It should be streaming live.
Hey, ladies and gentlemen,
we are just checking in here,
making sure we're streaming.
I believe we're just about to go live.
There we are, we're live.
That's how we're live.
It's awesome.
Very, very cool.
Well, good to see everybody back here.
We've obviously been grinding hard.
This is session 16 over the weekend.
And we are like over halfway there,
which is phenomenal.
It's been such a sweet, sweet weekend.
Benji, how you doing?
Oh, bro, I am feeling so lit up
about everything that's happening,
just on all the spaces where the kingdom of God
is advancing beautifully and where people are rising,
you know, like challenges aren't like blocking people.
It's just causing people to rise.
And the genius factor is being discovered
and expressed and demonstrated.
And so to me, I think that's just been a highlight,
is just seeing genius in action
and being able to follow so many genius people
that we didn't even know.
You know, like so many people wouldn't even know
that all these people are out there
doing what they're doing.
So it's just been fantastic to just get lit up,
seeing it all.
It's awesome.
Super, super cool.
Well, this is a special session for me
because I have two of my favorite people in the world
on the call.
One of them is Benji, as most of you know,
but the other is Mr. Michael Seifert,
whose name I just said correctly,
which is an inside joke
because every time Michael's on an interview,
we get a little bit confused there with people.
But Michael, it's great to have you with us.
It is amazing to be here.
This is fun.
And yes, thank you for saying my last name correctly.
I don't even bother correcting anyone anymore.
So you could have called me Shelfert
and I would have said, that's me, but you nailed it.
Awesome.
I'm glad I nailed it.
Well, Michael, I'd love to just open up in prayer
and then we're gonna just jump into what you and us
or we are up to with Public Square,
why we're doing it, what we're going after,
how this is the beginning of a new digital economy
that is really parallel to what's going on in culture.
But let me pray and then let's jump into it.
Jesus, we love you.
We're so grateful.
We're grateful that the streams of liberty
come from your throne.
And as we pursue the liberty of heaven,
as we pursue the liberty that is on the earth,
we just welcome you to exceedingly and abundantly more
than we could ask for, think for, and imagine
in our lifetime.
God, bring together the purity of freedom
in politics and business, move them together.
And God, we just ask for favor in this time,
for such a time as this.
In Jesus name, amen.
Well, Michael, why don't you open the can of worms?
What are we up to in the US and where are we at
on the journey?
And just paint a picture for us
for the journey that we're on.
Will do.
Yeah, it is a journey indeed.
And we've had an exciting even last few days
as we're prepping for a new phase of the journey,
which is where we're taking what we've done locally
and bringing it nationally.
And then we're excited for all of the international friends
on this call, because before you know it,
Public Square will be launched to the nations as well,
which, oh yeah, amen.
And it's happening sooner than we're even praying for.
So grateful for how God works those things out.
We are creating the alternate economy.
Everyone's been wanting this for years,
this idea of a parallel or alternate economy
where our values as believers can be placed
as an integral factor in every single transaction.
And one thing that's really neat about that
is we're using technology in order to make the transaction,
but we're using technology in a way
that drives us back to real human connection.
So we're not utilizing technology
for the purpose of disconnecting from humans
in a solely and exclusively digital place,
we're actually using technology in the digital space
to drive us to real human connection
in our local communities.
So practically, what does that look like?
We started an app and a website that connects
anyone that loves freedom,
anyone that loves those streams of liberty
that flow from the throne of God.
We connect those people on a local level,
because I believe that if you want to change the world,
you got to change your country.
If you want to change your country,
you got to change your state or your province.
If you want to change your state or your province,
you got to change your local community.
If you want to change your local community,
you got to change your backyard.
So we're starting there,
and we hope that we provide an app
that essentially helps give people a digital marketplace,
a marketplace of money, a marketplace of commerce,
a marketplace of free thinkers that can.
of conversation so that we can experience true connection
at a local level that has a national and international impact.
So there's a lot there we can jump into all of it.
But yeah, I'm excited, as you can tell.
Yeah, it's awesome.
That's ideal. That's ideal.
We like we like excitable people around here.
Come on. Yeah.
Yeah. So good.
Well, before we go into more of the specifics, Michael, like
why don't we share a little if you have some of the stories
like I'm thinking about
some of the people, you know, part of part of one of the really cool things
about what we've been able to do inside this marketplace, inside
the application has put a job board together.
It's really helped serve a bunch of the community.
Even yesterday, we had a business that just went went wild.
You know, they started offering free pizza to kids
who refused to wear masks in schools, different things like that.
And, you know, they've just been blowing up on social media, which has been cool.
Why don't you share some of the cool stories
that have been going on in the background?
Yeah, we're testimony driven.
And I know that that's something that is common to raising royalty.
The testimonies drive us
because anytime I hear a testimony like that, I'm hungry for I'm hungry for five
more. And so, you know, it's neat.
This this week has been full of a lot of those stories.
Flippin Pizza, four locations here in San Diego County, California.
They're on the public square app in our digital marketplace
as a freedom loving business run by a believer who wants to serve his community.
He saw this week students getting kicked out of our local schools
because they refused to wear masks.
And many of those students went without lunch because they had to sit outside
of the campus over that lunch hour due to their refusal to wear that mask.
He said anyone that has been protesting the mask mandate
that feels they've been unfairly treated should come to our pizza place
because you'll get a free slice of pizza.
Public Square partnered with them in greater capacity today.
