If your identity isn't anything other than Christ and that thing goes away,
it'll feel like a part of you died.
And I was like, that's what my identity was wrapped up in being a public school teacher.
Hey everyone.
I'm Steve Holt and this is the empower you podcasts.
And I'm joined today with Joey Follett, who is our youth pastor at the road
church here in Colorado Springs.
And Joey is one of our young guys who has come in and done a fabulous job with our youth group.
I think you've done a fantastic job, man.
Thank you.
Even with little, very little experience in that particular arena of church work,
yet a lot of experience working with young, young people in high school and stuff.
Right.
I'm really curious about what is your story as far as, first of all, coming to know Christ,
the family you grew up in.
Tell us a little bit about the journey you've been on, Joey.
Sure.
Well, I grew up here in the Springs in a Christian home,
went to a Baptist church in the Springs and grew up knowing the Lord, Christian school too,
really blessed with the biblical upbringing that I had, both at church, which was a real
intense, you could say, Bible-believing teaching church.
And then same thing at school even.
And so I knew throughout my upbringing, knew the Lord, walked with the Lord,
and also knew that I loved being around kids.
And even in high school, I volunteered at summer camps and was like a middle school
counselor at a Christian summer camp and things like that.
And so I knew in high school that I thought I wanted to, I knew I wanted to do something
with kids.
So I thought, I guess I'll be a teacher.
And history was the only subject I did okay in at school.
It was the only one I liked.
So I said, I guess I'll be a history teacher.
In hindsight, I should have done PE, but history was fun.
So I became a history teacher.
I went to school for that, joined the military as well.
So I got to do that part-time for a while.
And then I went to school to be a history teacher.
And I started doing that here in the Springs, taught eighth grade history for a while.
How long did you do that?
I did it for four years and I coached, got to coach a bunch of sports,
mainly wrestling, but got to coach a lot of stuff while I was teaching as well.
So were you doing wrestling in high school?
Yeah, I wrestled elementary, middle school and high school,
and then started coaching while I was in college.
And you're coaching now, aren't you?
Yeah, I still get to do that.
Yeah, it was really fun.
And you're doing it at a local high school?
Local middle school.
Middle school.
And how's that been for you?
That's great.
I got back, I took a few years off and I got back into that last year.
And that's a lot of fun.
Just kind of a different way to interact with students and make a difference.
And I love wrestling, so it's great.
And then how did you meet Allie?
We met in high school.
So I was a senior, she was a sophomore,
and we had known each other as a small Christian school.
I had played soccer with her brother.
So we knew each other well, but we're friends.
And then I asked her to Homecoming my senior year,
and we've been together ever since.
My goodness.
And how many kids?
We got three kids, three boys.
Well, I tell you, when I see Miles and the whole crew come in,
I just feel for you guys because I remember those days.
I love being a dad and Liz love being a mom.
How has kids had a difference, made a difference in your life?
Oh man, it made a huge difference in our life.
We were married for, I think, about two years before our oldest, Miles, was born.
And that transition was tough, really.
I think we both always knew we wanted to have kids.
We both loved kids.
And so we were like, yeah, of course we'll have kids.
And I don't think we really understood what that transition's like
until it happens to you.
And so I think it kind of took us both off guard for about a year.
And then we kind of figured out, wow, this is a big change.
And it was hard.
And once we kind of acknowledged that, then we've had two more since.
So it's been good.
So have you found that sometimes it's easier to be with other people's kids
than even to be with your own?
Yeah, both.
I think, yes, because other people's kids, you can give them back.
And that's kind of fun.
But yeah, and I just really have a heart for older kids, for teenagers especially.
And I always have.
And so, yeah, I love that I get to be around my little kids at home.
Our oldest is six.
And so I get to do that.
And then also in my other time, I get to hang out with teenagers.
It's important to them.
So I could do a little bit of both.
So going from like a high school teacher and then being in,
it would be the National Guard, right?
Yeah, the Air Force National Guard or Air National Guard.
Yes.
Air Guard to now being a pastor.
Yeah.
Tell me about how God spoke.
spoke to you and led you in that direction.
