All right, welcome everybody to day four.
Everybody you have made it through three full days of training in IP.
And I've tried to make it simple, or at least simplified, because, you know, I don't like
hearing legal language, unfortunately, it gets really confusing to people.
So I try to make this as simple as possible.
While I know we're covering a lot of material, there's a lot more out there.
Today we're going to cover some overlap between trademarks and copyrights, and I'm going to
introduce patents.
And then tomorrow, we're going to bring it all together, like literally every single
aspect of this is going to come together.
So tomorrow, you're going to be able to identify what area of IP is associated with a specific
scenario.
I'm going to lay out a company, what the company is considering doing, different assets of
the company.
And you're going to look at this yourself, and you're going to say, this is that, this
is that, this is that.
And at the end of it, you'll all be copyright attorneys and trademark attorneys and patent
law attorneys.
It'll be amazing.
And so let me do, I'm going to hand this over to Ray, because Ray wants to play this video.
This is actually a pretty cool video compilation that she put together.
So thank you for putting this together.
And I'll just hand it over to you.
I'll turn off my, my camera.
Thank you very much.
Now that I have to go make a new disclaimer for us with Peter making claims to making
everybody law school graduates, give me just one moment here and we'll get this video shared.
It wouldn't be amazing if we...
It's not that difficult to say that.
Say that, we have a person from our lawyers that has legal prosecution.
That is amazing.
Hey Ray.
Yeah.
Can you restart it?
And you have to share the audio too.
Oh, I have the audio here shared.
It didn't ask me like it normally does.
So let me stop and go back in.
Yeah.
So it actually shares the audio as well.
Oh, it's not even letting me stop my share now.
Hold on.
Let me try again.
There we go.
And take two.
It wouldn't be amazing if we had an attorney here today.
That's won every award that you can think of.
That's been in the game for almost 25 years.
That has written and prosecuted hundreds of patents.
That is a master of understanding intellectual property and understands the future and is
all in on AI.
And not just as a practitioner of law, but an entrepreneur himself.
Wouldn't that be sick if I just went out and I got the best.
And instead of y'all paying him 600 bucks an hour, if you can even get access to him,
that I just brought him out here right now.
Roll the intro.
I just wanted to start right off the gate.
Really?
I didn't even know that.
Congratulations.
I did.
Well done.
Peter jumped on a call and totally fixed our entire landing page from a legal perspective.
I'm glad we dodged that bullet that we're not going to get in trouble for using any trademark
language or logos in our page.
But I'm glad we got to the bottom of this.
And I'm glad we got to the bottom of this.
language or logos in our page.
But highly recommend it if you get a chance to work with Peter.
You're definitely ripping him off by getting all these things taken care of.
My props to the generosity that Peter has given us, he's just so thorough, this guy is so proper with everything and I cannot be more blessed to have had him work on this with me.
I couldn't endorse it more strongly and Peter himself, he's just one of the best and by just getting that added engagement, you benefit through his tremendous experience, that's the intangible part of all this is the community, Peter's leadership.
Pete is one of the best IP lawyers in the whole country, just going through this challenge was an amazing, amazing experience for me as a business coach and in itself saved me I think over $1,000.
To your own defense, Pete is your guy and I highly recommend him and his services.
Thank you.
One thing I don't necessarily get from Peter which is why I'm the one who wanted to share that is that Peter does a lot for a lot of big groups and people, and he will never push himself as far as in front of you guys because that's just not quite his nature
but just to get an understanding more of who he is and why he does what he is doing.
The ultimate goal is to change the legal industry you guys don't get the opportunity to sit and ask lawyers without paying super hefty bills to do so.
And so the opportunity to just sit for tremendously lower cost to ask lawyers about all the information you don't really understand what's going on.
It's just a big opportunity, and it's one that's not out there but that's what he's creating he's making sure that that bridge gets gapped and the communication gets opened so we're just lucky.
So you guys understand my, my actual hope in doing this is not just obviously to help the public but also to give other lawyers, a framework of how they can reach out to the public, right, so that as this does well what happens is other lawyers see that and
it transforms the way that they practice as well.
Also, you mean that I can actually help the public in a large number and a large volume, you know, and not be accountable to a billable hour system like it just kind of shifts the way of thinking.
