --> 00:01:09.040 they don't know everything. You know, they claim that something's a falsehood, when in fact, 12 00:01:09.040 --> 00:01:14.880 it's merely a controversy, or it might even be a set of facts that they disagree with. Of course, 13 00:01:14.880 --> 00:01:20.640 even the creation of the data analytics software that they rely on to develop and do all their 14 00:01:20.640 --> 00:01:26.240 great algorithms, the very software they work with, they had to go against the mainstream to 15 00:01:26.240 --> 00:01:31.440 get it developed. And you know, most of the innovations that we enjoy today rely upon new 16 00:01:31.440 --> 00:01:38.480 school, not old school technology driven by going against the consensus view. Plus, by just shutting 17 00:01:38.480 --> 00:01:44.240 down every alternative view to the COVID-19 narrative, they further deepen mistrust. They 18 00:01:44.240 --> 00:01:48.560 show that they're really trying to hide something, or it sure seems that way. I mean, why not broadcast 19 00:01:48.560 --> 00:01:53.680 Merck's latest drug that seems to work as a therapeutic beautifully, and it's just a pill? 20 00:01:53.680 --> 00:01:59.520 Or why not broadcast the proven monoclonal that's being used in Texas and Florida to 21 00:01:59.520 --> 00:02:04.320 give it more traction to helping people, saving lives? I mean, why not shout from the mountaintops 22 00:02:04.320 --> 00:02:09.039 that the latest studies from around the world on natural immunity actually proved natural 23 00:02:09.039 --> 00:02:13.840 immunity is pretty darn good. God kind of knows what he's doing. You know, truth really shouldn't 24 00:02:13.840 --> 00:02:20.160 be intimidated by anyone else's view. If the vaccine is as safe and non-intrusive as they 25 00:02:20.160 --> 00:02:25.920 claim, they could just simply point to the adverse reactions page on CDC's website, and they could 26 00:02:25.920 --> 00:02:31.680 make their counterclaim with simple math, if it's true. This, in conjunction with the Federal Medical 27 00:02:31.680 --> 00:02:36.560 License Board's punitive impact on doctors who disagree with the current narrative, just really 28 00:02:36.560 --> 00:02:41.920 goes in the opposite direction of free speech and open society. And it really leads to the 29 00:02:41.920 --> 00:02:48.800 suppression of truth. And they're in fact responsible for a one-sided view, and that leads to expansion 30 00:02:48.800 --> 00:02:53.920 of misinformation, not the other way around. In other words, by trying to clamp down on what they 31 00:02:53.920 --> 00:02:59.600 think is true, but they don't really know for sure is true, they in fact eliminate the possibility 32 00:02:59.600 --> 00:03:05.760 of discovering truth. And you know, that's exactly what happened to Galileo. He's way back in the 17th 33 00:03:05.760 --> 00:03:12.160 century. He's known as the father of science, the father of astronomy, the father of the scientific 34 00:03:12.160 --> 00:03:18.320 method, yet he was branded as a heretic and under house arrest for a large chunk of his adult life. 35 00:03:18.400 --> 00:03:24.880 And that's because he went against the consensus view, but the consensus was wrong. If the consensus 36 00:03:24.880 --> 00:03:30.240 in this case is right, they have nothing to fear and they shouldn't clamp down. Well, hey, today 37 00:03:30.240 --> 00:03:36.160 we've got an expert from First Freedom Institute, Jeremy Dice. He's special counsel for litigation 38 00:03:36.160 --> 00:03:41.680 and communications. You know, in the episode, Jeremy, where YouTube censored me a couple of 39 00:03:41.680 --> 00:03:52.800 weeks ago, I was simply retelling the story of a fantastic young man who has been attempting to 40 00:03:52.800 --> 00:03:57.920 get his religious exemption processed through the airline that he works for. And you know, 41 00:03:57.920 --> 00:04:03.840 we got censored, we got canceled out. We still got a lot of views on Rumble and thankfully we've got 42 00:04:03.840 --> 00:04:08.640 a kind of a backup plan, but I guess YouTube just didn't like the facts. I mean, it was simply a 43 00:04:08.640 --> 00:04:12.960 story, this guy's journey. And he and hundreds of other pilots are claiming that they really 44 00:04:12.960 --> 00:04:17.440 weren't given a reasonable accommodation because though they were technically given the religious 45 00:04:17.440 --> 00:04:23.280 exemption, and that was after a whole series of intrusive questions, they were given it without 46 00:04:23.280 --> 00:04:30.080 pay and without benefits. So it doesn't seem like that much of a reasonable accommodation. 47 00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:36.160 What are your thoughts on the airlines? I know the one I'm talking about you don't represent. 