Yeah, that's, it's something that was never on my radar.
You know, like I said, I grew up in church
and was around pastors and, you know,
had youth pastor and youth leaders
that had a big impact on my life,
but it was never something I thought I would do,
was be a pastor.
And not that I didn't want to necessarily,
it's just, I don't know, it never occurred to me
that that was an option for me.
And so I was teaching,
and during my fourth year of teaching,
I, there are a few things that happened.
COVID had a big impact on public schools around here,
and we took a pay cut,
and I wasn't able to coach anymore,
which was important to me.
And they allowed high school to have sports,
but not middle school that year.
So I was coaching four sports,
making some good extra money,
and they pulled the plug on that,
so I didn't get to do that anymore.
And so I was starting for the first time,
I mean, I thought I was going to be
an eighth grade history teacher for 30 years.
Like that, at the school I was at,
I was like, I'm good, this is what I'm going to do.
Didn't really consider anything else until that moment
when there was all these other things happening.
I was like, man, maybe I should,
like, what else could I do?
And so I was working in the Air Force part-time,
and there was an opportunity to do the same job
I did in the Air Force, but as a civilian.
So I was trained for it.
It was a pretty good, well-paying government job
up in Denver.
And so I jumped on that.
It took a while, government moves a little slow.
So it took a while for that to happen,
but I did that, so I left teaching February
of my fourth year, kind of in the middle of the school year,
which wasn't my intent, but that's how it ended up.
And so I left, and I didn't know how hard that would be.
It kind of, it took me off guard.
My last day, I left, and I remember, like,
I didn't call Allie on the way home.
I usually do, I didn't call her on the way home
because I knew I would start crying.
Because it was really emotional for me,
and I didn't even know why.
And I think it hit me later, I was hanging out
with kind of a friend of my brother's,
I don't even see him very often,
and we were talking about it, and he told me,
if your identity isn't anything other than Christ,
and that thing goes away,
it'll feel like a part of you died.
And I was like, that's what, my identity was wrapped up
in being a public school teacher.
As weird as that might sound, like, that's who I was.
I liked it, I felt like I was good at it,
and I was happy doing that for a while.
And so when that was, and it was my own choice,
but still, when that was gone, it was really, really hard.
Because now I was doing a job where I wasn't around kids,
which is what I'm passionate about.
I wasn't teaching, which is where I think I'm gifted in,
and so I wasn't doing that anymore.
It was a government job that I enjoyed,
and it wasn't bad, but it wasn't where my gifts
and passions were.
And so I was sitting there thinking, like, man,
I just walked away from my dream job,
like, what I wanted to do.
And I was like, why did I do that?
And I knew why I did it, I mean, I really felt the Lord
leading me in this direction, I had peace about it big time.
And also I was doing it to support my family.
And so I had good reasoning behind it,
but it was still really hard.
And so it took me a few months,
but once I kind of accepted that idea of like,
and I also had another friend tell me,
just because your gifting is in teaching
doesn't mean you have to be an eighth grade history teacher.
There's other ways you can use it.
And so I didn't know where I was leading at the time,
but I was like, yeah, that's true.
And so I started working up there,
and it was going pretty well at first,
but I was missing kids.
So we were attending the church,
but weren't super plugged in yet.
And so I was like, I should serve with youth group.
So I talked to Pastor Ryan,
who was leading youth group at the time,
about serving with tribe.
And so I started doing that as a volunteer
for about a year.
And that was a lot of fun and got plugged in doing that.
And then after a year of doing this government job,
our second son was born and the commute
was getting really hard and long shifts
and had to do night shifts,
which was hard with young kids.
And so we were praying about a lot.
I was applying for all sorts of jobs and getting nothing.
And Allie and I both had,
it was a worship night here at the church,
and we were praying through it
and singing the song Tremble.
And there's a line that says, you silence fear.
And so I felt like the Lord was leading me
to quit that job, but I didn't have anything lined up.
And so I said, Lord, if I'm supposed to do that,
you gotta silence my fear.
Because I've got a family to support
and I don't know what's next.