And so that's what we're finding is that there's a number of lawyers are actually starting to follow our format, which is really great universities to.
Yes, we actually received calls from.
What was the name of the, there were two different universities that reached out Ohio.
Ohio State states wants us to create a curriculum for them, which we're doing we're doing a series for them as well and then there's another one that just reached out as well.
And so we just have to buckle down and create the videos for them so that it will become required when I required but one of the options for obtaining credit in their colleges so it's really, it's really enjoyable.
With that, what I wanted to do today was start out by touching some of the patent law material and then tomorrow. What we're going to do is we're going to actually.
Ray, can you drop the link for the handout with the scenario.
Just so that they have it today so then tomorrow.
It's not like a last minute thing for them.
That I just came up with, and I put it all together for you so that tomorrow we're going to come back to that scenario and you'll be able to look and see exactly what area of IP pertains to every single part of that corporation, and the functioning of that corporation, and the attempt is that now you'll be able to practice as a business and as you're practicing as a business identify things.
And even for other people in your network if you're a coach or a trainer, you'll be able to do that for them as well. So, with that being the case I'm going to jump into patent law now.
And then we're going to cross over a little bit back.
I know we're going to touch back in the trademarks because a few people had questions actually let me check on something here for the people who are here.
How many people here would like to get a little more detail on the trademark searching, just by a show of hands so I know.
Right so 12345 all right there's a number of you. Okay.
All right, so what I'll do today is I'm gonna start
jumping into the patent law work.
Then what I'm gonna do is towards the end,
I'm gonna go back to trademark searching
and give you more detailed explanations of what you can do,
like how to cancel things out,
what different fields you can use
in the actual performance of a trademark search,
which is gonna decrease your costs, okay,
overall when you're running a company.
So let me jump in on patent law.
Mary asked the question of will we go over
how to do the application for trademarks?
So the actual preparation and filing of the application
for trademarks was done in VIP.
That was part of the package in VIP.
So the videos for that are in VIP as well.
So we actually went through a full,
every single step of the application,
every single part of an explanation.
But I'll touch base on different parts of an application
as we do a search to kind of help you guys out.
But the application itself is,
that's one of the features of VIP.
All right, so patents, what are patents?
Patents are a grant by a government
that allows you to stop others from making,
using, selling, and importing
what's covered by that patent, okay?
In the patent itself, there's a thing that's called claims.
It's all the way at the end.
It says, I claim, or we claim,
and then there's a number of different things.
What's listed in those claims is what you own
when you have a patent.
So if you're going for a bicycle,
and the claims say at least two wheels
rotatively connected to a center mass,
a front wheel having an elongated member
that connects to a handlebar for controlling the front wheel
for direction of the device, a braking system,
like all of those elements will be part
of what's called the claims, okay?
Where people get really confused is that they believe
that if you have a patent, you can make something,
and that's not the case.
Having a patent doesn't mean that you can make
what's covered by the patent.
Having a patent allows you to stop others.
So just get this really clear.
If you're building a company, and you create software,
and you have a software developer working on the software,
the functionality of the software,
the steps that are being performed are protectable under,
potentially protectable under patent law.
The code associated with the software
is protectable under, somebody type in the chat,
what is the code protectable under?
What body of law?
The code itself, copyright, exactly, all right?
So under copyright law, the code's protectable,
but under, and so here's the way it works,
is that the code protection is for the exact code
that's written, right?
If somebody uses different code
to cover the same functionality,
they don't infringe on the copyright.
This is why you would get a patent,
because a patent covers the functionality.
So I don't care what language,
I don't care what code you use
to actually cover the functionality,
you still infringe the patent.
That's why patents are one of the most powerful areas
of protection that exist
under the United States Patent and Trademark Office,
and in the government, and in and of itself.
Patent protection is very powerful,
but remember, it allows you to stop others.
I get to say, Ray, you can't make this thing,
I got a patent on it,
but I can't go and make it myself.
If I wanna make sure that I can make it,
I wanna do what's called a clearance search, okay?
It's called a clearance search,
C-L-E-A-R-A-N-C-E, clearance search.
That is, man, you type fast.
Yeah, that's exactly.
I have to to keep up with you.
That's really good.
That's exactly what you want to do
before you can make something.
If you don't do a clearance search,
if you own a patent, you can stop others,
but you might still run into a problem.
