Hello.
How are you.
Good. How are you.
Good. Do you go by Chris or Christine, I see that you're Chris on zoom.
Yeah, Chris.
Okay, Chris.
Yeah.
Congratulations on your wedding.
Thank you. I am 38 years old, and my husband is 49 and it's our first, both of us, it's our first marriage so we've waited a long time and so is everybody else in our lives.
And so for the wedding everyone can say, it's just been a really long time y'all have waited a long time.
You know, so yeah, thank you. We're very excited we just got back from, and well we had a one week honeymoon.
And then in America than a two week honeymoon in, in Switzerland.
And then we had, which I know just sounds like a lot but the thing is that he's part of the ministry that has all of July off for what they call sabbatical, meaning that kind of like teachers they don't get paid but they, but the whole ministry
So that's why we got married when we did instead of, and got married really quickly after we got engaged is in order to be able to take advantage of having a PM having a whole month off.
So anyway that in a has enabled us to travel and so right now we're traveling to Canada, which is why I'm calling you from the road I'm really sorry.
We actually had to stop and pull over, because we're on our way to Canada for having more honeymoon visiting friends and ministry.
And we were supposed to have already been there by now but we had issues with the car that had to be dealt with beforehand, meaning that we got off late, meaning that I'm happy to call you from the road.
My husband is now in in a rest stop center just entertaining himself on his computer while I'm out here.
I apologize for the unprofessional and interesting background of the college, it's quite good it's better than mine mine is really cluttered I rent a room.
So, it's a bit cluttered, I need to put a Hawaii background in.
Don't we all don't we all.
I have we have some friends that were the people that were kind of like manage the venue of the place that we got married and had it and had our honeymoon at, and they are currently in Hawaii, so my Facebook is being filled by all of their cool pictures
from Hawaii so they have a legitimate Hawaii background for everything.
The stream about it.
It's so nice to finally get to connect with you. Yes, likewise. Yeah, I enjoyed those, I think it was 13 videos.
Yeah, that that was really good really resonated with me.
Really good.
I mean, it's kind of been a theme that the Lord has given me about union with him.
And I was just thinking before the call the church doesn't teach it.
No, yeah.
And doesn't I didn't know about it the Lord had to reveal it to me because when I was when I was living my life based off of what it is that I heard the church teaching.
I don't want to blame you know the church for what it is, how it is that I interpreted it, but from what it sounded like to me that they were saying, I was, I just live my life like that I need the Lord like that and I just drove myself into the
it burned me out, it turned me against the Lord. The, the gospel didn't feel like power it felt like oppression. And so the Lord himself had to save me and heal me from, you know, with this message about about union about freedom about rest, because I wasn't, I wasn't hearing it in anything else.
I, I wouldn't even I and I was interpreting the Bible from what it was that I thought that the church was saying and how the church was interpreting it and so therefore I just even reading the Bible, I wasn't hearing the message of the gospel so it was once.
Nothing else works. And it was just driving my life into the ground that the Lord just had to grab ahold of me all by myself, meaning like it was a desperate bottom of the pit moment, and, and I could hear nothing, but the voice of the Lord and then he's
like okay actually let's let me teach you what is actually true, you know, from my spirit, and it takes a lot of faith to risk your life on the fact that that voice really is the Lord.
You're supposed to, you know, you're supposed to live your life in this new way and is that
real?
And if it is, well, then how exactly do you do that?
Because it all sounds great.
Then you got to actually live it.
How do you, how do you live it?
How do you make this, this idea, this theory, this concept actually practical where, how
do you live life difference in the way that you've been living it?
So anyway, I'm excited to hear that you say that the Lord's been talking to you about
all of this, about union, et cetera.
Yeah.
I went to Prairie Bible Institute, graduated in 79.
And one of the messages there was, you know, union with Christ, but it focused on the death
part.
The man who started the Bible school, Ellie Maxwell has a book, Born Crucified and yeah.
And one of my, I think I was in my freshman year, I had to write a paper on identification
with Christ.
I didn't know it.
I really, what is it?
You know?
So that kind of started the journey.
And you know, I had struggles with sin and all that and and so I was really seeking,
how do we live the Christian life?
Because you know, I felt like a failure and I mean, to some degree, you know, God has
brought me along on the journey, but you know, when I was watching your videos, it just,
you know, oh, I want to learn more.
And I know there's resistance in me, you know, I just it's, I think it's hard for me to
really trust God, you know, really give myself to him.
And I mean, I do, you know, I surrender, you know, all that.
But you know, it's like, I sense resistance in me.