48 00:04:36.800 --> 00:04:40.880 Do they have any, so maybe you can speak more freely about it. Do they have any chance of 49 00:04:40.880 --> 00:04:45.680 prevailing in court? Yeah, look, I don't represent any of the airlines, thankfully, 50 00:04:45.680 --> 00:04:48.480 so I think I can be kind of clear on all of us. In fact, we're suing one of them, 51 00:04:48.480 --> 00:04:52.160 which I'll tell you about in a moment. But first of all, thanks for having me on the show today. 52 00:04:54.640 --> 00:04:58.160 Thanks for letting us catch up with you on the shooting range. I know that that's more important, 53 00:04:58.160 --> 00:04:59.840 but thanks for giving. 54 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:03.760 some time. Where else would you find a first amendment scholar but exercising his second 55 00:05:03.760 --> 00:05:08.960 amendment rights, right? So yeah, look, look, these are tough issues. And for the airlines, 56 00:05:08.960 --> 00:05:15.200 I get it. Look, we're talking right now. And the latest news is that I think 1000 or 2000 flights 57 00:05:15.200 --> 00:05:19.280 from Southwest Airlines were canceled. And they're saying that's weather, but that's not 58 00:05:19.280 --> 00:05:24.640 weather. There are sick outs being called in all over the country in protest of these vaccines. 59 00:05:25.520 --> 00:05:29.280 And look, I'm not going to take a position one way or the other on vaccines, everybody can have 60 00:05:29.280 --> 00:05:32.800 their own position on it all. And that's what we used to call freedom in this country. And that's 61 00:05:32.800 --> 00:05:38.800 what I care about. When you have United Airlines right now insisting that every member of their 62 00:05:38.800 --> 00:05:45.600 staff get vaccinated, that level of mandate is going to actually have the opposite intended 63 00:05:45.600 --> 00:05:50.320 effect. And so if they're intending for people to help save lives and protect health, or going 64 00:05:50.320 --> 00:05:55.200 about it, I think the backwards way of doing so because they've clearly never parented a teenager, 65 00:05:55.200 --> 00:06:00.160 when you tell somebody to do one thing, they want to do the opposite thing every time. And I think 66 00:06:00.160 --> 00:06:04.640 that's where we find ourselves right now is people wanting to figure out, okay, wait, I was on the 67 00:06:04.640 --> 00:06:08.400 fence about this. But now that you tell me I have to do it. Well, by golly, I'm not going to do it 68 00:06:08.400 --> 00:06:12.960 whatsoever. Right? And that's really kind of an unfortunate situation to find ourselves in. Will 69 00:06:12.960 --> 00:06:18.720 United Airlines be successful? That's the million dollar question all these things. What I think we 70 00:06:18.720 --> 00:06:25.520 can all agree on is that by not offering or not respecting religious accommodations or exemptions, 71 00:06:26.080 --> 00:06:31.200 I think they're further entrenching the us versus them mentality on things. A religious 72 00:06:31.200 --> 00:06:36.240 exemption exists when people recognize that religion is a valid thing for us to live our lives 73 00:06:36.240 --> 00:06:44.240 by. Let me let me interrupt you real quick. What is a religious exemption? What's the definition of 74 00:06:44.560 --> 00:06:49.440 Yeah, the simple statement is that you are exempted from some sort of requirement based 75 00:06:49.440 --> 00:06:55.440 upon your religious beliefs or conscience. And that's the very simple idea of that. But underlying 76 00:06:55.440 --> 00:07:00.480 all that is the philosophical side of things, which says that if the why do we accommodate 77 00:07:00.480 --> 00:07:05.120 religion in general, opposed to we understand what a medical exemption would be, I have a 78 00:07:05.120 --> 00:07:09.360 medical condition that would require me to be exempted from an otherwise valid requirement. 79 00:07:09.360 --> 00:07:13.600 Well, it's the same sort of thing when we recognize that there is something to which we 80 00:07:13.600 --> 00:07:19.680 owe a higher duty and responsibility, God in this case, in that practice with the divine, that 81 00:07:19.680 --> 00:07:25.440 vertical relationship that we have requires a recognition either by our employers or by the 82 00:07:25.440 --> 00:07:30.000 government itself, that we need to give them the space to be able to have that freedom. And this 83 00:07:30.000 --> 00:07:36.000 is all that our foundation stone of freedom is built upon this respect for one's relationship, 84 00:07:36.000 --> 00:07:40.640 not just horizontally with our neighbors here, but vertically with our God, there are some things 85 00:07:40.640 --> 00:07:45.520 that the divine requires us to do, that the government may want to get in on and say you 86 00:07:45.520 --> 00:07:49.200 can't do. But because of that vertical relationship, we're going to afford them the 87 