We had from 11 to 1 p.m.
here in San Diego County and any of those flippin pizza locations.
Those four people could go and say that they're celebrating freedom
and get a free slice of pizza.
So things like that drive this alternate economy.
It's the sweetest, sweetest reward being in our seat to be able to just witness this.
We've seen people that have been fired from their jobs
because they refused covid-19 vaccinations for either religious, personal
or medical reasons.
And we actually had a lady that reached out about two days
after she was fired from her position as a nurse, seven years in that profession.
So Ben, through the ringer.
It's interesting.
Her hospital trusted her with other people's health, but not with her own
health decisions, which I thought was rather corrupt.
But Public Square provided a home for her.
And so she reached out to us and said, friends, I need a freedom loving employer.
I can't go through this again.
And we got her connected to a physical therapy clinic.
She's employed and happier than ever.
We've heard stories of hair studios whose profits have jumped 500 percent
in a single month because of their presence on the app.
We've heard from an accountant who created her free profile on the app
and an hour later had enough business to cover her for an entire month.
This this this economy centered on values and values are our biggest driver
as consumers. They are.
And that's becoming more and more evident the more that polling is done on this issue.
And so, yeah, we could we could talk for hours about the testimonies,
but we're just getting started.
So cool, man. So good.
We I think one of the one of the interesting things so much about about this
is that these are these are all businesses that just love, love.
Freedom have been willing to stand up for their rights, stand up for the
what the Constitution of America has given them permission to do,
which is firstly, you know, have the have the freedom to speak,
have the freedom to have their own religious values and civil liberties be protected.
And and then as as the journey goes on, you know, we
we've discovered this emerging, emerging culture of people
who who are who are really just want to see America prosper.
You know, and it's what's interesting
is that once you start as to really see America prosper,
as it's kind of had this played this role across the nations as as a beacon of hope,
as a beacon of freedom across across the nation and across the world.
And, you know, a lot of the heartbeat about why we're why we're doing this
is to really restore that freedom, that centerpiece of freedom across
across the earth.
But Michael, I wonder if you could speak a little bit to, you know, why freedom?
Why is freedom so important to obviously us as public square?
But why do we why do we have to agree on this?
Why is it so important to navigate this? Well,
great question.
If we get it wrong, everything else falls apart.
And so if we miss out on freedom, if we screw up liberty,
we we lose all other opportunities.
Our founders in the United States called our religious liberties our first freedoms
because they said, if you lose the right to worship, you lose everything else.
And so I think for us, we we feel like freedom.
We have to get it right, because if we get that wrong,
we'll be arguing with about all of our other differences behind bars.
Like, one thing that's been really beautiful in this movement that Seb and I have witnessed a lot
are the people that, you know, we may have slightly differing theological beliefs.
We've come together as believers and unbelievers, people on the journey trying to figure it out,
but we have this common unifying factor in that we want the freedom for my neighbor to figure it out.
And my big belief, Seb's big belief, is like, I may disagree with what you have to say,
but I will fight to the death for your right to say it.
Because if we get that wrong, we lose every other freedom.
I think there's also a real desire to give power back to people, to assume that we,
let's say an entity or a nation or a region strips away people's freedoms,
that means that there was a centralized authority powerful enough to do so,
which we inherently believe is antagonistic to the values of God,
which is a decentralized earthly kingdom
where individuals are able to pursue their own walk with the Lord.
They're able to pursue protection for them and their families.
They're able to operate in a free economy.
Like that closest aligns with the personal responsibility-driven nature of the gospel,
that it's up to each and every one of us to take our part,
to pursue individual responsibility in order to better ourselves and then our communities.
And so there's also, anytime there's a centralized authority that jumps in
and tries to even define what truth is or righteousness is,
you start to see that individual liberties strip away.
So not only are we driven by freedom for freedom's sake,
so that it would advance,
so we'd all be able to prosper in having this conversation about what do we believe
and why do we believe it for years and years and years to come.
We also just genuinely believe that the power deserves to be belonging
in the hands of the people and especially the United States.
Like that was our entire conception.
Like the reason we were founded as a country was to give power back to the people.
We were tired of a monarchy and went to the system that said,
you know what, I don't have the right.
I'm not the arbiter of truth for you to have to live your life by.
Even why I may have ideas of what you should and shouldn't do,
that doesn't mean if you're doing something that it doesn't infringe upon my rights,
you should have the right to do it.
So Canada, you're seeing right now,
golly, if there's any Canadian friends on this,
bless you, praying for you.
Can't imagine, honestly.
But where Canada, we're seeing the exact ramifications of what happens
when personal liberties are stripped away.
The prime minister of Canada has no problem kneeling in protest and solidarity with one group,
but he will arrest you.
He will send people for your dogs and your kids and freeze your bank accounts
if you're protesting something he doesn't agree with.
So yeah, Sam, our driver, we talk about this all the time.
It's that the power would be back in the hands of the people.
And then our prayer, ultimately, our prayer as a leadership team at Public Square
is that as you drink from those streams of liberty,
as you taste of the sweet freedom that God has so desired for us,
that you'd eventually understand who authored freedom
and who actually was the source of those streams of liberty.
Like that's our deeper desire behind all of this.
And we're starting to see people wake up to that, which is really neat.
There's been a lot of people in the freedom movement
that as they pursued freedom, no matter where they started from,
as they pursued freedom, they've come to know the person who created it.