And I know and I had a question for you, like, say people who are non-Christians, not believers,
do they have, I mean, I always thought that they didn't have a spirit that was alive until
you believed, but in listening to your video, it kind of got me to think, well, they do
have a spirit, but it's dead towards God.
Is that what it is?
You know, I'll be honest with you, I teach according to the bit of understanding that
I have.
So there's an extent to which I don't understand.
And then there's also an aspect of, we teach according to how we see it and how we understand
it based on, but we still, like the Bible says, we see in part.
So it's one of those things where I just teach according to, okay, well, what I can
see and sense and understand, this is what it looks like.
So it's kind of sort of like this, but it's one of the things where the more that the
Lord revealed to all of us, the more that we then look back on what it is that we believe
this far and realize, oh, well, now that I see it in light of new revelation, it makes
this look actually different than the way that I thought that I, the way that I'd interpreted
it.
So step one, I, to that, the way I don't understand all of it, but the way that I see it and understand
it based off of the Bible, et cetera, is, is that they do have a spirit and it's reborn.
In other words, so in other words, it's dead, but it's something can't be dead that didn't
exist previously.
If it, if it didn't exist, well, then it can't be dead.
You know, it had to be an existence and then it died.
Now it's dead, but you can't have something dead that never existed first.
So that's where I get this understanding.
And then of course, the fact that Jesus talked to Nicodemus about a man needs to be born
again, and he had, and then that which is born of spirit of spirit, that which is born
of flesh is flesh.
Because when Nicodemus was saying, we'll be born again, so I have to go back into my mother's
womb.
In other words, he was understanding that Jesus was saying, there's an origination point
and it has to, and you have to come back to an origination point.
So that's where I get this understanding that apparently we all have spirit.
We're all born with spirit.
The spirits existed, but from what I believe, you know, at the beginning of time, you know,
according to, or before the beginning of time.
you know, Ephesians 1, 4, that God chose us in him before, before the creation of the world.
But that because of sin, it created a separation between us and the Lord.
And in other words, there was that, that death is what, what the Bible keeps
referring to as a death of spirit.
In other words, that their spirit is dead.
And so Jesus kept referring to Nicodemus, referring when he was
talking to Nicodemus about the fact that we have to be reborn.
Um, so that's why I think that we all have spirits, but that's
the unbelieving or spirit.
Um, have died.
So they did exist and they still exist as spirits, but there's what, and then by
dead, I don't fully understand what dead means because they're still, they still
exist, the spirit still exists, but what I think that it might, and again, I only
understand in part, so I only talk in part.
I believe that it just kind of must mean something about that.
There's like this disconnect or there's this aspect in which they can't access
it or, or something, not access their spirit, but it's like there's a division
between maybe their spirit and their flesh, their spirit and their soul and
body that who it is that they are in spirit can't affect changed and
transform their soul and their body.
And that, and that disconnect is what God is.
You're cutting out a bit.
You just went off.
I don't know if you can hear me.
I can't hear you.
You're the screen's frozen.
It doesn't you.
Okay.
So, um, now I can hear you.
Yeah, I can't hear you.
I can see your picture.
Can you hear me now?
Your voice is distorted.
Can you hear me now?
I can hear you.
Can you hear me?
I can hear you.
This is perfect.
A while ago it showed me you only had one bar.
Now it's showing me you have three.
If we have that trouble again,
we might try turning off our video.
Then it doesn't use as much data.
I'm going to turn off our video.
I show I have four bars.
I'm on LTE.
It's one of those things.
Which person needs to finagle it?
Yes, if that happens, I think I'm going to turn it off right now.
OK, OK, go ahead.
Does that help? Did that bring up the bars?
Oh, you're frozen again.
OK.
Yeah, you're frozen.
OK.
OK, Chris, can you hear me now?
Yeah, I can hear you.
OK, so it Zoom apparently keeps disconnecting and trying to reconnect.
I don't know why
it's so we'll both keep our videos off and hopefully we can we can make this work.
OK, so anyway, that that's how I kind of understand it.
I don't believe that I understand it fully,
but that's the general idea is the idea that I believe that even unbelievers still
have their spirits, that their spirits were created before their soul and body
and they were created for relationship with the Lord.
But the fact that there is a bit of separation and a disconnect,
in other words, a lack of being able to access or being able to be transformed
by their flesh, being able to be transformed by who it is that they are.
Actually, in spirit is God's reason for referring to their spirit as if their
spirit is dead, but it can obviously be reborn.
But that's my general idea of it.
Take it with a grain of salt.
No, no, that's I mean, I hadn't really thought about that, that they I mean,
I knew that they were their spirit was dead and had to be reborn.
But kind of the thought that.
You know, like when
Ezekiel was it, Ezekiel spoke to the dry bones.