And I did, I had an overwhelming sense of peace
and so did Allie and we had some friends
pray over us for that.
So I still dragged my feet for about a month,
but then I finally did quit.
And three days later, found out about the opportunity here.
And so it was just so obvious to me
that the Lord was lining that up
and I never would have guessed it or seen it coming.
But it's great, and now I'm still teaching,
but I can teach the Bible and I'm still around kids
and I can have an even greater and deeper relationship
with them than I could in a classroom.
So yeah, it's been really cool.
Well, I really feel like that.
Joey you're probably a natural. If I was to say spiritual gift, test, I bet you'd
come out really high on the teaching area and leadership and I just see that
teaching area so strong in you. You've really gravitated toward being the best
Bible teacher that you can be. Don't you feel that way? I feel like that's
something that you really enjoy a lot. Yeah and that's probably because
like that's what I was trained to do is be a teacher you know so I was used to
teaching history and so with this transition I think I just kind of had
the same mindset with how I would prepare a lesson for my students and
just did that same kind of model with preparing a message from the Bible for
students you know in a youth group. So what's been the most the most
challenging with going from public school teaching to a youth group in a
local church? What's been the most challenging? The most challenging
difference of the two. Yeah I think it's a different setting for
sure you know at a public school you can you can send a kid to the principal's
office if you need to. But not that we have a lot of issues in that
regard but I think it's just a different atmosphere and you want it to be
different. I don't want youth group to feel like school you know and so
but you at the same time you do have standards that you expect your leaders
to be held to and your students to be held to as far as like how we dress and behave
and act and so that's kind of something that sometimes is difficult to challenge
because it can be challenging because I don't want a kid to feel like there's a
lot of rules here and I'm in school but I also I want them to feel welcomed and
accepted but also you know we are called to behave a certain way and so I
think the best way that's done those through relationship and if we do a good
job my leaders do a good job of having relationships with kids and those
conversations are a lot easier to have. What's been the most rewarding? Teaching
the Bible you know I never really got to do that. I had a few opportunities before
but not like I do now which is usually most weeks I'm teaching twice a week you
know with middle school on Sunday and high school on Wednesday and so getting to do it
that often is just it's so fun like it's one thing studying the Bible for
yourself and what you can get out of it but when you study it through the lens
of like what can I teach other people I've just found that so much more just
hops off the page and that part's been really really fun and
exciting and just to I don't know to get kids excited about it and to make it
relatable and that was my favorite thing to do as a history teacher and that's
why I love teaching American history because I was like I want if a kid is
gonna be sitting in my A3 kids gonna be sitting in my classroom for an hour
having to learn about history I want it to matter to them like I want it to be
relatable I want them to think like this actually applies to my life you know the
age-old question of why am I learning this you know I want to
have an answer to that question so I always strive to do that every day when
I was teaching and now I get to do that with the Bible and it's so much more
impactful and important because it's life-changing you know it's great to know
things about our country's past and history and it matters but for a kid to
know and understand the Bible like that's I found that to be so rewarding
do you like one-on-one time with kids 100% and I didn't get to really do that
as a teacher I was gonna say seems like in the school system because the pressure
you're under all the tests you have to grade all the extracurricular stuff that
kind of goes with the flow of being a local church I mean a local school
teacher you're not gonna get one-on-one time right and that's why I liked
coaching because I could do that a little bit more it's not as formal of a
setting as a classroom is and there's not the pressure of behavior and grades
and in a in a wrestling room or a coach cross-country so like that you can have
a more personal relationship and interaction with students and so that's
why I love to coach but yeah in a classroom it's hard and I would you know
I was that teacher that always had like kids hanging out in their classroom
during lunch and stuff and so it so in that in those situations I could a
little bit but not like I can now you know getting to to meet up with a
student for lunch or things like that yeah that's my favorite thing to do
that's awesome well I see you up you and Allie sometimes up there praying for
people yeah you know at the end of a service so obviously you're available
you make yourself available to others what has been the most maybe surprising
aspect not not for youth as much as just being a pastor for you that you maybe
didn't expect there's been a few things I think one thing that comes to mind is
I'll have like parents of teenagers
asking me for advice on how to deal with their teenagers,
which is funny to me, because my oldest kid is six,
and I was like, I've never raised a teenager.