00:07:49.200 --> 00:07:54.240 space to be able to have that, that freedom to do that thing. And so when employers in this case, 88 00:07:54.240 --> 00:07:59.200 don't respect that religious belief, or in some cases, as I think we've seen too many times now, 89 00:07:59.200 --> 00:08:03.680 they view it as sort of this magic fairy dust that we can sprinkle on things to get out of 90 00:08:03.680 --> 00:08:10.400 otherwise require other requirements, that has a real danger to not only showing tolerance and 91 00:08:10.400 --> 00:08:15.680 respect, but also to undermining our very freedoms that we have come to know and love so much. 92 00:08:15.680 --> 00:08:25.280 So what are the different ways to credibly apply for a religious exemption in this situation? So I 93 00:08:26.240 --> 00:08:34.960 I kind of walked that journey with this pilot, and he is of the Christian faith. And it's a 94 00:08:34.960 --> 00:08:41.919 classical, traditional faith, it's not brand new to just the vaccine, I think it predates the vaccine 95 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:49.760 by a couple 1000 years. And so he argued in two ways. Number one, he's very, very pro-life, 96 00:08:49.760 --> 00:08:56.000 very sensitive to that issue. And people can have different opinions on this. But he 97 00:08:56.000 --> 00:09:02.640 sincerely believes that anything that's connected to abortion in any way, shape or form is evil. So 98 00:09:02.640 --> 00:09:07.920 even if you have a aborted fetus, and I know some people argue, well, now that it's abortus, you go 99 00:09:07.920 --> 00:09:14.000 ahead and use what you need to advance science. Others say, no, you can't have any connection 100 00:09:14.000 --> 00:09:20.000 with that whatsoever, because that's a violation of my deeply held belief. Is that a legitimate 101 00:09:20.720 --> 00:09:26.400 religious exemption? Well, I believe so. Look, I would actually back that train up a little bit 102 00:09:26.400 --> 00:09:30.560 further down the track, which is to say that if someone says I have a sincere religious belief 103 00:09:30.560 --> 00:09:36.000 that requires me to not do x, or maybe the best state of the other way around that prevents me 104 00:09:36.000 --> 00:09:41.360 from doing what you require me to do, that ought to really end the matter. And the problem that 105 00:09:41.360 --> 00:09:47.040 we're having, so you ask, but what's the process? Well, the process is you assert that in writing, 106 00:09:47.040 --> 00:09:52.480 or to your HR person in an email, or by voice. And then they have to figure out a way to be 107 00:09:52.480 --> 00:09:57.360 able to accommodate you so long as it does not pose an undue hardship to the company that you're 108 00:09:57.360 --> 00:09:59.760 working for. But that's not what they did. 109 00:10:00.000 --> 00:10:05.760 No, I know. But that's not what they did. They came back and asked him a series. I saw all the emails. 110 00:10:05.760 --> 00:10:12.560 It was four or five series of intrusive questions going back in time, asking him whether or not he 111 00:10:12.560 --> 00:10:19.440 was a was a real, genuine Christian, as if those secular humanists had any idea how to assess that. 112 00:10:22.720 --> 00:10:26.480 That's exactly what I'm getting. That is that that first statement says I have a sincere 113 00:10:26.480 --> 00:10:31.520 religious belief. This is where the divide is in our country right now, is that there is a divide 114 00:10:31.520 --> 00:10:36.560 between the sincere and the insincere, if I can put it that way. People who sincerely believe 115 00:10:36.560 --> 00:10:42.800 religious beliefs have meaning and impact upon their not only lives, but their eternal souls. 116 00:10:42.800 --> 00:10:46.480 Those who think that that is just simply insincere talk about wanting to get out of something that 117 00:10:46.480 --> 00:10:53.360 they want you to do. What that divide is leading to is this horrible thing where you have people 118 00:10:53.360 --> 00:10:58.000 that are saying, hey, you don't really believe that. And so we're going to force you to violate 119 00:10:58.000 --> 00:11:02.720 your conscience. Now, hold on a second. What what is the implications of that? This is really dire 120 00:11:02.720 --> 00:11:06.640 stuff, if you think about it. What someone is saying is that I have a sincere religious belief 121 00:11:06.640 --> 00:11:14.160 that if I violate this standard, my life is not just simply in jeopardy. My eternal soul is in 122 00:11:14.160 --> 00:11:21.840 jeopardy. If that is the case, this is genuinely how people feel. Exactly right. And so there is a 123 00:11:22.240 --> 00:11:27.120 growing number of people, unfortunately, that believe that they're just simply trying to grab 124 00:11:27.120 --> 00:11:31.920 a magic pixie dust and throw religion on this to