Uh huh.
I was just wondering if there was a way
to speak to them that would speak to their spirit.
You know.
Well, I I believe that our spirits can speak
to their spirit and how it all works, exactly.
I don't know.
I don't really I just know that when I'm
talking to to believers or unbelievers, I talk to all their spirit,
their souls and their bodies, how exactly that all works.
I don't know.
But not knowing how it works, et cetera.
I still I just operate according to what it is that I do know.
And then the rest of it is, hey, I don't even know if this works.
I don't even know if this is how it works, but I'm going to try.
Yeah, yeah.
And then see what happens.
Yeah.
Yeah,
but I mean, the the whole thing is, I mean,
which has been a big thing for me throughout my life is, well, how does this
actually work, you know, not that that you get, you know,
like it's a formula or something because it's not.
But.
I mean, I from what you said, it sounds like, you know,
there's faith, you know, belief and surrender.
And I mean, I've experienced some of that and
but, you know, to consistently be living out of the spirit and, you know,
controlling soul and body, I don't think I don't experience that.
I mean, I'm sure there are times that I do, but to consistently experience that.
I mean, that's what I would really like to do.
And I'm pretty, not so much right at the moment,
but I've been pretty stressed out with work.
I still work full-time at home on my computer
and have meetings, teams meetings.
But yeah, I can get really,
really spend hours and hours working
and not do much else,
watch TV in the evening on my laptop.
I don't have much people contact except on the calls.
Yep, been there, done that.
Yeah.
And yeah, so it's, I mean, and my living situation,
it reminded me something that happened just recently
when you were talking about that guy
that was not nice to you.
Yes.
You know, and how you were able to, I mean,
like I was really about upset about,
I mean, I have just felt,
I'm living with a family from my church
and they have two kids, you know, grown.
They're now out of the house.
The daughter just left recently, last week.
And I've just felt excluded, you know, not wanted.
And the daughter and the mom were leaving.
I live in California,
but they're leaving to drive a cross country to Florida
because the daughter's getting an internship at Disney World.
So she was, you know, they were getting ready to leave.
So I go into the garage, you know, to say goodbye.
And I'm standing there and she says,
do you mind if we have some family time now?
And it was like, I don't want you here right now.
And I just walked back to my room and cried, you know,
because that's kind of, and then the dad,
he came back after they left,
he came back and said he was sorry, you know,
she's had a tough time and we prayed together
and she didn't want to cry in front of me.
But it was like, I was so, I felt so hurt.
And then it went into anger, you know?
Like, and yesterday I was reading in John,
like John maybe 13 to 17 are my favorite,
probably my favorite passages.
And, you know, the whole thing of that God,
the father loves us as much as he loves Jesus
and Jesus loves us as much as he loves the father.
And then Jesus says to love one another
as much as I love you.
And, you know, working that out
because this has been kind of a repeated thing.
I mean, it just feeling excluded, you know,
and I don't have much contact with other people,
but feeling uninvited,
you know, and my room is, I can shut my door
and which they like me to keep my door shut.
And I have a deck, a private entrance, a great view,
but, you know, it just got to me, you know?
It really got to me this last week.
So, I mean, to keep loving when somebody,
you know, I mean, this has kind of been a repeat.
And then she came back from school and I thought,
oh, this time, you know, she's acting nicer.
And, but, you know, I just, you know,
I just feel excluded.
Then when this thing happened, when, before they left,
you know, I would never tell somebody to go away.
Why, I'm leaving some, you know,
why couldn't they invite, include me in their prayer?
You know, it was, that's kind of how it's been.
And yeah, so to keep loving
and not feel animosity towards her is difficult.
Yeah, well, yeah, very obviously.
Yeah, correct.
Yeah, you're right.
I mean, it's those types of situations, you know,
where the rubber meets the road.
So all of this stuff, you know.