You know, I'm around them a lot,
but I have a much different relationship
with them than a parent would.
And so, the first time that happened,
it took me a minute to even realize
that that's what was happening.
I was like, oh, they want my advice, you know?
And so, that's been kind of cool.
But getting to partner with parents
and help them navigate difficult situations
with teenagers, because I've got,
from my position, I've gotten to see
a lot of difficult situations with teenagers.
And so, I love being able to do that,
though, partner with parents
and help them navigate that stuff.
But first time that happened kind of surprised me.
Well, you've got a seminar coming up.
Yeah, yeah.
You've got a seminar about electronics and social media.
Why are you doing that?
Yeah, I mean, when we look at,
you know, one question I get a lot is like,
what do you see as being like the biggest problem
with this generation of young people,
or their biggest struggle?
And the quick answer for that, for me, is always anxiety.
Like, I think that's the biggest thing that I talk to.
And you have students that are involved
in all sorts of different things,
different gifts and talents and passions and activities.
But that's the, like, common thread
that I would say the majority of our students
are struggling with is anxiety.
And I think there's a lot of factors you could point to,
but I think one of them really is technology
and phones and social media and the increase in that.
And so I think a lot of parents who didn't grow up
with smartphones in their pocket aren't exactly sure
how to help their kids navigate that same thing.
And so, yeah, we're partnering with a local organization,
nonprofit here, who's gonna come and teach a seminar
to parents and to students separately
about how to navigate that.
What's the best use of technology?
And not to say, like, it's bad and we should never use it,
because, like, that's some, you know,
I've noticed with this generation is, like,
they're really good at researching and finding things out
because they have access to it, you know?
And so, like, there are good things,
but how do we navigate the good and the bad
and be safe and online and how to,
what's the best way parents can support their kids in that
and vice versa?
So, yeah, I'm really excited about that.
It's coming up in a week and a half.
And I just think that's fantastic
and it just seems to really hit a felt need.
So, what's been the most rewarding part of being a pastor?
I don't, I mean, I think just doing work,
the work itself is rewarding, you know?
Like, the job itself is rewarding
and there are plenty of difficult days
and stressful days and situations
that aren't fun to walk through.
But, you know, as a youth leader especially,
like, what I tell my youth leaders is
some of the things that we get to walk through with students
while they're not fun and while we don't want to,
like the mental health stuff especially,
like, whenever I get those calls or conversations,
it's like, man, here we go again.
But you also, at the same time,
like, you want to have those
because you know statistically,
like, our students are dealing with that stuff.
What better place for them to go to with it
than their youth leader or their youth pastor?
Or, and so, if they're coming to us with that,
then we're doing something right
because it feels like it's a safe place
where they can share what they're going through
and we can be a resource.
And so, while, you know, those things are hard,
they're also like, man, we,
to see yourself, like, having a difference
and making a difference is really cool.
And then I would also say, like, just the relationships
you get to build with people in the church,
like, people who are just, like,
volunteers and hungry for serving.
And we have some such amazing servant leaders in our church.
And so, getting to work with people like that
every day has been really fun.
So, what would be a win for you?
I mean, when you think in terms of a year from now,
what would be, say, one, two, maybe even three things
that you would wanna see in the youth
that would be a win?
You'd say, wow, we're making progress.
We're getting the kingdom of God ball
down the road a little bit.
Yeah, I don't think I would've had any idea
how to answer that question, like, right when I started,
but now that I'm going into year three,
I think some of the things that are cool
and feel like wins is when,
because I've seen kids graduate now
out of the high school youth group,
and we just had a big class in May that left,
and a lot of those kids don't want to leave.
They wanna come back and serve,
whether they're serving with the worship team
or they wanna serve as a youth leader.
They don't even know what.
They're just like, I wanna do something
because I don't wanna leave.