say, hey, I want to get out of waiting in line 125 00:11:31.920 --> 00:11:37.920 for something. That is beyond the pale. What we're actually arguing about is if you force me to do 126 00:11:37.920 --> 00:11:44.160 this, whether it is violate my conscience on the issue of aborted fetal matter or just simply 127 00:11:44.160 --> 00:11:48.320 violate my conscience on putting something in my body that is untested or whatever the 128 00:11:48.320 --> 00:11:55.120 justification for it actually is, if you force me to violate that, it's not simply that my mind is 129 00:11:55.120 --> 00:12:02.080 broken or that my heart is disaffected. It means that my eternal soul is in jeopardy here. And that 130 00:12:02.080 --> 00:12:07.600 level of intolerance is really concerning in a society that otherwise believes itself to be free. 131 00:12:07.600 --> 00:12:13.840 So does the government have a right to deny a religious exemption? 132 00:12:14.800 --> 00:12:18.560 Well, we're kind of mixing things here a little bit here. So the government itself is an employer 133 00:12:18.560 --> 00:12:24.400 and employees are employees of private corporations. And so there is a law that's called Title 7 134 00:12:24.400 --> 00:12:28.960 and that protects employers of 50 or more employees. And so if they are, if you're in, 135 00:12:28.960 --> 00:12:33.280 so most employees are subject to this kind of requirement, Title 7 requires. 136 00:12:33.280 --> 00:12:38.240 I'm actually talking about, I'm actually talking about the employees of the government. So they've 137 00:12:38.240 --> 00:12:42.960 got a few million employees. Do they have the right to deny the religious exemption as they 138 00:12:43.040 --> 00:12:46.960 apparently have been doing with him? So it's the same kind of analysis, 139 00:12:46.960 --> 00:12:51.120 just kind of going down two different tracks here. Yeah. So employers like the government, 140 00:12:51.120 --> 00:12:54.560 if you're a government employee, you still have religious liberty. You still have the rights as 141 00:12:54.560 --> 00:12:59.520 an employee to, to have your religion at work. And so you cannot be forced by the government 142 00:12:59.520 --> 00:13:03.760 to violate those convictions. Now I should be very clear on this point. If you're an employee 143 00:13:03.760 --> 00:13:09.200 of the government, there is a mandate supposedly out there for you. But if you're a private employee, 144 00:13:09.200 --> 00:13:12.720 there is an announced mandate that is supposed to be coming, but is yet to come. 145 00:13:12.720 --> 00:13:18.480 So does the mandate, does that mandate have the force of law? It's a mandate from the 146 00:13:18.480 --> 00:13:24.400 chief executive, I guess, of your employer with the government, but does, is it an actual law 147 00:13:24.400 --> 00:13:29.440 when he makes the mandate? It should be right. I mean, this is administrative law. So yes, 148 00:13:29.440 --> 00:13:34.400 it has the force and effect of law. It has to be rooted upon an act of Congress in order for it to 149 00:13:34.400 --> 00:13:38.720 give full force and effect. In other words, it has to be derived from something the legislature 150 00:13:38.720 --> 00:13:43.440 has said, you go here and execute these laws. If OSHA, the Occupational Safety and Health 151 00:13:43.440 --> 00:13:48.160 Administration cannot root itself in that law, then of course it's not a valid force of law. 152 00:13:48.160 --> 00:13:53.440 That I think is what is going to be the substance of the legal debate once that mandate for private 153 00:13:53.440 --> 00:13:57.680 employers is actually fully announced by OSHA. Hasn't come yet. Now, if you're a government 154 00:13:57.680 --> 00:14:02.800 employee, I do understand there to be a mandate in effect. We see this right now with our members 155 00:14:02.800 --> 00:14:08.400 of the military and contractors that are having a certain amount of time to get their shot put 156 00:14:08.400 --> 00:14:13.520 in place or not. And so I think we're going to see more and more challenges arising to these things 157 00:14:13.520 --> 00:14:18.800 as the conscience objections are denied by the federal agencies around the country. 158 00:14:19.760 --> 00:14:27.120 So let's go to a different thought, and that's just what the typical business guy has 159 00:14:29.360 --> 00:14:37.680 asked. Is there anything that a host like me can do to sue YouTube? I mean, I was canceled for 160 00:14:37.680 --> 00:14:45.280 simply retelling the story of an airline pilot's journey. Is there any claim for an implied in 161 00:14:45.280 --> 00:14:51.440 fact contract? You know, we're like a restaurant expects to be paid after the meal is delivered. 