So I'm gonna give you a real life scenario.
You have two choices.
Everybody here has two choices,
and you have to pick one or the other.
Number one is one product,
number two is a second product, okay?
The first product is a stool.
The second product is a chair.
The stool has a base and three legs.
The chair has a base, four legs, and a back.
You can own the patent on the stool,
or you can own the patent on the chair.
If you wanna own the patent on the stool,
type the number one in the chat.
If you wanna own the.
patent on the chair, type the number two on the chat.
And your decision should be based on what you believe
you would make more money for as the patent owner.
Okay, so one or two.
And this is typically what happens,
you get a good variation of both.
Okay, so a lot of people type two,
and a few people type one.
Okay, so the answer is actually one.
And let me explain to you why.
A stool has a base and three legs, right?
So if the patent covers a base and three legs,
then when you make the chair,
which has a base, four legs and a back,
you actually infringe upon the patent for the stool.
Because the chair has at least a base and three legs,
since it has a base and four legs.
Do you see that?
So because of that,
you always wanna own the broader patent.
So if you own the patent for the stool,
you could stop people from making a stool,
from making chairs, from making love seats,
from making sofas, you could stop them from making benches.
All of those things could be covered
just because you own the patent on the stool.
Because it includes at least a base and three legs,
since it has a base and four legs and a back.
This, it's almost like reverse psychology.
Most people don't understand this.
So what they do is they try to get patents
that are very narrow, that cover this specific thing.
That's the worst thing you can do.
Because if you get a patent
that covers something very specific,
then all somebody has to do is make one slight modification
and they get around your patent, that's it.
So this is why patent protection is so powerful.
If you're a software developer, own the functionality.
If you own the functionality, nobody can write the code.
Because anybody that writes the code
that performs the same functionality infringes.
I don't care if you write it in C, C+, Fortran,
doesn't matter, you still infringe upon the patent
because it's covering the same functionality.
This is the power of a patent.
Now there's different types of patents.
There are what are called design patents.
And then there were called a system patents,
system and apparatus patents, okay?
There are things called plant patents.
So if you can asexually reproduce a plant,
then you can get a plant patent.
Somebody guess that one company
that has a ton of plant patents.
Just type it in the chat, anybody, but Ray.
That's it, Monsanto.
That's right, Pamela.
They have a ton of plant patents.
You know why?
Because they want to be able to create food,
create all sorts of things and stop others
from making the same thing that they've created.
So they asexually create these plants.
I've got my whole opinion on that, but I won't go into that.
So that's just a whole other conversation.
So design patents.
What design patents cover are an exact look of something.
So think of like the Coca-Cola bottle.
I don't have anything over here
that's kind of distinguished in its look,
but here's a glass of water, right?
So you see this like curve that goes inward here
and there's like a dimple there.
Like if I had a design patent on this,
it would cover the exact ornamental design look.
That's it.
It would not cover a vessel
that's capable of holding fluid.
That wouldn't be covered.
What would be covered is the look,
only the look, nothing but the look.
So that means if somebody creates something
with a slightly different look,
they don't infringe the patent as I drink water.
Okay, so that's really important to understand.
So if you've got some kind of really cool design
for a device, you can protect the look of the device,
such as the iPhone.
There are design patents on the iPhone.
Do you notice how the iPhone looks different
from like a Samsung?
The reason why, there was actually a lawsuit
for like hundreds of millions of dollars
associated with cell phones between the two parties.
And it ended up being, you know,
it ended up being worth like tens of millions.
It wasn't into hundreds of millions.
But the whole point being that the Samsung look of the phone,
which I have a Samsung, don't hate me.
I've got a Samsung.
The reason why I've got a Samsung
is because I love this feature here.
Like on the bottom here, it's got this pen.
Love that that's like my favorite so I can sign documents. I could do whatever I want. It's really cool
I can use it to take pictures from long distance. It's got a really good camera. I'm not trying to sell them
I'm just telling you so anyways this look though is very different from an iPhone
That's because I Apple owns the look you have an app you have an iPhone. Is that an iPhone Rose? No
Who's got an iPhone?
And I showed it
There you go, all right, so raise
Ray pick up yours. Do you see how hers is more Kurt has more of a curve around the sides?