And that's obviously, that's where eternity starts to factor in.
And that gets really fun.
That's cool.
Really interesting on that point, Michael, this year in New Zealand,
Jacinda Ardern, our prime minister,
has claimed that the government will be your single source of truth.
You know, they've even labelled things like,
they've labelled things like health and wellness.
And, you know, that the concept that health and wellness
could be a contributing factor into, you know,
doing really well in the context of, you know,
like if, you know, in a COVID outbreak,
the context that health and wellness could be of benefit to you,
your own looking after yourself,
that's been labelled a conspiracy theory.
And then on top of these outrageous things,
and what's even funnier, right,
is that it actually just came out this week
in a thing that's called the Jacinda Papers.
It's kind of coming out that the whole,
all the science that they've based all of their stuff on,
all came from one group,
which was funded specifically by the prime minister's office.
And this one group funded exclusively by the prime minister's office
produced all the data that the whole COVID response
was based on all the graphing.
And I mean, these guys were so far out, it's ridiculous.
You know, like their graphing and charting
of what was going to happen
was pretty close to the immediate death of at least 80,000 people.
I mean, I think we've seen a couple of hundred, something like that.
Don't quote me on that at all, but not 80,000.
It was off the back of these.
hysterical charts and numbers of at least 80,000 people are going to die like that,
that they use that to justify nationwide lockdowns and and claiming things like,
oh yeah, health and wellness, they're basically a conspiracy, that's not going to help at all,
you know, like vitamin D, no, like actually getting something, no, that's that's conspiracy
theory, we, but so making these outrageous claims and then off the back of that saying,
we will be your single source of truth, no need to think for yourself, we've got this covered,
we've even funded the media to help you know what to think.
It makes my head spin.
It's outrageous.
I pray for New Zealand too, but you're, you're, you're spot on, anytime you let the government
determine, any centralized authority like that, determine that we are the truth or like our,
Dr. Fauci said here in the United States last year, he said, I am the science, an attack on me
is an attack on science itself. Anytime we're allowing people to get away with using rhetoric
like that, we're prolonging this complete strip away of the value inherent to every individual
to make the decisions that are best for them and their families, which is, especially when you get
into a medical stuff, like it's just a whole nother level. And that's why I think a lot of
people have awakened over the past two years, guys to realize like, okay, this is the hill.
Actually, this is where I really start to press in. Cause we're not talking about,
you know, cops being overbearing on a speeding ticket. We're talking about my ability to
determine what or what not goes into my child's body. Like that's, that's a whole different realm.
And so they poked a lot of mama bears, a lot of Papa bears, people are waking up. And I think now
it's our responsibility. Those that are kind of awake and are pursuing the truth. Like it's our
responsibility to welcome with open arms to the freedom movement and say, okay, how can we lock
arms together and do this thing and grow this? Cause now is this moment in history that we
shouldn't take for granted. Yeah. Massive. So good. So good. Michael, one of the things we keep
talking about, you know, we've had conversations all week about it, multiple conversations this
week about it is is the, is how much you, for example, someone like George Washington, first
president of the United States, like carried integrity. And, you know, he, his, his leadership
was so profound because he was he was expected to be, you know, basically reigning president
for the rest of his life. Everybody expected him to do that. And yet he, he himself said,
no, I'm going to have current limits and government. I'm going to put a restriction
upon the, the centralized leadership of the government of this entire nation. And America
celebrated its 245th birthday this last July. And we, you know, that's 250 nearly years worth of,
of time where integrity has been the forefront of, of what has driven people towards freedom.
And so much of the birthing place of public square is birthed out of this conviction to say,
um, I choose to live my life on the platform of my values. And I choose to do that as an
integrous place, but Michael, I'd love for you to just deep dive into that for us. Like, why is that,
why is that important for you and, um, Sarah and your family? Why is it important for,
for, for you to, to lead a movement that brings the integrity to the forefront of our,
our spending habits, our information habits, that community, why is that important for you?
Yeah, great question. Um, blessed is the nation who, who views God as God,
blessed are the pure in heart for, they shall see God. Like there's this real tie to being
pure in heart and pure in intent, and then seeing God and fruit on the other side of that.
We see it throughout the scriptures. Why would the marketplace be any different?
And so I think that for us, we see a real, obviously call on public square
to pursue Liberty, but even more so Liberty unto a purpose. Like I was talking about earlier,
that God would ultimately be glorified. And as we want legacy, which is like a big heart's cry for
my wife and I like legacy, that's it. I want legacy. I don't care if no one knows my name
in this lifetime. I want my grandkids years from now, decades from now to reap the fruit of what
I've sown in this lifetime. Like that's, that's the goal. And so that that's all I want. That's
all I want. My greatest fear is getting to the end of my life and thinking, Kali, I could have
done more to leave a legacy. I don't want that. And so for us, everything is legacy driven. Legacy
only comes with integrity. You're going to leave a legacy regardless. And I want people to remember
us for our integrity. So people will either remember us for what we didn't do, or therefore
they'll forget us for what we didn't do. Or they'll remember us for the stance we took,
the righteousness we pursued and the integrity we held dear. Like you just talked about with
George Washington, who of course had his faults, but at the end of the day, the man
had power at his fingertips, which is the most enticing desire known to a.
corrupt man is to attain power at all costs.
And yet he refused for the betterment of people
because it was more important for him to leave a legacy
that today would be defined by term limits,
two terms on what president,
like that was a legacy that George Washington
set in stone before it was even set in stone.