162 00:14:51.440 --> 00:14:56.400 So even though that customer didn't sign a contract, it's pretty obvious he came in there, 163 00:14:56.400 --> 00:14:59.840 he ordered food, he ate the food. And then if he gets 164 00:15:00.000 --> 00:15:04.400 up and just leaves without paying you know the restaurant owner could have some kind of a claim 165 00:15:04.400 --> 00:15:08.640 I'm not sure it'd be worth chasing but if you wanted to he could claim based on an implied 166 00:15:08.640 --> 00:15:16.720 in fact contract as I understand it. So in a similar vein could a YouTube host expect 167 00:15:16.720 --> 00:15:22.720 to keep their following expect to be able to say as long as it's legal whatever they want to 168 00:15:23.440 --> 00:15:28.880 or is there any way that litigation would prevail using some kind of a logic like that? 169 00:15:30.480 --> 00:15:35.440 Maybe and I hate to use the law school answer that it depends here but this is where we're 170 00:15:35.440 --> 00:15:39.280 right in the middle of a discussion about this right now. Look we sued America or I'm sorry 171 00:15:39.280 --> 00:15:43.680 Alaska Airlines a couple weeks ago. We filed an employment complaint against them as I guess it 172 00:15:43.680 --> 00:15:48.720 would be the more proper designation. We made a video telling our this is the flight attendant 173 00:15:48.720 --> 00:15:52.240 who used their internal server to make some comments about her faith on that and then she 174 00:15:52.240 --> 00:15:58.880 was summarily fired for doing so. Actually even ushered off the plane. It's really quite shocking. 175 00:15:58.880 --> 00:16:04.240 Well we went to the Seattle airport we took our cameras we took video of the Alaska 176 00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:09.280 airline planes kind of driving around the tarmac and has their logo on the side of the plane as 177 00:16:09.280 --> 00:16:14.080 you remember. Well we put that out as soon as we announced the case we put that story out and that 178 00:16:14.080 --> 00:16:17.360 was the b-roll so that section that where you don't have somebody talking it's just kind of 179 00:16:17.360 --> 00:16:22.880 background noise that's out there of those planes going around the airport. We shot the video they 180 00:16:22.880 --> 00:16:28.240 were in public view there is there's no copyright violation here or any other expectation of privacy 181 00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:35.200 I put that on YouTube and Alaska Airlines actually complained they flagged that video 182 00:16:35.200 --> 00:16:40.160 to YouTube and got that video shut down over the weekend. Unbelievable. Now I was really 183 00:16:40.160 --> 00:16:45.360 bothered by that. You guys have it up on rumble? It's up on rumble but it got back up on YouTube. 184 00:16:45.360 --> 00:16:48.640 Now let me tell you the rest of the story what happened here and this is why I think this is 185 00:16:48.640 --> 00:16:52.880 such a nefarious thing that we need to start working on here. What happened is that they 186 00:16:52.880 --> 00:16:57.440 asserted a claim to their copyright. There was no legitimate claim to their copyright but as soon as 187 00:16:57.440 --> 00:17:03.120 they assert that claim on copyright Google is required by I think it's called the Uniform 188 00:17:03.120 --> 00:17:09.680 Millennial Data Privacy Act or something like that they're required to take that video down. 189 00:17:09.680 --> 00:17:14.720 It's a must language in a statute they have to take it down and if they don't the copyright owner 190 00:17:14.720 --> 00:17:20.880 can can hit them for a five-figure penalty. Well that's pretty substantial and I can understand 191 00:17:20.880 --> 00:17:26.400 that. Now here's the here's the trick there's no equal and opposite movement to that. In other 192 00:17:26.400 --> 00:17:32.720 words Alaska Airlines pulled this as a litigation trick so that our client having violated their 193 00:17:32.720 --> 00:17:38.640 her religious rights as an employee now was denying their her rights as a First Amendment 194 00:17:38.640 --> 00:17:43.520 as a citizen under First Amendment rights. That I think is very very concerning here and so I'd 195 00:17:43.520 --> 00:17:48.240 like to have a discussion with the Senate with the Congress saying look I get the fact that you want 196 00:17:48.240 --> 00:17:52.960 to protect the employers and these companies with their copyrights. I understand that. I think we 197 00:17:52.960 --> 00:17:58.160 can all agree upon that but when they use this for negative and nefarious purposes like they did 198 00:17:58.160 --> 00:18:02.400 in this case to shut down the free speech rights of citizens that are otherwise just simply trying 199 00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:07.920 to assert their rights with legal counsel I might add that goes a bridge too far and I think the 200 00:18:07.920 --> 00:18:12.640 same penalty that is