all sounds really great and wonderful and oh yeah we should love you know no matter what and then we
find ourselves in these situations you know and like well how do you do it in this one and and
because um what ends up happening is those situations you know reveal to us areas in which
we are and I think that I mentioned it in those particular videos and because I have
several different teachings so teaching series and I think I mentioned it in the ones that you
watch that when when we have what we refer to in the you know the church or in bible studies or to
each other or whatever is like trials and tribulations what those things are are they're
not tests in which like we what we got in school where as if God is treating us like this teacher
where we're sitting at a desk he gives us the he's been teaching us all this stuff gives us
piece of paper and then here's your test and I'm going to walk away and I'm going to and then
you're going to be alone while you take this test to prove that you have learned all the information
that I've taught you this far that you're going to be abandoned in taking this in your stress in
your anxiety in the difficulty of the situation and let's see what it is that you know let's see
if you perform up to snuff and you need to make sure to not cheat you need to make sure to not
talk to anybody it really the that type of testing is very isolating and so when we hear the word
testing in the bible that God you know that we were tested etc it doesn't mean that God abandons
us and to see how we to see if we perform well based off of what he's taught us this far it's
very different the tests are actually these trials and tribulations these things of like when this
stuff comes up where it's like look I've now been treated unfairly or someone says done something to
me that wasn't right it wasn't justified or I've done something you know that wasn't right or
justified or whatever regardless of the situation something's not reflective of character of the
Lord those trials and tribulations are actually invitations of God to step out of areas in which
we're in bondage and step into more freedom they're always invitations because they're they're
not okay they're they're not situations that are showing us the conditions in which God will or
will not accept us like yeah okay yeah you're you're doing great I love you we've got a good
relationship I'll talk to you I'll will answer uh your requests when you ask me etc but oh my goodness
now the situations come up and you see how someone's treated you and you see and you feel
how you internally respond and okay you know you know here we're at a crossroads here we're at a
fork in the road and my interaction with you is going to change based on how you respond are you
going to respond appropriately based off of everything you've I've taught you from your
pastor everything that you've taught you in your spirit from you know from the Bible all of this
stuff that's actually not what's going on what's going on is God saying these situations are
revealing to you areas in which whether or not you're in those situations your your heart is in
bondage and I want you to know that you are actually in bondage so that you can choose to
step into freedom in that area of your life where you're no longer enslaved and you're no longer
oppressed you're you're always oppressed and enslaved in that area it's just that you don't
feel it and realize it unless certain situations come up and then that bondage that's always there
suddenly comes to the forefront and you realize that you know so God's just like hey look I'm
just highlighting I'm allowing to be highlighted things that are always an issue for you but that
are flying under the radar until these situations and circumstances come up so now that you see what
is inside of you you see that you're in bondage child would you like to live in more freedom
because you have you actually already have the opportunity to live in freedom it's already yours
you already have the victory would you like to gain the benefit of getting to experience
the victory that you already are in in your spirit would you like to start gaining the benefits of it
You're not gaining in a, in a manner of speaking who it is that you are, is not
gaining victory in those situations.
You know, if you were to choose the right path, if you were to make the right
decision, you know, if you were to forgive, if you were to release, you know, all
those things, you're not actually gaining new victory, the victory has already been
gained.
You were just finally coming into agreement by choice with the fact that you
already have it.
So it's like the older son.
So that's what you're doing in this situation.
So the situation isn't, aren't as actually as hard as what we think that they are.
We think that we're in those situations and oh my goodness, this is going to be
really hard because God wants me to fight to have the victory.
Oh bogus.
You, he's already fought and he's already had the victory for you.
Your inheritance as his son is to get to live in that victory.
So do you choose now that to come into agreement with the fact that you are who
God says that you are?
Because when you come into agreement with the fact that you are who God says that
you are, that he is who he says that that he is, et cetera, your flesh and meaning
like your soul and your body and what it is that they believe, et cetera, finally
gain the benefits of a victory that's already been won.
You're not having to, in those, when you're finding yourself in those situations
and circumstances, you're not actually being presented with a battle, so to
speak, um, it with a battle to be fought and to have victory over it's already
done.
Yeah.
And so if, if you, if we realize that it makes those situations easier to quote
unquote overcome, because we have to realize that it's already been overcome,
but we use the verbiage and the Bible even uses the verb, verbiage of battle
and overcome as phrases to help us understand what, uh, what's happening
when we're trying to come into agreement, when we come into agreement with the
fact that it's done, we can call that whole process of coming into agreement.
We can call that overcoming.
We can call that switch of being in disagreement to switch of being in
agreement.
We can call that a battle because the flesh is warring against the spirit.
The flesh wants to go one way.
The spirit wants to go another and to switch from choosing your flesh to now
choosing your spirit.
That's a, that is what God's calling a battle.
That's what God's calling, um, the overcoming, but technically, even
according to the Bible, the battle has already been won and you've already
overcome G G R.
Are you hearing, I'm trying to explain this as well as possible.
Are you hearing that those verses that we have in the Bible that always sounded
contradictory where God said the Bibles are, that the Bible has already been
won and we've already overcome, but then it continues to say, oh, you got to
fight and you got to win the battle and you have to continue to overcome.
You see how it sounds contradictory in the Bible, but actually
he's not being contradictory.
He's saying, no, the victory already has been won and it already has been overcome.
But you continually coming into agreement with the fact that that is true is what
God is a struggle because your flesh wants to go one way and your spirit wants to go
another.