And because he made that conscious choice
to prioritize generations down the road,
because he saw how is the fact that his actions today
would affect everyone else's tomorrow,
he chose to make a conscious decision to forego
the temptation and desire for power
in order that the lives of his people would be better.
Like that, that is just integrity to a T.
And so practically for us,
Seb, you're spot on in the marketplace.
It looks like us encouraging people to pursue integrity
in their transactions.
It encourages small businesses to pursue prosperity
in their local communities and corruption
that has taken place
because of mega multinational corporations
that are in bed with the government,
that that corruption would be exposed.
Like there's this whole element here
where as we're bringing things into the light,
because anytime you give power back to the people,
the power structure starts to dismantle
and things will be brought into the light inherently.
If we can do that, like all of a sudden,
we get to this ground zero in the marketplace
where we get to look at things through sober eyes
and say what is righteous and what is not,
what is true and what is false.
And how can we make sure that we are establishing
a future in this country and nations around the world
where integrity is at the forefront.
We believe that public square is a very integral tool
to making that happen.
Come on, so good.
So good, it's really is that core principle.
It's one of our core values in public square,
but at the end of the day,
if you can live your life on the platform of your values,
then you get to live a life of integrity and conviction,
conviction that actually establishes things.
Even the scripture we were talking about earlier today,
Benji, a righteous man leaves a legacy
for his children's children's children.
That's essentially what we're saying here
is like it's the righteousness of a man
that empowers them to leave that legacy
and that call and journey there is so key.
But Michael, one of the other themes of this summit
has been emerging technology
and how like crypto, decentralization, NFTs,
how, what kind of a role do you see that playing
in the emerging economy?
And how do you see that coming together
with what we're doing?
Great question.
We've, you know, it's fun, Seb.
We could go through even some examples of, you know,
what the app is today and what it will be
in three or four years.
And one of the defining hallmarks that you'd see consistent
throughout all the different features we will add
between now and then is it will really move
to become more and more of a decentralized platform,
utilizing a lot of the technological advancements
that have taken place over the last 10 years
in this sort of wild west of technology.
And I think it's important to note that for a long time,
like we just trusted the internet inherently.
The last 20 years, most people in society,
myself included up until about five or six years ago,
kind of blindly trusted the internet.
You know, we thought, golly, this is such a free place
for information to flow.
Look at all that I can search even at my fingertips.
And then we started to realize that, wait a second,
information decentralized in the power
with the ability to be swayed or manipulated
by these centralized powers.
Like that's a pretty dangerous concept,
especially when you have people thinking
they're getting the truth
because they have information so tangible.
And yet all that information is filtered
through a corporation that either likes you
or doesn't like you.
And so, you know, some of the beauties
of what we're seeing today in Web3 and NFTs
and the move to embrace more crypto
and the move to make wallets more simple too,
because the reality is like
a lot of these really cool advancements
aren't gonna catch on unless people make them simple.
And so I really admire the men and women in this space
that are fighting to simplify
the process of decentralization.
But all in all, when we add more of those components
to the marketplace, we do two things.
You help consumers take their voice back.
You give them the power to make sure
that they know with transparency
what they're spending money on and what they're not.
You give them more autonomy over their own dollars
so that they're able to ensure
that the bulk of their finances
go to things they believe in.
The other thing that you're doing
is you're helping even the playing field.
One thing I like about NFTs
and I like about crypto in general
is that it gives the ability,
if you remember the Reddit Wall Street channel,
Wall Street Bets channel this year
made a run on Citadel Capital.
That was a good example of how
the more that decentralized technology
and the conversation about it
has been made attainable for people.
regular people like we've been able to experience the joys of investing the joys of seeing returns
the joys of feeling advanced and innovative like it's become for the average people and not just
in an exclusive set of technological code only accessible to a few it's like we're seeing the
reformation like you guys remember the bible was not readable for anyone it was like the internet
was controlled by these people the bible was controlled by these priests and no one else
the common people couldn't access it martin luther goes he nails his stuff to the wall
and all of a sudden it was like the world burst forth for average people and i think that's what
this decentralized move is doing like the fact you can buy an nft right now and then use it for
branding like that is such a cool move to help average people feel like with a few bucks they
can pursue really innovative technological advancements for themselves their business
and their community so i can't wait to see what it all leads to i generally uh can't stand the fed
in general too so when we talk about monetary policy i'm like anything that disrupts the
federal reserve big fan uh i don't like the global banks international monetary fund is my
uh any three-letter agency i don't trust them and so uh the the the imf is no different and so
i think that uh we're we're in for a new dawn in technology and i can't wait for public square to
be at the forefront of it okay hey i've got a curly i've got a curly question for you here
that i think is kind of connected this is something that i think is deep in the psychology
of christians uh and i think we've only looked at one side of the coin so i'm going to jump right
here and i think you can almost guess the scripture that i'm going for when i show you a picture here
i mean this is this is some pictures out of sweden right now okay so this is people all over sweden
right now are getting these chips that are carrying their vaccine passports in them like
chip me go ahead chip me and it's like thousands of people are like yeah cool give me my chip like
and uh and so i mean that's the uh that's the picture and here's the here's the scripture
just here in revelation 13 right which is right about what you guys talking about is uh
it or so i mean i think everyone can like know this scripture already but it also forced
all people great and small rich and poor free and slave to receive a mark on their right hands
or on their foreheads so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark
which is the name of the beast or the number of its name uh so let's start the screen share there