imposed against Google and YouTube ought to be imposed against the employers 201 00:18:12.640 --> 00:18:16.480 for trying to pull this kind of a stunt. So when it comes to situations like that I think we can 202 00:18:16.480 --> 00:18:21.120 have the discussion when it comes to situations like yours it's it's a hard thing to figure out 203 00:18:21.120 --> 00:18:25.360 because the First Amendment doesn't traditionally apply within the private sphere of YouTube 204 00:18:25.360 --> 00:18:29.120 but that's where we find ourselves in right now which is why I say it depends. I think there's a 205 00:18:29.120 --> 00:18:35.920 discussion going on right now to figure out is YouTube the next private park right we know the 206 00:18:35.920 --> 00:18:39.600 private public square right you go downtown there's a park you go out there you should be 207 00:18:39.600 --> 00:18:44.480 entitled to be able to hand out literature and say whatever you want on that green. If that is owned 208 00:18:44.480 --> 00:18:50.480 by a private entity that analysis changes a little bit but not fully and so we're gonna we're gonna 209 00:18:50.480 --> 00:18:56.480 figure out now whether YouTube and Facebook and Twitter and all the other socials are these sort of 210 00:18:56.480 --> 00:19:02.720 this public private partnership that is the new public square for us to insert the First Amendment 211 00:19:02.720 --> 00:19:09.280 to fully protect our our residents around the nation. Thank you for that answer yeah 212 00:19:10.000 --> 00:19:14.800 from a business standpoint I would think that that implied in fact contract which hasn't really been 213 00:19:14.800 --> 00:19:21.200 tested to my knowledge would have some potential bearing it's you know when I when I go into 214 00:19:21.200 --> 00:19:25.600 business with someone I've got things that are not mentioned in our contract that always happens 215 00:19:25.600 --> 00:19:32.800 especially in any kind of a complex deal and there are things though that are implied that you have to 216 00:19:34.000 --> 00:19:40.320 hold up your end of the the deal on and for someone to willy-nilly yank someone's potential 217 00:19:40.320 --> 00:19:45.120 for reach or what have you through a platform that they previously believed would allow for a 218 00:19:45.120 --> 00:19:50.640 free use of it I would think would have some bearing but you're saying so far there's there's 219 00:19:50.640 --> 00:19:55.600 I don't think anybody's tried that but you don't know if that would have I'm willing to pick up 220 00:19:55.600 --> 00:19:59.840 every success I'll pick up every stick and rock that's laying on the path on the way to victory 221 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:01.420 to be able to use it. 222 00:20:01.420 --> 00:20:02.820 I would certainly be glad. 223 00:20:02.820 --> 00:20:04.200 I think there's gonna be all the arguments 224 00:20:04.200 --> 00:20:05.140 that need to be made. 225 00:20:05.140 --> 00:20:07.340 The question mark is what is going to be the outcome on them 226 00:20:07.340 --> 00:20:08.700 and that's what we're trying to figure out. 227 00:20:08.700 --> 00:20:11.020 But what I think we can all agree on and should agree on 228 00:20:11.020 --> 00:20:15.220 is that when companies or even the cancel culture mob 229 00:20:15.220 --> 00:20:18.860 uses those well-meaning laws 230 00:20:18.860 --> 00:20:22.220 for a negative and censorious effect, 231 00:20:22.220 --> 00:20:23.940 we have a right, we have a duty, frankly, 232 00:20:23.940 --> 00:20:26.300 to point that out wherever we possibly can. 233 00:20:26.300 --> 00:20:27.940 And then eventually to say, wait a minute, 234 00:20:27.940 --> 00:20:30.100 we've got to have different adjustments to the law 235 00:20:30.100 --> 00:20:31.500 to make sure things are corrected. 236 00:20:31.500 --> 00:20:33.980 So in the case of our Alaska Airlines case, 237 00:20:34.980 --> 00:20:37.780 the opposite intended effect occurred with that law. 238 00:20:37.780 --> 00:20:38.700 They followed the law, 239 00:20:38.700 --> 00:20:41.260 but it actually negated my client's first member rights, 240 00:20:41.260 --> 00:20:43.220 at least for a period of three or four days. 241 00:20:43.220 --> 00:20:44.580 That's wrong and we can fix that 242 00:20:44.580 --> 00:20:46.460 with a little tweak of the law. 243 00:20:46.460 --> 00:20:50.140 In cases with hosts like you and others, 244 00:20:50.140 --> 00:20:53.460 the cancel culture mob has been regrettably winning 245 00:20:53.460 --> 00:20:55.180 the ideological war on that. 246 00:20:55.180 --> 00:20:56.340 I think that's gonna be a war 247 00:20:56.340 --> 00:20:58.900 that's gonna be more won on the ideological side of things 248 00:20:58.900 --> 00:21:01.540 than is on the litigation side of things. 