So you simply choosing that it's true is what God's calling a battle and
is what God's calling overcoming.
You choosing to come into agreement is called overcoming.
So that's why these things, that's one example of how these verses in the Bible
that, that sound like they're saying literally the opposite thing are actually
both true at the same time.
Yeah, I see what you mean.
Yeah.
So it's, I mean, you know, like you have a little, you have a struggle in your
heart because you know, you should forgive, but you're really angry at the moment.
And you kind of feel like, well, if I let the anger go, then I'm going to get hurt
again.
And I, I don't want to, you know, you know, that sort of thing, but then, you know,
that doesn't, the anger only hurts me anyway, it doesn't, she doesn't care anyway, but
yeah, I can see.
So it's, it's more that sort of struggle to just then to let it go and believe that,
that I already have that freedom and that victory to love in, in, you know.
difficult circumstances.
Yes, so what it is that you're choosing in those moments
is instead of choosing and focusing on
how a situation is affecting you
or what is coming against you,
you know, whatever,
you actually are choosing that you are who God says that you are.
And if you are who God says you are,
if you are spirit,
if you're one with Him,
if you're unified with Him,
and Christ is above everything,
and the only thing that's above Christ is God the Father,
then it means that everything else is under Christ's feet.
All power and authority have been given to Christ,
and therefore if you're in Christ,
all power and authority have been given to you
as long as you're operating within Christ Himself,
being unified with Him,
and then everything else is under your feet.
That is who you are.
Your identity is your union.
Your identity is the point at which your spirit is unified with Christ's spirit.
You cannot be identified apart from Christ.
So that is what those situations are threatening you to not believe.
So you have to choose,
no, I am who God says that I am,
therefore everything,
including the situation in which this person has said this thing to me
in which I feel,
and regardless of what they say,
regardless of what someone has done or said,
what it's causing you internally to believe,
which is the fact of I'm isolated and alone,
or I'm not worthy,
or I'm not worth being connected with,
or I'm disconnected,
or whatever it is that subconsciously we're telling ourselves in those moments,
because one of the biggest issues that I've dealt with in life has been rejection,
and so when you're telling me these stories,
I'm like, oh, yeah,
I've lived that so many times,
because there's different people have different areas of their life that are,
I don't know,
just typically that are,
I don't know,
highlighted,
and for me,
the thing that has really,
really been attacked has been my feeling of connection with people.
And the enemy has known that,
and I've really,
really been attacked with rejection,
so I definitely feel you on all of that,
and I am so sorry.
And what I had to learn is I had to learn,
excuse me,
that in all of the examples that I gave in those teachings that you listened to,
the way that I overcame those difficulties in those relationships was in choosing that I was who God says that I am.
If I just focused on,
okay,
I need to love this person,
then it wasn't enough for me,
because remember that how God gives us the power to love supernaturally comes out of us being who he says that we are,
which he says is united with him,
who he says is love itself.
So to love,
if you focus on your identity in Christ and you choose that you are who God says that you are,
not that you act how God says that you act,
not that you focus,
that you are who God says that you are,
and you choose that that is true,
your actions will effortlessly come out of that.
So you will no longer have to focus on trying to love someone.
So I really didn't focus a whole lot on trying to love that gentleman that was causing such problems for me at work.
Sure, I did some.
I tried to love him and all of that.
But the majority of it is,
see, if we don't agree that we are who God says that we are,
and we think that we're somebody else,
we're trying to love someone out of who we think that we are,
and who we think that we are in those moments if we're struggling.
It means that we think that we're separated from Christ.
It means that God's expecting something of this human being that is trying so really hard to do the right thing,
and they're just trying really hard to be good.
Well, that person can't love supernaturally.
Only someone who is who God says that they are can love supernaturally.
So you have to choose that first in order to be able to have the love that God says that he wants you to have.
So that love that he says that he wants you to have,
that's not a commandment of something he wants you to do and to build up as like practice.
That's something that God says,
This is a description of your character.
But in order to act...
your character, you have to choose the person whose character that is. So you
have to go all the way back to the root. And so in a way, this frees you.
This frees you from the condemnation of trying really, really hard to continue
to do the things God tells you to do, like be patient, be loving, and all of
this stuff that's just, we're all fine, so difficult. It frees you from that
because God's like, I don't require you to work hard for that. That's already who
you are. That's part of your inheritance, is you got to inherit a character. You
got to, because you literally, the old man died, you're now the new man. The new man
is always left. But you have to agree that you're the new man before that
character, the new man, starts effortlessly acting on his own. So it's
actually a lot easier to live the Christian life than the way that we've
been living it thus far. All we have to do is that we have to remember and
choose that we are who God says that we are. And then that character will start
coming out.