To me, that feels like, wow,
we must've been doing something right,
that this feels like a place where they want to be,
and they wanna be involved.
And a lot of them now, it's like,
they don't wanna just be involved
because they're getting filled up,
but now they wanna come and make sure
that other kids have the same.
same experience they did and they want to be a part of that and help serve and
pour into to other people. And so that is really cool. Um, and to me that feels
like a win and feels like fruit. We're seeing that like, man, they get it like
they, they obviously got something out of it and now they want to go. It doesn't
have to be that they're pouring into the youth group, but man, if we have
students who are leaving and are fired up about serving and making a difference
wherever they feel called, then that's great. And that feels like, man, we must
have been doing something right. So what would you say then? Or would you say
that it's their desire to continue to grow and be a disciple of Christ? That's
that's a big win is where you see them even getting to their senior year
graduating and wanting to continue to serve.
That's a word growth is a word I use a lot, not in the typical way of like, you
know, we want to grow our youth group and have crazy numbers or something. I
use the word growth in the sense of like, I want to see students grow, right? I
want to see them develop in their walk with Christ and how they're serving in
their relationships with their peers. Like, I just want to see them grow and
mature, you know, as Hebrews talks about, like going from, from milk to solid
food. Like, I want to see that process while they're in our youth group. Like,
are they, are they up, you know, upgrading their faith? Are they moving up in
their, in their walk with the Lord and growing from milk to solid food? Like
that's, I want to see that growth.
So tell me some of the things that you do to make that makes that happen.
Yeah. So on a typical, every Wednesday we do some sort of small groups, and I
think that's the most effective way to see real discipleship and growth, but
also to make a big group of people feel smaller. And I think for a lot of our
students and leaders, like they love that small group time because in a big
setting, it's hard to have those deep conversations or it's hard to build
relationships or be vulnerable. But when we, when we section that off and make the
groups smaller, it allows for that to happen. And so, but in those times, you
know, when we build those questions and a lot of times they are built around
challenging the students and about growth. And so, I usually, once a month
we'll do a small group focus night where we do a small message that's usually
topical and practical, and then they're spending like 45 minutes to an hour in
their small groups. And so, like next month I'm going to do one on PB&J, right?
Like a prayer Bible journal, like practically showing students, like how do we spend
time with the Lord? You know, and like this is how I do it, this is how other
people do it, and then go to your small groups and share how you guys do it. Or
if you're not doing it, what can you start doing? You know, and so really just
practical stuff like that that we can talk about in smaller groups and
hopefully implement and then follow up, you know, because we we keep the small
groups consistent for a whole school year so that that relationship is built
and then leaders are able to follow up and check in and build off of the weeks prior.
So Joey, how do you balance all the responsibilities that go with being a
youth pastor, and you've got a growing department, I mean it's growing, there's
other things that we ask you to do around here, and be a now a father of
three and a husband to one? Yeah. So what do you do? How do you walk that,
how do you walk that line as Johnny Cash said? How do you walk the line there?
Yeah, well it's a good question, and you know I've been in a couple, as we talked
about, a couple different careers now, and I would say this is my favorite one to
walk that line with so far because there are things that my family can do with me.
You know, when I was commuting to Denver and working on a airfield with Jets, like
I couldn't bring my five-year-old to work, you know, but like there are things
that I can do here, like Allie is super involved in the youth group, and she
comes every night, and God bless my mother, she watches our kids every
Wednesday night, so Allie can come to youth group, but there are times when she
can't watch them, and we'll bring the kids, and I don't want to do that every
week because it's harder for us to focus, but it's actually really cool because the
youth kids love it, and they love seeing our kids, and I think it's cool for us to
kind of model family, you know, a family serving in ministry together, and our
kids love it. They love all the youth kids and playing spike ball and stuff,
but I think, so to answer that question, like a lot of whenever I'm able to is
merge the two, you know, like involve my family in my ministry, involve me, you
know, as much as I can without doing a disservice to either side, you know, try
to do them simultaneously, but it is hard, and that's why I appreciate you in
the atmosphere here of like, you know, preaching that family is our primary
ministry, and you know, I've heard things from people in our church,
and you know, who grew up as pastor's kids and did not have that relationship
with their parent who's a pastor. Those stories are heartbreaking, you know, and
so I think to make sure that like, yeah, I'm, you know, I say that all the time, but
am I doing that, like pouring into my family first before anything else, and
and so, yeah, some weeks are harder.
others for sure to walk that line with with situ and there are situations that
come up that I that I have to deal with and then so it's just me being
intentional to on the aftermath of that after the situation has been handled
spending extra time with the family and pouring into them and that kind of thing.