249 00:21:01.540 --> 00:21:03.580 But I think it may take the litigation 250 00:21:03.580 --> 00:21:05.900 in order to push the policy 251 00:21:05.900 --> 00:21:08.320 and the ideology in the right direction. 252 00:21:09.380 --> 00:21:11.820 Let's move to one more thing. 253 00:21:11.820 --> 00:21:14.540 We just saw that this Michigan judge, 254 00:21:14.540 --> 00:21:17.260 a Bush appointee actually, 255 00:21:17.260 --> 00:21:20.440 denied this claim for natural immunity. 256 00:21:20.440 --> 00:21:23.580 Apparently this gal, an employee of Michigan State, 257 00:21:24.420 --> 00:21:27.500 was able to present that she had two antibody tests. 258 00:21:27.500 --> 00:21:30.740 She was able to show that and that she's healthy. 259 00:21:30.740 --> 00:21:32.300 And her doctors told her 260 00:21:32.300 --> 00:21:34.540 she didn't need to get the vaccine at this time 261 00:21:34.540 --> 00:21:36.340 because they felt like her natural immunity 262 00:21:36.340 --> 00:21:38.100 was strong enough. 263 00:21:38.100 --> 00:21:40.900 So she faces this termination from the university 264 00:21:40.900 --> 00:21:43.020 for not complying with Michigan State's mandate 265 00:21:43.020 --> 00:21:45.780 that everybody, students and staff, have to get the shot 266 00:21:45.780 --> 00:21:48.740 unless they have a medical or religious exemption. 267 00:21:48.740 --> 00:21:50.220 So she's going on a different basis. 268 00:21:50.220 --> 00:21:53.220 She's attempting to go on a health claim. 269 00:21:53.220 --> 00:21:55.860 Basically, wake up everyone, 270 00:21:55.860 --> 00:22:00.860 look at all these arguments for the natural immunity. 271 00:22:00.900 --> 00:22:03.100 And now we've got over a dozen studies 272 00:22:03.100 --> 00:22:04.980 that are peer-reviewed worldwide 273 00:22:04.980 --> 00:22:07.660 that say that natural immunity is equal or better 274 00:22:07.660 --> 00:22:08.920 than the actual vaccine. 275 00:22:08.920 --> 00:22:10.380 So you can take the vaccine, 276 00:22:10.380 --> 00:22:12.060 you can have the natural immunity, 277 00:22:12.060 --> 00:22:14.060 and those two are at least equal. 278 00:22:14.060 --> 00:22:16.580 Anyway, the judge denied her lawsuit. 279 00:22:16.580 --> 00:22:19.020 He said the mandate didn't violate her fundamental rights. 280 00:22:19.020 --> 00:22:21.980 He pointed to this 1905 ruling. 281 00:22:21.980 --> 00:22:23.020 What are your thoughts about that? 282 00:22:23.020 --> 00:22:26.740 Is there any way to update that 1905 Supreme Court ruling 283 00:22:26.740 --> 00:22:27.940 or how does that work? 284 00:22:27.940 --> 00:22:29.660 And what are your thoughts? 285 00:22:29.660 --> 00:22:31.100 This is a really, really tough issue 286 00:22:31.100 --> 00:22:32.580 because of that case in 1905, 287 00:22:32.580 --> 00:22:35.340 the Occasion versus Massachusetts, it was smallpox. 288 00:22:35.340 --> 00:22:37.020 And so we're trying to figure out 289 00:22:37.020 --> 00:22:39.060 whether or not that applies today or not. 290 00:22:39.060 --> 00:22:40.300 The Supreme Court really just hasn't given us 291 00:22:40.300 --> 00:22:41.140 any guidance on that. 292 00:22:41.140 --> 00:22:42.340 Ultimately, that's gonna be the answer 293 00:22:42.340 --> 00:22:43.820 is what the Supreme Court ultimately says 294 00:22:43.820 --> 00:22:44.900 about the whole thing. 295 00:22:44.900 --> 00:22:46.780 Now, common sense would seem to kick in here, right? 296 00:22:46.980 --> 00:22:51.760 If you have natural immunity to the chickenpox, 297 00:22:51.760 --> 00:22:53.460 do you really need a booster shot? 298 00:22:54.380 --> 00:22:56.060 The science is pretty well settled on that one, 299 00:22:56.060 --> 00:22:57.840 I would think here. 300 00:22:57.840 --> 00:22:59.940 Look, it's gonna take a while for us 301 00:22:59.940 --> 00:23:02.660 to sort this whole thing out, unfortunately. 302 00:23:02.660 --> 00:23:05.820 And regrettably, the common sense doesn't seem 303 00:23:05.820 --> 00:23:07.940 to be that terribly common right now 304 00:23:07.940 --> 00:23:09.260 to carry these things through. 305 00:23:09.260 --> 00:23:11.140 So I would continue to encourage folks 306 00:23:11.140 --> 00:23:14.380 to go to firstliberty.org and kind of look at our guidance 307 00:23:14.380 --> 00:23:16.400 that we have on there at the top of the page. 308 00:23:17.020 --> 00:23:18.520 It'll help you think through and walk through the steps 309 00:23:18.520 --> 00:23:20.440 that you need to take in order to request 310 00:23:20.440 --> 00:23:22.640 a religious accommodation and religious exemption. 311 00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:24.520 I wanna kind of give a little bit of hope here 312 00:23:24.520 --> 00:23:27.720 because there have been many that have followed those steps 313 00:23:27.720 --> 00:23:30.420 and received a religious accommodation. 