Well, that's simple, isn't it?
Yes, it is. Very simple.
Yeah, the way you're explaining it, it is so simple. And so it's not focusing on
my feelings and my hurt feelings or my anger, or I have to love, you know, love
her. But it's, it's changes the focus completely, doesn't it?
Correct. And then also another thing that you might find helpful to remember is
part of the struggle that we have, when we are struggling with like, oh,
struggling to love someone, etc. is the route that we start with, is we condemn
ourselves first. Yeah, we condemned ourselves by saying, Oh, see, I'm not
doing I'm supposed to be doing. I'm bad. I'm not reflecting what God said. I'm
sinning. This is horrid. I'm really sorry, Lord. And we feel shame and
condemnation. And then we're using that shame and condemnation, which God says
is a lie. And according to Romans one, one, there is no there are four notion
condemnation in those for those who are in Christ Jesus. So we're, we're taking a
lie. We're trying to base obeying God off of a false foundation. So no wonder
we don't succeed. No wonder we find it so difficult. We have to go back to the
foundation where God says we are not ashamed. And we have are not condemned.
And once we start back at the very beginning and agree with him that we are
who he says that we are, one of the ways that we can do that is, you know, no
shame, no condemnation, then it's a lot easier to, you know, to follow through
on what it was that I was saying, where we choose to that we are who God says
that we are, and then that person begins to be that person, that new man
effortlessly loves that other person, regardless of how that person, regardless
of what that other person says, or does to us, regardless of what situations and
circumstances we find ourselves in, in which the old man feels threatened with,
look, I'm disconnected, I'm isolated, I'm alone, the new man does not feel
threatened. And that's really what's going on there when we have those
feelings of like disconnection and, and unforgiveness, or, you know, anger or
whatever, that it comes out unless we're talking about righteous anger. And
righteous anger doesn't just necessarily how I put that, just because someone
shouldn't have said something, and we get angry about it doesn't mean that our
anger is founded on righteous anger.
No, I don't think so.
Yeah, it could just, you know, it's usually the fact that there were angry
because we feel threatened, we feel that it is trying to it that who it is that
we are, and what it is that we want, is being has the possibility of being taken
away, or of being denied. And that's not true. Yeah, that's what threatening
means threatening means we feel that something that we have can be taken away.
But see, nothing that God gives us can ever be taken away. And we can't ever be
separated from the love of God, etc. So therefore, we cannot ever be threatened.
That's what I mean, when I keep saying that I keep telling, you know, in the
teachings, whatever, you know, that we don't need to feel threatened, because
we're actually not threatened. It's not that we don't get experience attacks,
it's not that arrows aren't thrown, you know, at us, you know, that things were
thrown at Jesus, he had all kinds of attacks come against him bodily, you
know, etc.
breath. It doesn't mean that we don't have a tax come at us. It
means that the attacks can't threaten us. In other words,
they can't, there's no potential for something that we have to be
taken away by those things. They can't take anything away from
us. Therefore, no matter how many attacks that we have that
they set against us, we're still not threatened. The old man can
be threatened. The new man cannot be threatened. So as long
as you switch into choosing that you are the new man, even if you
continue to experience these things from this lady, you know,
even in regardless of whether it's this lady, it could be
somebody at church, it could be, it could be nobody, you're just
sitting in your room, and you just kind of feel a particular
way, it could be something that happens at work, you know, or
over a call or whatever. The thing is that when you find
yourself in those situations, you, if you switch into the new
man, it doesn't matter what comes against you, what is said,
etc. You're not you, you will, you won't be as the new man, you
won't be threatened, you won't feel threatened by them. So when
we live out of rest, when we live out of our spirit, it
doesn't stop attacks. It stops the attacks from actually
threatening us. Yeah, yeah, stealing our choice, you know,
etc. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think because I feel
threatened, and I feel like I have to put up walls against
her. Correct, because it's acting in self defense, like,
Oh, my goodness, something can be taken. And it can't. Yeah,
yeah. Well, that's a whole new way of looking at things, isn't
it? Yes. And also, and a really, really, really cool thing. It
doesn't just put you in a neutral position with someone.
When you do something like this, when you operate like this, you
it then puts you in a position where now you are agreeing that
you are in the position where God says that you are where
crisis that you are being one with them. You now are in a
position where you can bring the kingdom of God, how to put this
the kingdom in which you are operating has a higher
authority than the kingdom of the circumstances in which
you're finding yourself. So therefore, you can call on your
higher kingdom that you're operating in. And you can
perform a miracle and transform your situation and
circumstances, because the kingdom that you're operating
in and that you're calling on, trumps the kingdom of the
circumstances in the situation. So that is how you're able to
then. So by by doing what I was talking about, by switching
your your identity, etc. You act it actually puts you in a
position by which your situation, your circumstance,
the people around you, etc. can be influenced and
transformed. So you're actually, your decision doesn't
just neutralize you from attacks, it actually can
overpower them, and can change things. So it puts you in a
powerful position, not a neutral one.