but i think that inherently christians have been raised with this massive fear of this moment in
time where there'll be a centralized economy and if you're not in it uh you will have nothing but
my the angle that i want to come at this is i also think that we have had this mindset
interpreting this on like one side of the coin because our mindset has been a lack-based mindset
as opposed to looking at from heaven's perspective where heaven's like guys in a way the economy is
already kind of centralized like big banking they basically own everything mega corporations like
apple we looked yesterday at apple 2.1 trillion dollars a year um that puts we we actually looked
at the big business and countries and in the top 200 economic entities on the planet only 47 of them
are nations you know like 153 of the top economic entities on the planets are big business that are
multi-trillion dollar companies i mean this is wild crazy and i think that some like somehow
we've been asleep to this not conscious of the fact hey the world is being controlled by big
big business that has more wealth than nations and trillions of dollars are stewarded by a few
who are hoarding it uh and in a sense i think from heaven's perspective heaven's been kind of like
would you guys like maybe wake up one day and like discover that you actually kind of already live in
a pretty centralized economy where a handful of people control all the wealth and they're not
stewarding it very well which means that millions of people die from malnutrition and lack of water
when you know like they could make one decision you know just a couple of people on the planet
right now have the access to trillions of dollars that if they made this one decision all all lack
could be ended overnight on the planet so here's the angle that i wanted to come at this question
from you know people people see this moment in revelation 13 is a bad thing like oh no i'm going
to get kicked out of a corrupt decentralized economy what if god's really excited about that
what if god's like fantastic i want you all to unsubscribe don't wait for the chip you know like
unsubscribe now this system sucks heaven's got a better format heaven's got a better
for you? And what if God's like, oh, could you unsubscribe years ago? And he's actually now saying,
hey, guys, I want to invite you, like, don't wait for the chip to get kicked out of this economy,
create a parallel economy now and actually jump on board and enjoy this right now, right? And
having this abundance-based mindset that goes, actually, we can completely flip the script,
we can unsubscribe from that system. And as we unsubscribe and take all our money out of banking
and insurance, and we take it with us to a whole new world and create our own infrastructures and
economies of banking and insurance, we actually don't just take our money, we take their leverage.
Like millions start unsubscribing. And I guess what I love about what you guys are doing in
Public Square is you're helping create infrastructure, a pathway, a highway, in a
sense, you know, like make straightaway in the wilderness, a highway for people to start having
these ideas and like jumping into the space of actually unsubscribing from a system that's
already corrupt. So just love to hear your thoughts on that. It seems like you guys are in that space.
So yeah, really keen to hear about that. Yeah, you nailed it. I mean, we dream that people
would have that realization without having to be pushed to the edge. And we hope that the
alternate economy we're creating is so enticing that Christians jump ship from the system
and enjoy the fruits of this parallel economy before they're forced with their back against
the wall to do so. We're trying to view this through a prophetic lens and realize where the
world is going and jump on this moment and have our systems prepared so that once that day comes,
whenever that is, and I don't know what season we're living in, I don't know when that season's
coming, I can tell you, I don't really care. Because at the end of the day, I'm going to have
my coffee shops, and I'm going to have my bank, and I'm going to have my church that's standing
for freedom. And I'm going to have my family's education taken care of and our systems provided
for, because we went a different way years ago. And I think you can get really joyful about that
even. And I love your take on it, Benji, because I'm like, we do look at that passage with despair.
But in reality, like, it's kind of like the COVID season. COVID season sucked in a lot of ways.
It was also a beautiful, separating moment where it was like, okay, rubber met the road,
guys, it's time. Like, what side are you on here? What are you standing for? And to be honest,
like, I think we needed a good moment to have a reality check in society. I hate how it went down.
I hate how everyone responded. At the end of the day, though, I'm really glad because coming out
on the other side of this two years later, like we've seen stuff for what it is. And going back
to those people that have awakened over the past few years, it's like, good. Now we got a lot of
work to do, but I'm glad we're awake. And so I couldn't agree more. I think it's a hopeful time.
We wouldn't be doing this if we weren't hopeful, to be honest. Like, we'd just, you know, we'd be
solutionless. We'd be saying, woe is us. What the heck? World's going to hell in a handbasket
anyway. So what's the point? That's not us. It would be really, really fun to make Revelation
13 a real anticlimax. Like, what happened? There's a new mark. Yep.
Ah, wouldn't it be good to make that such an anticlimax where the devil's been like
waiting for millennia, right? Yeah. And there was like, oh, sorry, dude. We unsubscribe from
that ages ago. You're going to have to find some other guys who really care about that
economy thing of yours. Yep. Amen. Preach.
Ah, so good. So good. You know, it's, it's the, you're right. You know, it's just the, it's the
beginning of total transition period that COVID really was. It was cleared the way for us to
really start thinking like this. And, you know, before public square was a thing, I remember,
you know, you, Michael telling the story about how you and, and Sarah Gable went through your house
looking for, you know, what are the companies that you're supporting with your dollars? And,
and what are they, what are they, what are they value? And what are they going after? And why
don't you just speak to that just a little bit, that process, because, you know, for people who
are not able to access public square yet, you know, what, what the question really is, what
can we do now for people across the earth, people around the world, and maybe speak to, you know,
maybe a little bit about the exciting things about Canada potentially very soon. And, you know, if
that's the thing we want to jump into, but the speak, talk to us about that. How can we do this
now? How can we make it really simple for people who are on the journey? Yeah, great question. I
am, I'll answer it in two ways, two steps. First is this, because you nailed it. Sarah Gable and
I have had a really revelatory two years of going through our own house and basically looking
through everything.
we owned and we threw away a lot.