Do you feel like you have an opportunity to have a greater impact through being a
youth pastor in a church than you did as a school teacher? Yeah 100% 100% yeah and
I think one thing you said earlier about feel like you know made for this or
something like that you know that when you said that it's turned me like
sometimes God sees things in ourselves that we don't see right like you know I
think Lord knew that that I could do this job and I didn't know that you know
and so and so yeah as a teacher like I like I said I loved being a teacher and
a coach and but yeah I don't think I was reaching my full potential of how I
could have impacted those students and and who's to say I am now but I think
yes I would say I feel like I have a greater impact on the daily basis here
than I do as a teacher and that's not to say a public school teacher couldn't I
just think at that time of my life I wasn't in a place or I didn't really
know how and then through this experience I think I've kind of learned
how it is that we make a big impact with students and how I can do that better
than I did back then well how have you grown how would you say you got yourself
equipped in the midst of coming in no experience yeah never been to graduate
school right I do have a master's but it's in education okay so you have been
to graduate school but you haven't been to a Bible school right so again not
even something that you were planning to do and suddenly you're thrust into it
you become a part of it you're doing it very well what what have you done to
kind of equip yourself through this first few years yeah I think on the the
Bible teaching side of it just preparing like I did I think yeah I don't know I
didn't realize how much I think there were similarities between preparing a
lesson for school and preparing a message at youth group and I think the
same thing I did then as do now is just over preparing making sure that I think
anticipating questions is something that I've always done and you have to do when
you're teaching 35 eighth graders you get you can't anticipate all the
questions because they're weird but you get you get a lot of questions and so
it's like man when I'm putting something together I'm like well somebody could
ask this what's my answer to that you know to try to be prepared for so that I
know the topic so well or know the passage so well that I can answer
questions and so I'll try you know some weeks are crazier than others and I'm
writing a message Wednesday right before youth group but most of the time I've at
least started meditating on that passage and that's something I think I learned
from you and Pastor Ryan of like you're gonna read a passage 20 times before you
actually start typing out a message you know and so I'll do that start
meditating on it listening to it reading it praying through it and then that's
where the Lord just starts giving you ideas and directions to go with the
message and and things to bring up and so yeah I always do that commentaries I
lean a lot on commentaries and and look at at least a few other voices of what
people are saying commentators that I that I trust and respect and and that
you've recommended and rely on that as well as I'm as I'm preparing and then on
the practical side too I think that was a bit probably a bigger learning curve
for me was like leading a team of servant leaders of volunteers you know
because I'd never done that before I had leadership opportunities mostly in the
military I led a team my last couple of years in the military but they're you
know they swore an oath to our country and they have to be there and they're
getting paid and so there's a contrast from that to leading a team of
volunteers in a youth setting and so that was something I really focused on
my first year was like how do I get them trained and equipped and prepared
but then also not burnt out you know like how do I make sure that they're
valued and appreciated and that's where teaming up with Ali has been huge
because she's I think she has a gift of hospitality and so she's always thinking
through like do our leaders feel valued and appreciated and do they want to be
here and and and so yeah we I feel like I've spent a lot of time on that aspect
of the job and how to learn fast on how to do that and still learning fast and
navigating that but that's been really important I think because I can't Ali
and I can't effectively lead a youth group by ourselves so we've been pouring
into our team so that we can do it with them serving them. So you're working a
lot through a leadership team you've got a leadership team and you guys meet and
I know about that and you're training them on a regular basis I think it
really does help doesn't it when you have
of these young people that have come up,
they've got the chemistry and the DNA
of the road church youth group,
and then they don't wanna leave, they wanna stay.