You notice how this is square and look that's intentional
Apple owns that look that's why you won't find other phones that look like that or they'll sue the company
Just for looking like their phone
Very interesting. All right, so design patents can be really powerful, but just keep in mind that
Number one, they're less expensive
That's awesome. So you can actually own your look at like
2,500 bucks to follow a design patent even cheaper
Depending on if you do all the design work yourself like the if you have all the images done, so very inexpensive
Utility patents are much bigger like patents that cover an apparatus a system
It includes a utility patent includes a title
cross-reference to really related applications fill of the invention background the invention
Summary of the invention detail description brief description of drawings abstract claims and at least one drawing if required
All those parts are part of a utility patent that gets examined by the patent office that's a lot that's a big document
Okay
design patent
It's like two pages
That's it. It's so short. So you shouldn't be paying a lot of money for a design patent if you're having one done
Okay
now
You
Can use patents for multiple reasons you can use them to let's say you have a new technology
That you come up with you can follow a patent and then you can license it to another party so you can make money
You can use them as what's called an intangible asset
So if you have any patents within your company if you have any trademarks within your company if you have any copyrights within your company
when they do a valuation of your company for purposes of
Obtaining a loan for your company make sure you include your IP
Because that's going to increase the value of your company
Which is going to result in you be being able to get more money at a lower interest rate
You understand because you have a higher value of your company
So don't forget your IP like do an assessment of the value of your IP
Include that in the assessment of your company and now increase the value of your company which will get you more money at a lower
Interest rate. Okay, where are you trying to say something?
Yeah, you guys ever noticed if you've ever watched like shark tank
Whenever someone brings up that they own their intellectual property all of a sudden all the sharks perk up and then their offers start hammering
because it makes you more valuable having owning and securing your IP is
Huge for the successful they wear it like a trophy ring
It's true
It is really true
And that's that's one of the things that are used over people who are starting out is that most of the people who are starting?
out unlike yourselves now
Have no idea about IP and so the larger companies come in and just swallow them whole
Because they own the IP and they can just shut the other guys down because the other people don't know anything about it
So should you seek a patent or not? Like should I file for a patent? Should I not?
What kind of things should you look at number one if this thing's gonna be obsolete in three to five years don't file a patent
All right that look that's not legal advice this is not legal advice
But
I'm telling you it's a waste of time and money because it's gonna take you two to three years to get out of the
Patent office. So that means you have IP rights for like a year to two and that's it
Why in the world would you spend ten thousand dollars on a patent application that becomes
You know with a patent you get like a year and a half of life in the pot
Makes no sense. I I would not I wouldn't do that
Next thing if your idea cannot be reverse engineered meaning when I put this shaver out
There's a shaver, right?
When I put this shaver out on the market
People can open this thing and see all the parts of it and determine how to make it, right?
Because of that it is what's called reverse engineerable if what you have can be reverse engineered
you want to be able to protect that.
Because the second you sell it in the market,
other people are going to be able to make it.
So if what you have can be reverse engineered,
meaning when you sell it into the market,
somebody can create the same thing,
those are the kind of things you want to own a patent for.
If it can never be reverse engineered,
like nobody will ever be able to figure this thing out,
because as an example,
you've got a software company
and the functionality of the software
is on the backend on a server,
like that's where it's saved on the server,
nobody has access to it.
You don't even have to bother filing a patent
in those kinds of situations
because nobody's ever going to see the technology.
They're never going to reverse engineer it.
So then you can maintain it
as what's called a trade secret, okay?
A trade secret lasts forever.
It has the potential of lasting forever, no expiration.
A patent lasts for 20 years from filing.
So if it takes you three years
to get out of the patent office,
that means the life of the patent is 17 years.
It depends upon how long it takes you
to get out of the patent office,
that's how long you're going to have legal rights.
But it's always a maximum of 20 years from filing,
never more than that, okay?
So you need to make a determination yourself
regarding any technology that you come up with
or a method that you come up with
because methods can be protectable under patents as well.
So if you have a method and you're thinking,
well, there's nobody in the world
who's going to be able to reverse engineer this,
then don't file a patent.
Don't spend 10, $15,000 getting legal rights
is something that nobody's ever going to be able
to figure out, right?
Unless like you want to be able to say,
well, if somebody ever does come up with this,
I want to be able to stop them.