And we've ceased a lot of bad habits in the marketplace
of buying from companies that at the end of the day,
like really hate me and my values.
And we can downplay it.
We can say, well, they're just trying to placate.
They're just trying to make, no.
At the end of the day,
like the only way you're matching employee contributions
to Planned Parenthood to fund abortions
is if you genuinely love abortions than hate my values.
Like that's it.
And when we can view it through a sober mind,
like I'm never going to Starbucks again.
You know what I mean?
And so that's the first thing is taking inventory,
going through your own house and saying,
what can I switch up today?
What's immediate stuff that I can switch up?
What are things that I can live without
that have been creature comforts?
It may inconvenience me a bit to have them without,
but golly, fire always falls on sacrifice.
Tell you what,
anytime we're willing to inconvenience ourselves
to pursue righteousness,
like there's blessing and reward on the other side of that.
So in my mind, that's a great first step, you know,
find the stuff that's easy, low hanging fruit.
What can I stop doing?
Do you need to throw away your Nike shoes?
Do you need to go give them to a goodwill?
You need to start with a new pair of new balances.
Like what is the thing that's easy to do?
You need to stop buying seventh generation
household products because they're donating
to defunding the police here in the North America.
Okay, I'm going to stop using those, right?
And a lot of that information is really accessible
and it only takes a few Google searches even to discover
like where are corporations, big ones spending their money.
The harder stuff is the local businesses
and that's where we come into it.
And I'd say if you live in California
or if you live in the United States,
like having public square is the best tool on the planet.
Not just saying that because we created it.
I'm saying it because it has made our buying process
so simple.
I literally just got a text while we're sitting here
from a woman who basically only does restaurants
now that are on the app.
She has found her go-to spots.
And I would say, even if you don't have public square yet,
so you can't find the plumbers, electricians,
the hotels, restaurants, coffee shops, et cetera,
that's everything you do will be revolving
around your values.
You still can take a step.
And a step would look like go talk
to a few restaurant owners, get to know them.
Like before you spend your money
and find a new date night spot,
like get to know the date night spot.
Did they respect your values over COVID?
The other thing I would do is if you're plugged
into a church, ask the pastor,
hey, are there any restaurants owned
by our church congregants?
Because I'd love to support those.
Is there any network of businesses
in our local community here, pastor,
that you know of that I need to be really patronizing?
Those are two immediate things.
Look at what you need to leave
and then look at what are the easy low-hanging fruit stuff
that you can start to make these incremental habits.
You're not gonna be perfect overnight.
I'm not.
Sebza, we're still not perfect in our spending,
but golly, we're on the journey and we're getting there.
And I think if we had a nation
and nations of the world just getting there,
we would be amazed at how much transformation
we start to see.
Our dream is that 10 million public square members
in the United States alone leave Starbucks
because they found a better local option
and Starbucks burns to the ground metaphorically
into ashes of progressive authoritarianism.
So we're excited to help that along that journey.
And we've been just talking about this theme right now.
And I think it's so key to freedom
is that the theme of unsubscribing,
was we don't realize how much power
we give companies, corporations,
our banking and insurance companies, our governments.
We don't realize how much power we give them
when we subscribe to what they're putting out
and how much power there is in unsubscribing.
Even crypto, for example,
you got tens of millions of people around the world
unsubscribing from fiat,
jumping into this crypto space,
jumping into decentralized finance.
And I don't think that the banks are all that excited
about the fact that they're losing hundreds of millions,
actually billions of dollars coming out of their economy,
billions of dollars shifting over into the crypto world.
That's completely, they're like, man,
we're losing our wealth.
We're losing our leverage.
We're losing out as people are unsubscribing
and subscribing to new opportunities.
Amen. I love it.
I love the imagery.
I love clicking the button, subscribing.
And today, if you're on an email list,
you know how often hard it is to unsubscribe
from certain things
and how cloaked that unsubscribe button is
behind 18 different pages you have to go through
until you're eventually unsubscribed.
A lot of companies make it really difficult.
But, and I think there's a metaphor there.
I think there are a lot of creature comforts
and conveniences that are tied to subscribing.
But I really want to go back to this, this message that if you can put in a time to unsubscribe like it's only blessings.
My wife and I feel more liberated than we've ever felt in our entire life because I can go to bed every night knowing that like man I tried to live my entire life on the platform and my values today, and you strip the tyrants of power.
The worst, the worst worst possible thing for a corrupt centralized authority is for a bunch of free humans to rise up and take responsibility for their own actions like that's that's what the tyrants fear more than anything.
And so, if we can do that, especially in the world of economics where it hurts them the most like amazing. And I think it's also important to note that like corporations aren't inherently bad, they're only bad if they're in bed with the government, and they are promulgated
by a corrupt authority structure like that's that's what we're a corporation public square as a C corporation.
Corporations aren't inherently bad just because they're corporations what makes us good or what makes us bad is how do we devolve our power, how is our authority structured, are we structured as a consumer service, where the people decided whether or not we
are we structured as a corrupt entity where the government decided that we have the power because we have something to offer the government to prolong their power, like, that's a really important distinction to make to.