So are they leading small groups?
The really young ones, like the ones who just graduated?
The leaders that are on your leadership team,
are they then leading small groups?
Yeah, exactly.
So yeah, and we do have a cool mix of like,
we have people on our team that have been
in the youth group, right?
And they're younger, whether it was a couple years ago
or they've come up through the church.
And so, yeah, that's great, because they get it.
They've seen leaders do it for them,
and they're ready to do the same thing.
And then we also have people,
what's great about our team is we do have
a variety of age ranges.
We have some older people, some moms that are on our team,
and then we've got younger people as well.
And so, yes, I have the high school
and middle school youth groups broken up
by gender and age level into small groups.
And like ninth grade boys, 10th grade girls,
that kind of thing.
And then have a couple leaders assigned to each group.
And so that way a kid knows right away,
and we usually do small groups at the beginning of the night
so they know quickly, because it can be intimidating
to walk into a room full of people you don't know.
And so quickly they know, well, this is a leader
that's assigned to me, and these are kids that are my age.
And so that helps a student feel more welcomed
and plugged in and connected to some people,
hopefully early on in the night.
Yeah, but we give our leaders jobs.
And I think that I've seen that to be successful
because then a lot of them will take ownership
of their own small group.
And so we have leaders that will do creative
and fun things outside of youth group with their girls
and with the leaders they're partnered with.
And so that's cool when they kind of just take it
and run with it.
And it gives them a part of the night
that they can kind of feel like they have ownership over.
To what extent do you think kids can enter into praise
and worship at such a young age?
Yeah, that's a great question.
And I get to, we have our high school ministries
and our middle school ministry separate.
And so we do middle school on Sunday mornings
and high school Wednesday nights.
And so you can see, we do worship with both
and you can see a difference.
And I think it's really just a training process
and kind of pushing them to be uncomfortable.
And middle school's an age where it's like,
man, they really care about their friends and their peers.
And so how do I try to get a student
to stop looking at their friend during worship
and kind of focus in?
And that's definitely a challenge
and something to get to work through.
But it's cool to see the growth from that.
Those same kids that were messing around
a couple years ago are now actively engaging in worship
when they get to high school.
And so it's kind of a process of just pushing them
and challenging them.
So that's one thing we do is encouraging everyone
to raise your hands, encouraging everyone to close your eyes,
encouraging everyone to take a moment and pray.
And so I think those things are helpful
to get them to that point.
But I think it can happen at a very young age
for a student to actively engage with the Lord
in a time of worship.
And so, yeah, we're always pushing for it
at middle school and high school, for sure.
Well, it seems to be working.
I mean, it really does seem to be working.
It's amazing to see, especially on Sunday morning,
all these young people up there
right next to the stage going for it.
Yep.
And they can't be more than like, I don't know,
17, 18 years old at the most.
Yeah.
But they're passionate.
So they're getting that, I think, on Wednesday
and they're carrying it over into Sunday.
And it's very balanced.
It's very mature, it appears to me.
It's not like crazy or anything.
And that's always really encouraging to see that.
Another area I've seen spill over to Sunday mornings
is students praying for each other.
And that's something we push a lot on Wednesday nights.
And it starts in a small group time.
And I always tell my leaders,
especially if you're a freshman or you have a younger group,
I always want the small group time to end in prayer.
And it's probably gonna start
with you praying for your students.
But try to develop it and push it to a point
where they're praying for each other.
And that's happened.
And so we see that,
not just during small group time at Tribe anymore,
at youth group, but we see it during worship time,
they're praying over each other.
I even have a middle school student
who will walk around the room during worship
and pray for everybody.
You know, I think, how can I pray?
No way.
A middle school student?
Yeah, and he'll pray for the leaders,
anybody who's in the room.
He'll walk around and pray for them.
That's so great.
That's always really encouraging to see that.
And then when you see it on, you know, Sunday morning
and in big service, like see kids doing that too
is really cool.
Like worshiping up front, praying for each other.
And yeah, it's nice to see that fruit.