But if that's not the case, I wouldn't file a patent.
I'd save your money.
I'd practice the thing.
Nobody can reverse engineer it
and just take over the marketplace
because everybody needs you
because nobody can figure it out.
If that's not the case, then you go with a patent, all right?
But remember, a trade secret can potentially last forever.
That's a long time.
So I would much rather have something that can last forever.
Finally, the last part is if you're going to file a patent,
please do this thing.
And I'm sharing this with you because I care about you guys
in case you haven't figured it out by now.
I care about you guys.
I don't want you to get into situations
that you don't need to be in.
Ask about all the fees upfront.
What do I mean by this?
And just to be clear,
every time that you're working with an attorney,
what I try to do in this training
is give you a lot of practical stuff.
Every time you work with an attorney,
ask about all the fees.
You file a trademark application.
Well, something's going to happen after you file it.
It doesn't go away into this theoretical abyss
and then come out with, oh, it's a trademark.
That doesn't happen.
It goes into the United States Patent and Trademark Office.
It gets examined.
And after it gets, oh, Ray,
you're not going to write this down as a timestamp.
Oh my gosh.
So you actually get an examiner who looks at it.
The examiner does an examination.
They give you an office action or a rejection
or they allow it.
Then it goes through an opposition proceeding,
meaning it's published for 30 days.
If it goes through that time period and nothing happens,
then you get a registration.
So you're paying not only for the original application,
like as an example,
for those who don't fully graph the value of that package
that we put together for the IP audit,
this really speaks towards that
because you're getting the full application filing fee
plus the United States Patent and Trademark Office fee,
all covered all the way up to a first office action.
So that means 10 months worth of anything is all included.
So when you talk to an attorney,
I don't care who the attorney is
and I don't care if it's me or not.
If you're working with an attorney
and you're filing a trademark application,
ask them, what's the total cost?
What's the potential total cost?
Now, they may not be able to tell you the exact costs,
but they should be able to say to you,
well, you know what?
Filing an application costs X.
After the filing, we're going to get an office action.
You're going to get charged for the docketing,
the reporting, you'll get charged
for the reporting of the office action.
You also get charged for the publication.
That's going to cost this.
Once you get the office action, we'll.
see the number of rejections,
chances are it's gonna cost you
between 500 and $1,000 to respond.
Then once the case gets allowed,
it gets published for 30 days,
we're gonna have to docket that and report it to you.
And then finally, when it's issued as a certificate,
we'll have to docket and report the certificate
and mail it out to you.
Like, ask them those questions.
Most people don't even know that.
So, you know, if you're running your own company,
you need to understand all the fees,
and then time-wise, when do I get hit with what fee?
That's very important to understand.
Especially if you're like on the board of a company,
or you're working with other people,
and you make a suggestion,
hey guys, we should file a patent.
And they all go, that's great, what does it cost?
And you say, 10 grand.
They're like, we got a budget for that, no problem.
Well, that covered filing.
After you file, something's gonna happen.
So that means the United States Patent and Trademark Office
is gonna examine it, and if they reject it,
now you gotta file a response to the office action.
That can cost $3,500 to five grand
to respond to the office action, right?
But what if you didn't tell the people in your company?
You never said to them that, at all.
If you never said that, then your CFO,
the chief financing officer,
who approved the budget that you set
for the company of 10 grand,
is gonna come back to you and say,
why am I spending 50% more
when you said it was only 10 grand?
So now you understand,
anytime you work with an attorney,
ask them, beginning to end, what's the cost?
What's the timeline associated with it?
And they should be able to give you ballpark estimates.
Sometimes they can't tell you everything, obviously,
but it's good to ask them these questions.
Rae, you had your hand up.
Yeah, just a quick insight for you guys, too,
that may not have been super apparent,
but also it's just hard not to, I don't wanna say brag,
but let you guys know one of the perks
of our members get to benefit of,
and it's one of my favorites,
because I personally spent maybe over $1,200
on two very basic legal agreements.
But just because you're talking
about the cost of legal services, Peter,
some of our members get discounted rates
on even our legal agreements,
like an AI business policy for their employees
or anyone they hire, $495.
So just as an example,
some of these are also a perk
of continuing to work with Peter.
And it's not to hard sell you guys,
it's just that, hey, you should know
that you'd get to save down the line even further.