So, don't, don't feel like you know golly do we need to go back to a trading and bartering system where it's just like I'll give you a chicken for four cows and, and I can't ever, you know, you know, initiate any sort of transaction with any corporation.
That's not the case there are great things to subscribe to.
But those things are going to be found in this parallel economy that's not tied to the government. In fact, if a business lobbies hard for the government and the government is fond of that business, like, that's where we should start to have those flags up.
The fact that crypto is so inherently an enemy of big government is all the reason for me to trust it more, you know, because you can look at, you know, where does the money lead, who benefits if this thing works that's another great question, golly, like who benefits.
This system works crypto, the only people that benefit if the system works is the people, the Federal Reserve, if the US dollar works the Federal Reserve is the one that benefits, because all the assets are essentially tied to them and so a lot there but I think you're,
you're spot on Benji I love the idea of unsubscribing I know it takes it takes some some growing pains, and I don't want to portray it as this easy thing to do, but golly it is so worth it.
Come on.
Great. I got, I got another question for you, probably getting close to coming in for a landing but paint a picture for us of the better brighter future, and what's it gonna, what's it gonna look like when these dreams that you're carrying materialize.
What does that what does that better brighter future look like something that people can anchor a hope into and go yeah I'll fight for that.
Amen.
Three things come to mind immediately number one is everything is brought into the light.
Everyone is exposed, what are you standing for, what are you standing against, what are you fighting for Starbucks, what are you really all about Bank of America, what are you really all about, like I see this movement putting pressure on these large corrupt fascistic
and exposing them in the process. I see it exposing our government, I see it also exposing people's who motives are pure, and I think we're going to see a real divide in the economy I think the parallel economy is something that I don't think is a scary thing
that we should stay away from I think it's something that we should press into.
I think it's time that we all have a very sobering come to Jesus moment, like what is this thing really built on, is it sturdy ground, or is it shifting sand and I want to go with what's going to be built on on sturdy ground and good soil so I think that's one thing,
things are getting exposed people are awakening, the more that public square rises to prominence and the more that people embrace this parallel economy I think it's a flywheel, it'll continue to build on itself the more people that wake up the more entities
that are awake thrive, the more that more people are waking up like it's a really neat give and take there. The second thing that I think I'd say is that there's a there's a really strong consumer to business and business to consumer economy that's created
it's value centric where we actually begin to see ministry taking place in the marketplace, because of the way that we're spending our dollars that the marketplace and ministry aren't compartmentalized anymore but they're actually one of the same because it's
like you're actually forwarding the kingdom, every time you make a transaction, because your Americano you got wasn't just for the Americano sake, and that transaction you actually supported a business owner that wants to see the kingdom brought to your honor.
So that's the second thing.
I'd say is that there's a real legacy being established
in the world of the B2B marketplace,
businesses helping other businesses.
There's also a real market that's created for investors
to be able to participate in an economy
and actually resell profits into this engine
that's driving based upon freedom and liberty.
That's really exciting too.
One thing that we've really prayed into
and are excited about developing
is this whole full-fledged B2B marketplace.
And then on top of that,
there are these value-centric private equity guys
that come around and they say,
hey, look, we buy small businesses
and help them get to an exit
where the founder is in his 50s or 60s
and kind of looking for a door out to pass on that business.
We come in and we help him make that journey,
but we need to have that values alignment.
So I get really excited about that space too,
where the businesses can interact
and investors can start to pour in to see the market expand.
And then guys, when those three things happen,
I'm also very excited, and I'll finish with this,
for the Starbucks of the world to apologize
and to say, golly, we took a gamble
and we thought that it would pay off
by kowtowing to a very small group of loud authoritarians
and it wasn't worth it.
I believe that we're gonna see that day.
I believe that we're gonna see a sort of reckoning
where people are going to have come to Jesus Moments,
Bank of America is gonna stop donating to Planned Parenthood
because they saw it hurt their wallets.
I think we're gonna see the Federal Reserve
actually realize that their system
is not what the people are desiring.
Now, whether they fight us on it
or whether they fall into oblivion, time will tell.
But at the end of the day,
I think that there's gonna be a real retribution
on the other side of this,
where people are gonna have an opportunity
to kind of change their ways or dig in,
but see the destruction of their industry
because the people aren't wanting it anymore.
They're not buying what they're selling.
So there's a lot there, but we're hopeful.
I think the economy's turned upside down.
Freedom's brought into the mainstream,
nations around the world,
but it all has got to start on that local level.
Awesome.
It's awesome.
I know we talk about this every day,
but this is the future of it all.
So I'm excited.
I love it.
Thanks, Michael.
Probably try to bring it in for a land here,
but there's so much there to unpack,
but I know we've got a wait list.
If you want Public Square to come to where you are,
www.publicsq.com is the way to do that.
But anything you'd add there as we close out, Michael?
No, you nailed it.
You can follow us on Instagram,
at officialpublicsq.
You just mentioned the site, publicsq.com.
We're doing big things
to help bring power back in the hands of the people.
We'd love to have people on the journey with us.
We are a part of something that's bigger
than any of us individually.
And so none of this works without community.
And so we'd love for people to join us on the journey.
We'd love to serve people.
As we get prepped for a international expansion,
we'd love to know what country you're from.
Where are you wanting this?
How could Public Square benefit your community
by bringing a values-based marketplace
into your local region?
We'd love to know where you're from
and how you think it could help.