314 00:23:30.420 --> 00:23:32.660 If you're an employer in a private company, 315 00:23:32.660 --> 00:23:35.540 let me remind you, there is no federal mandate right now 316 00:23:35.540 --> 00:23:37.640 for your employees to be vaccinated. 317 00:23:37.640 --> 00:23:40.460 You're simply following the bully pulpit of the president 318 00:23:40.460 --> 00:23:43.240 saying, I'm gonna issue a mandate 319 00:23:43.240 --> 00:23:45.920 for every employee to be vaccinated. 320 00:23:46.040 --> 00:23:48.400 But you can hold out for right now, if you want to, 321 00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:50.280 you don't have to, if you wanna issue the mandate, 322 00:23:50.280 --> 00:23:53.280 that's between you, your shareholders, or your board 323 00:23:53.280 --> 00:23:54.840 to figure out whether or not that's the best thing 324 00:23:54.840 --> 00:23:56.160 for your employees. 325 00:23:56.160 --> 00:23:58.680 But I think we should all be taking a pause here 326 00:23:58.680 --> 00:24:02.720 to recognize how important the issue of religious liberty 327 00:24:02.720 --> 00:24:06.760 and accommodating that, however possible, can be. 328 00:24:06.760 --> 00:24:08.600 I have a friend, actually, he's an elder at my church, 329 00:24:08.600 --> 00:24:12.520 as a matter of fact, who had COVID, recovered from COVID, 330 00:24:12.600 --> 00:24:15.920 works remotely, still works remotely, 331 00:24:15.920 --> 00:24:18.720 and they're requiring their entire remote staff 332 00:24:18.720 --> 00:24:20.240 to become vaccinated. 333 00:24:20.240 --> 00:24:22.260 Now, that doesn't seem to have a real bearing 334 00:24:22.260 --> 00:24:25.280 on the protecting of people in the workplace. 335 00:24:25.280 --> 00:24:28.480 He's got natural immunity, he's not in the office, 336 00:24:28.480 --> 00:24:30.740 but I understand, he's older in age 337 00:24:30.740 --> 00:24:33.360 and he can't right now go out to run and get a job. 338 00:24:33.360 --> 00:24:36.120 Look, I think that is every bit as despicable 339 00:24:36.120 --> 00:24:39.560 and intolerant of someone's religious beliefs 340 00:24:39.560 --> 00:24:41.400 and their age, for that matter, 341 00:24:41.400 --> 00:24:44.360 to demand that someone who depends upon a livelihood 342 00:24:44.360 --> 00:24:46.240 of work to go and get something 343 00:24:46.240 --> 00:24:48.000 that they may or may not need. 344 00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:50.000 Look, again, I'm not gonna say anything for 345 00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:52.240 or against the vaccine, that's between you, 346 00:24:52.240 --> 00:24:54.080 your doctor, and your God, 347 00:24:54.080 --> 00:24:56.040 but I think employers need to take a long, hard look 348 00:24:56.040 --> 00:25:00.040 at these vaccine mandates and not follow the popular. 349 00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:04.240 trend that may be to say, hey, we're going to demand that people go out. Southwest Airlines 350 00:25:04.240 --> 00:25:09.280 is facing a real problem right now with their staff saying, we're not going to get the shot, 351 00:25:09.280 --> 00:25:14.320 we're walking off the job. The economic impact of that, as you well know, is going to be enormous, 352 00:25:14.320 --> 00:25:19.760 simply because they refuse to recognize a vast majority of people that have a common sense 353 00:25:19.760 --> 00:25:25.440 rationale, but also a religious or medical problem with getting these vaccines. At one time, 354 00:25:25.440 --> 00:25:29.600 we were the enemy of the free world in recognizing people's religious conscience. 355 00:25:29.600 --> 00:25:35.200 When can we get back to that? To recognize that our neighbors are not scary monsters because they 356 00:25:35.200 --> 00:25:40.880 are religious, but instead they are people of genuine goodwill who simply are trying to abide 357 00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:45.440 by their faith in a manner that pleases the divine. We ought to have room in this country 358 00:25:45.440 --> 00:25:52.000 for that to occur. Amen. Thank you, Jeremy. Fascinating stuff. Thank you for being all 359 00:25:52.000 --> 00:25:59.120 about freedom. First Freedom Institute listeners, great organization. Why do they call it the First 360 00:25:59.120 --> 00:26:04.720 Freedom Institute? Well, if you look at the First Amendment, the first part of the First Amendment 361 00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:10.720 is religious freedom. It's the freedom to believe, the freedom to freely exercise that belief. 362 00:26:11.360 --> 00:26:15.120 Thank you for fighting for us, Jeremy. You and your organization are great. 363 00:26:15.120 --> 00:26:18.400 God bless you and to your freedom. We'll see you next time. 364 00:26:45.120 --> 00:26:55.120 Transcribed by https://otter.ai