Yeah, well, I mean, in general,
when you're running a business,
there's a number of different agreements
that are important to you,
just so all of you know.
How many of you are starting a business right now,
just out of curiosity?
Okay, all right, so there's a number
of agreements you need, all right?
Number one, you need a non-disclosure agreement,
but in your non-disclosure agreement,
you need a non-compete clause, okay?
Yeah, some people are like, what's that?
All right, so let me explain to you what that means.
If I go, now I know Patty, she's a lovely individual,
she would never do anything deceitful, right?
But let's say I never met Patty,
and I sit down with her
and I've got a non-disclosure agreement,
because I'm gonna talk to her
about this new invention I have,
and it's called a watch.
Nobody's ever had a watch,
it tells time, it's incredible.
You no longer need sundials,
you don't have to stick the sand in the ground
and see what time it is based on the sun.
You could have this 24 hours a day,
it's incredible, right?
So I've come out of my hole in the ground
and I realized this is a great technology
and I wanna file a patent for it.
So I go to meet with Patty,
I have her sign a non-disclosure agreement.
What the non-disclosure agreement says essentially
is that she won't disclose the invention to others, right?
It's a non-disclosure agreement.
What I didn't agree to with her,
and what she didn't agree to,
is not to compete with me.
That's a very different thing, okay?
Patty can go back and go,
okay, I'm not gonna disclose,
and I don't even like saying this for Patty
because she's too nice.
So I'm just gonna say Sam,
there's nobody named Sam here.
Good, all right.
So Sam, I can't put you through this Patty,
like I was starting to feel bad just using your name.
So this person's Sam, right?
This guy's, I'm talking to Sam,
and since I have a non-compete clause,
what that means is that not only can Sam
not disclose it to Natalie, who's his friend,
but Sam can't even create something that competes with me.
I just locked him out of making a watch.
Do you see that?
So not only can Sam not talk about the watch,
with Natalie, but Sam can't even build a company
that makes watches.
That's the power of a non-compete clause
in a non-disclosure agreement.
Okay, that's powerful.
That's why any non-disclosure agreement you get,
make sure it has a non-compete clause in it,
if you can get it.
And if the other party signs that, that's powerful.
You just locked down a market, which is really nice.
So that's one thing that you need.
Another thing that most people need,
if you have a website,
how many people have a website or a funnel?
Okay.
And how many of you have people ordering things
from your website or your funnel?
Anybody?
Nobody.
All right, one.
Okay.
All right, so here's something for you to keep in mind.
They're going to be providing personal information
on those websites or funnels, right?
You want to have some kind of privacy policy.
You want to have a privacy policy in place.
All right, really important,
because the privacy policy is really going to break down,
you know, what can actually happen
with information that's provided.
And so that's very important.
Another thing you're going to want, it's funny.
This is the first time we've actually talked
about all this stuff.
We don't usually go into this,
but there's a lot of people that have a practical skill here.
Right, and sorry to segue us guys,
but when you're talking about legal fees,
like I paid a lot for something very basic
and I didn't even get to benefit from the experience,
the 25 years of experience that Peter had.
I didn't know Peter at the time.
And so I spent a lot of money for very little
and it was a little bit better than going off
of somewhere even more basic, like LegalZoom,
which I knew I wasn't being fully covered,
but so to have this experience.
We've actually had a lot of people,
I mean, this is just an aside separately at the law firm.
We've had a lot of people come into the law firm
because they went through LegalZoom at one point.
Now, just to be clear,
if you've got the most basic situation
and you don't care about the details of the legal stuff,
some of those basic contracts are fine.
Like, you know, if you just don't care about,
you just want to get something signed,
you don't care about a lot of limitations,
but I'm telling you about 70% of the time, it matters.
About 30% of the time, it doesn't matter
because you're never going to run into a legal issue anyway.
But 70% of the time, you want to be really, really careful.
All right, another thing you need, terms and conditions.
You need to have terms and conditions
associated with use of your website or your funnel.
This is where you tell them what they can do,
what they can't do through your content.
This is where you lay out with them
the fact that what you're providing to them
is not medical advice, is not legal advice,
is not business advice.
It's purely provided for information purposes
so that they can gain some level of additional knowledge,
but they should run everything by a professional
before they actually decide to implement anything
that they learned through your training.