Do you?
Do ministry, one-on-one prayer, or two-on-one, whatever it might be, on Wednesday night?
Do you guys do that where you call people forward and then you have trained people that
pray for them?
Yeah, exactly.
So my leaders, I'm always encouraging them to pray with students during worship time,
which a lot of times is ministry time.
So yeah, sometimes we'll have a specific call or a specific word that I'll get in bringing
people forward, but a lot of times I don't even have to do that.
A lot of times my leaders are already just—and what I tell them is, hey, when you come to
youth group as a leader, I want you to engage in worship, but I think how a leader is engaged
in worship is different than a student because you're here to serve and pour out.
And so when you're worshiping, ask the Holy Spirit, what do you want me to do during this
time?
Who do you want me to pray for?
And so I think that's how we're engaged in worship, is I'm talking to the Holy Spirit
and asking the Holy Spirit to highlight people in my mind that I need to be focused on and
praying for.
And so I encourage my leaders to do the same thing, and they do such an awesome job with
that, and they're bouncing around the room praying for kids.
And so yeah, that happens every night, and then most of the time we do a specific altar
call, if you want to call it that, too.
So you're really doing everything that we do on Sunday morning, except in a youth culture
context.
Right.
Probably there's going to be lots of people watching this who either know about you or
they just happen to punt it.
They see a young guy who's a pastor.
What would you say will be your advice to someone in their 20s who thinks they're called
into full-time vocational ministry, and they're not sure if they want to do that, it seems
daunting, never been to Bible college, never been to seminary.
What would be your advice to them?
Start serving.
Right.
That's so good.
I look back at the experience I had as a volunteer and how much that shapes what I'm doing now.
Volunteer here at The Row, but even when Ally and I first got married, we served with a
youth ministry our first year of marriage, and that was like eight years ago, but I think
back to that all the time.
A lot of things that happened to us and we navigated in that year shaped how I run the
youth ministry here and how I treat my leaders and train them.
Any experience you can have serving and being involved in ministry will help down the road.
It'll shape how you do things, and it'll answer that question, like, I think I want to do
this, but I'm not sure.
Well, that's how you can kind of find out and watch the leaders, watch the youth pastor,
watch whatever area ministry you're at, and think through what it'd be like to do what
they're doing.
That's what I tell young people who have come out of our youth group and they want to transition
to the leadership team.
I give them a period of time, and I say, continue to come, and now you need to start to retrain
your brain and think, how would I behave now as a leader as opposed to a student?
You can do that in your mind, just noticing things and like, man, what would it mean for
me to be here and serve?
What would it mean for me to be here and running things?
And then you'll be shocked, too, at the opportunities you can have as a volunteer.
You might get an opportunity to teach.
You might get an opportunity, so you can start to do those things in that setting, and it'll
not only grow you, but it'll also answer those questions of, is this something I'm supposed
to do or called to do?
For you that don't know the road, kind of our culture here, but the way Joey just described
how one might see if God's calling them into ministry full-time is exactly what we do here.
I'd say most people that we have on the team have been grown from within, so we already
know the people before we hire them.
We knew Joey because he was serving as a servant leader for the past youth pastor, Ryan Steyer,
and I look at worships this way, the children's ministries this way.
We've just kind of gradually raised up people through knowing them because they're serving,
and I just totally concur with that, that the best way to learn if you have a desire
to be a pastor is not going to be academics.
Now, academics can be important.
I have a few degrees, but you don't have to have that.
Some of the best pastors have no degrees, no formal theological training, but what they
do have is they have leadership, and they learned leadership by being in the trenches,
being in the hunt in a local church.
Thank you, Joey.
This is great.
Totally agree with everything you've said, and it's an honor to be on the same team with
you, so thanks for being here.
So yeah, if any of you have questions, let us know.
That's what this podcast is about, is to help us understand how to get empowered to change
the world, how to make a difference.
So thanks for tuning in.
And if you know someone who's not sure about their future, but they're thinking about the
ministry, this would be a great podcast for them to watch, send it over to them.
So thanks a lot for listening.