Wow, yeah.
So it's, it's very important. So it's not just kind of like,
okay, well, I'm just neutralizing myself in this in
this situation. No, you're actually putting yourself in a
position of higher power and authority. It doesn't mean that
you always, that God always wants us to like, do something
necessarily about it. About the situation, case in point, Jesus,
when he was with the disciples on in the boat on the water, and
he didn't even find the need, the Bible says to wake up in the
middle of the storm, let alone to tell the storm to stop doing
what it was doing. The disciples felt threatened. And they're
like, Jesus, you know, don't you care about us? In other words,
they're like, Hey, look, we've got to get this thing to stop.
Jesus not only didn't find it necessary to tell it to stop. He
didn't even find it necessary to even be awake and aware. He was
like, let's let us get do what it's going to do. I'm going to
sleep. And so he was just trying he, because he was all he was
operating out of complete rest of the father, and
understanding that it didn't matter what happened. It didn't
matter what the circumstances and situations were that were
going on around him, whether it be other people, or whether it
be a physical environment or whatever. It doesn't matter that
then
that the things happening didn't determine whether or not he was threatened.
He was never threatened, even if the circumstances and the situation continued.
So just because you, so even though he got up and he told the wind and the waves to be quiet,
we find from the fact that he didn't find it necessary to wake up,
as proof of the fact that not every situation means that we find in that that's wrong or
that shouldn't be happening or whatever, doesn't always need to stop.
God doesn't always call on us to change the situation.
I'm just saying that you're in a position of power,
whether or not God called you to wield anything from that position of power to bring order.
You don't have to bring order to a situation and change it in order for you to no longer be threatened as an identity.
Your identity is who it is, regardless of what's going on around you and regardless of how it affects your body or whatever.
Because even Paul talked about the fact, hey, you know, you can kill me and it won't change anything.
Because he said, you know, to live is Christ and to die is gain.
He was like, hey, look, I win either way.
So attacks, even on the body, even on Christ's physical body, didn't determine whether or not he was under threat.
So anyway, my point is that it puts you in a position not of neutrality, but of power.
But just FYI, it doesn't always mean that the situation will change or that we're supposed to get it to change.
But it does put you in a position of power.
What I asked the Lord to do with that gentleman is like, Lord, help me interact with him in a way that Jesus would.
And I've done it not just with him.
I've done it with lots of other people and lots of other really difficult situations that I've been in, including a lawsuit in which I was in business.
I was working for a company and the company was sued.
And then because of the vile way in which this other company decided to sue the company that I worked for, they decided to go after me personally.
Because my boss, they couldn't get him to admit fault because he hadn't done anything wrong.
And so they thought, hey, well, if we went after his personal assistant, maybe that would emotionally get him to do what we want to do.
So anyway, then they personally attacked me and drew me into it.
Anyway, so even in major lawsuit situations, I've had to do this and I've had to remember who God says that I was.
And this, by the way, was before God taught me about rest.
So it's really fascinating. He's watched me through a lot of things.
And it's been after the fact that he'll look back that he'll look back in history together.
And I'll say, actually, by the way, that thing that I was teaching you how to operate in and I just told you to do something, you do it.
You didn't know why I was telling you to do it. That thing is called operating in rest.
That thing is called operating in spirit. I didn't know it at the time.
But anyway, in lots of situations, whether it be with people or a lawsuit or whatever, I have, God's had to teach me how to, I've sought the Lord and I've sought his heart.
And like, OK, God, how can I not just not just remember and gain the benefit of who it is that I am, who it is that you say that I am and who it is that you say that you are not just that, Lord.
But what can I do the way that Jesus poured himself out positively from a powerful position to change the lives of other people, to touch them, to forgive them, to love them, to bless them so that their life was even better from having met them than before.
How can I do that too? In other words, not Lord, just how can you keep me from being affected by someone? Rather, Lord, how can I pour out of my own life to benefit someone else, to benefit these people that are hurting me, to benefit the people that have attacked me in this lawsuit, to, you know, to whatever.
And so you'll find yourself in some situations having that heart. That heart, by the way, is the heart of your father. That is, and because you are of him, because you're his son, because you carry his DNA, that is your character. That is the things that you desire to do for other people.