Like all of that, please send feedback
because that's the only way this thing grows.
We need to know,
what does this economy need to look like in your eyes?
Because that's ultimately who matters at the end of the day
is you and your family and your neighbor next to you
with the same issues and same problems
and the same desires in their local community too.
So if we can build this as an army,
like this thing's gonna be unstoppable.
Hey, I've got one question I just can't resist asking
and we've kind of covered it,
but it'd be cool just to have another little recap on this.
How integral is this dynamic of economies,
economics and a free economy?
How integral is that to the cycling nations?
And I got a little bit of a spicy question on top,
just like another little extra little bit.
So it's two parts.
How integral is this dynamic of free economies
and mastering our economic structures
to the process of the cycling nations?
And the little spicy bit at the end is
what happens if we don't get it right?
Yeah, well, two quick answers.
United States is a great example.
The states with the lower taxes
and the more decentralized economies
give more to charity per capita.
States that embrace conservative values
give more a hundred times out of a hundred.
Every statistic in the book will show you that's true.
So as you give more power back to the people
and as you embrace a free market
and less government regulations
and less corruption between government and big business,
the people decide what to do with their money
and they use it.
at per capita more than the other regions
to embrace the kingdom and advance its purposes.
So United States is that way on the international states.
The more that the United States has prospered
over the last hundred years in their economy,
the more the other nations of the world rejoiced
because missions were driven by this economic engine.
Prayer was driven, technology was driven,
innovation was driven.
I mean, Sam, you've done amazing things
in international prayer networks online
that could not happen without an economic engine behind it
that's driving this technology being created
that connects us to the nations.
So on the micro and the macro level,
economic development spurs missions.
It just does.
And what happens if we get it wrong?
Exactly what you, it's sort of the antithesis
of what I just described.
If we get it wrong, economic souring
and centralized authority and over-regulation
leads people to have to worry about
just getting by in their daily lives
and not able to press in as much
for advancing the betterment of their communities.
For example, North Korea is arguably,
the country in the world with the most economic despair
for the average person.
And all that's happened through centralized authority
that sucked up all the money into a corrupt system.
North Korea, you'll see that people can't think more
than just getting the next meal in their bodies.
And when they can't think past
just getting the next meal in their bodies,
they have no vision for growth or expansion.
They're living in lack
because you've had a centralized system cut them off
from any ability to prosper or have abundance.
And so if we mess this up,
if we mess up economic development,
if we mess up the free market
and the pursuit of liberty in the economy,
we end up in a system where people are so worried
about even just getting the next meal in their body
that the last thing on their mind
is how can I disciple the nations?
And so that's kind of how I'd answer that.
Yeah, massive.
And I mean, we just had Marina on earlier today sharing,
she grew up in Tajikistan where they messed it up.
The Soviet Union collapsed.
Their economy went through the floor.
Her mom ended up in prostitution.
Her house became a brothel.
Her sister was trafficked.
Her brother was trafficked.
She only just managed to escape
being trafficked through a sovereign intervention.
I mean, that's the type of world that we start facing
if we stuff this up.
So this is really something that we all have to take,
I would suggest, urgent responsibility for right now.
Would you agree that this is like,
not just like a kind of a big,
like kind of a hobby type roundabout,
but this is actually now more and more
a pressing, urgent matter that we all have to really step up
and take urgent responsibility for?
Absolutely.
And you all have the power to.
Everyone can unsubscribe.
It takes all of us.
We can't wait for one, again,
one centralized authority to do it.
It takes all of us and it's all possible,
but it does require going the extra mile
in this day and age.
We've been called for such a time as this.
We're not in peace time right now.
And I think people need to realize that.
We're in crisis mode and we can still be joyful.
We can still be at peace in the midst of crisis mode,
but crisis mode requires different actions than peace time.
And right now it requires all of us to step up,
unsubscribe, pursue this next chapter in our nations
and nations around the world's grand scheme of things
and be people that create a legacy
to where we don't go down
Tajikistan or North Korea's road,
but we actually got this right
and the nations of the world benefited because of it.
Come on.
Good.
So good.
Well, let's wrap it up there,
but thank you, Michael, for such a fire time.
It's just always a privilege.
I will, you know, always the joy to be on the journey.
And Benji, you brought some fire questions there.
I love what you guys are doing.
It's right on point with what the world needs right now.
I mean, it's so cutting edge what you guys are doing
when other people are just doing the old ostrich technique
of head in the sand, pretending it's not happening,
where you guys are forefront pioneering solutions
that people haven't even fully considered the,
you know, the questions to the issues.
And you guys are like trailblazing solutions,
which I love.
So, so exciting.
And our next session, and we've got an hour's break now.
And then our next session,
session 17, come on, is with Jason Cobb.
And they have been stewarding an open heaven outpouring,
seeing some of the most phenomenal manifestations
of heaven physically materializing in the earth
through the children's homes that they have,
children being taken to heaven for over a decade,
full-blown open heaven manifestation for over a decade
that's causing citywide atmospheric shift in their city,
massive shift in culture and mindset.
sets in their city through stewarding and open heaven and so it's just going to be wild plunging
into their story of what God has been doing it is a full-scale move of God over there so we're
going to be so blessed hearing what they have been carrying for over a decade and Michael what an
honor my man looking forward to trailblazing highways into freedom for people together.
Amen it's an honor guys thank you so much cool thanks Michael
maybe I'm the one that has to turn it off so see you later.