So anyway, so that's why I wanted to mention this.
fact that there's so much to be gained by choosing that you are who God says that you
are when you're confronted with these things in yourself that appear when you're in those
situations with other people and people say those things, you feel that way, have that
response, et cetera.
You're not just gaining, you're not just trying to seek the Lord to gain an understanding
and a benefit of like, Lord, how do I gain the benefit of being at rest in you where
people can say whatever and it doesn't, and I don't feel threatened.
If more than that, if Lord, how can I then turn around and bless their life?
Not just how can you protect me from them?
How can I actually be put in a way where I am pouring out myself into them in such a
way that it transforms them?
So it's just, it's a lot, it's powerful, it's, I don't know, there's just, there's so much
good in it and that is who you are.
It's already who you are and what you're doing is you are learning with the Lord by choosing
your identity continually in a variety of situations.
You are, how to put this, you are being, you'll be taught, we're all being taught by our father
how to mature as the person that he already says that we are.
To say, for instance, as a friend of mine puts it, which I've always thought was a great
analogy.
It's like a baby being born with all of its arms and its legs and its brain and everything
it needs in order to function, you know, its DNA, et cetera, but it doesn't stay a baby.
It continues to grow.
It learns that it has an arm.
It learns that it has a hand.
It's really cute to watch babies suddenly discover that they have these things.
Well, they were born with them.
They've always had them, but it's like they suddenly discovered, oh my word, what is this
thing?
Oh my goodness, it's a hand.
That's fascinating.
And then they learn what it can do.
And then they learn how to make it do that when they want.
And then they learn what kind of situations that they're in in life and what the different
things that their hand can do can be used to help them in such and such a situation.
You know, for buttons, you push with a finger, for a lever, you grab it and then you pull
it towards yourself or you push it or you do.
There's all kinds of different things.
We do the same thing in the spirit.
So just because you already are the thing doesn't mean that you know how to operate
in everything.
But don't let your lack of understanding of how to love someone to its full, to their,
to your fullest ability or how to pour into someone else and transform their life.
Don't let your don't let your lack of understanding make you think that, well, maybe that's not
me.
No, it's still you, but you're young, you know, as a son with the Lord.
And by young, you could be 35 in the spirit.
You know, I don't know.
You could be 55.
I just mean that you're, you're on a particular at a particular time and point on your timeline
of development with the Lord.
And God doesn't, didn't create you to already know and be fully mature and functioning at
your highest capacity.
He created you very purposefully to learn in a journey of relationship with him more
and more of what you already are more and more of what you're capable of.
You grow into that.
So just because as you run into, I don't know, and I've never been, you know, Lord, you tell
me this in the Bible, but I don't know how to do it.
That doesn't mean that you're not that thing already, and you don't have it yet.
No, you have those things within you, but you learn from the father in a process of
maturation and development of relationship between father and son, where a father teaches
his son more things.
He teaches them carpentry.
He teaches them how to make a piece of furniture.
He teaches them how to get a ball with a baseball bat.
He teaches them things.
So it's the same thing with us.
So just FYI, I don't expect, you know, and get discouraged if like, well, you know, God
says that I am already this thing.
Why am I not performing well or whatever, you know, standard that you're, that you,
you know, that we have a tendency to use on our, on our stuff.
Know that there's a process of maturation, but know that
you already are the thing, you're not in lack of it. It's just that you've never done this
thing before and you don't know how. So it changes our prayer life to be, to instead of,
Lord, give me something I don't have. Instead, because that's calling God a liar, that saying,
well, God, you say that you've given me everything, but obviously it's not true,
so I'm asking you to give me something. No, no, no. We say, God, you've already given me everything,
but show me, Lord, what you've given me and how to operate in it.
It completely changes our prayer life. That's how we pray now. Lord, I agree with you.
This is who I am. I am already love. I am already, you know, forgiveness. I'm already,
I already have everything that I need, but Lord, I'm young in you. I've never known.
I've never accessed this before, or I've never accessed it in this way. I've never accessed it
to this degree of intensity. How do I do that, Lord? And so that's what we pray in these difficult
times where we're struggling. Ashley, I've got a meeting at 10, which is right now. So,
yeah, so I need to go, but this is so good. I would like to continue talking with you and,
you know, I want to learn more. Yeah, well, sure. Yeah, just feel free to reach out to me if you
decide to do another consultation call or you want to get access to more of those teachings,
and I can let you know how to do that. I would like to get access to more of the teachings.
Okay, yeah, just let me know. Look at them and just let me know which one, and I'll let you know
how to be able to sign up to pay to access them and all that good stuff. Okay, good to talk to
you, Christine. Yeah, it's been so good. Thank you so much, Ashley. You're welcome. Bye. Bye.