If you look at my privacy policy
and you look at my terms and conditions,
that thing is a powerhouse.
The reason why is because I've taken
multiple different iterations,
incorporated different things.
I actually have an IP clause.
And this is what I would encourage you guys as well to do
is if you have any trademarks, any copyrights,
any patents, any trade secrets,
I would have an IP clause in your policies
that specifically says, blah, blah, and blah
are trademarks of XYZ Corporation.
Any use is strictly prohibitive on their blah, blah, blah.
Like I would lay it out, let them know,
hey, look, this trademark, it's mine.
You can't use it.
Like make it very clear.
You should have that in your terms and conditions.
Make it very clear what they can and can't do
when they're using your website or your funnel.
If you don't do that, people will just do anything
because they don't know any better.
I mean, honestly, how many of you actually understood even,
I'd say even half of the stuff that we've talked about
over the last few days?
So we got like rows, you know,
because that, and were you like a paralegal?
So there you have it, right?
Most people aren't aware of these things.
So we can't blame them for not knowing.
So we have to make them aware.
This is why I'm going to show you,
going back to the trademark side for a second here.
This is why when you use trademarks,
you got to make it very clear that you own the trademark.
You can't just um, let me share my screen. You can't just expect people to know
So right at the top over here
it says
The five-day protect your idea challenge tm
So it lets people know. Hey, that's my trademark
Right now technically if I wanted to be really analytical because I am an adjunct professor of law as well
If somebody did this on an exam, I would say it's wrong
The reason why is because it says the five day
Then it says protect your idea challenge
If if I really want to protect the trademark really well
I would have protect your idea challenge all the same font
So there's no question as to the fact that that is the trademark itself
right
But you'll notice when you look through my website
I try to make it clear that
What we're protecting is the embodiments of your idea
Like here protecting for your creative works
Right. I try not to use language here register and share the protect your idea challenge tm
You see how i'm using it's consistent
Over and over i'm saying that because I don't want people to
Start using my name
uh, and even
I'm, not going to tell you which guide is but there's you know, there's billie gene who knows me pedro knows me grant knows me
You know mit knows me, but the whole point being that
one of these four
groups
actually licensed for um members within their community to use their own trademarks
right
But they didn't regulate how the trademarks are being used
So the other people are actually using the trademarks without a tm without a circle r they're using it in a different manner
If you have a license if you have a trademark and you're allowing a third party like I like natalie
She's wonderful. I say natalie you can use uh, protect your idea challenge natalie goes out there and she uses that thing
But she doesn't use a tm. She doesn't use a c a circle r
She doesn't uh, she actually uses it in a descriptive manner
That actually damages my trademark
Because I licensed it to her if she's not using it properly I take the damage not her
So the strength of my trademark decreases because i'm not regulating the use of my assets
Do you get that?
If you have a car and you let your next door neighbor use it
You're watching to see what your next door neighbor does. You don't just say yeah sure use it whenever you want to return it
Go ahead. Otherwise, you know, i'm never going to ask you any questions. No you asked them like how long do you need it?
I need it this weekend. Can I get it back before then?
Hey fill it with gas, right? Don't spill coffee on the on the leather
Whatever case may be like you're watching things. It's the same way with your intangible assets. You got to do the exact same thing
Okay, so those are the main I say those are the main agreements that you're going to need
Non-disclosure non-compete privacy policy terms and conditions
Are like the biggest
The biggest one the other thing you need is some kind of assignment
An assignment of all right title and interest for ip over to your company
And you can use that with any va any third party
Right because it all you do is fill in the blank on what exactly is is it that you're transferring the rights to?
Right, you just kind of modify it. But here's the beauty of it is that if you get those agreements
And they're done properly
You shouldn't be paying
For the same agreement over and over for the next party that you work with
They should just be modifying the agreement that they already created for you once
Do you get that people forget this?
People forget this
They say, you know, i've got a non-disclosure agreement for meeting with xyz corporation
In two weeks i'm meeting with one two three company. They call up the lawyer and they say hey
I need a non-disclosure agreement for one two three company
What you should be doing is say hey, you just wrote a non-disclosure agreement for me for an xyz company
Can you modify that for one two three company?
That cost should be a fraction of what you paid the first time
If you're paying the same thing every single time something's wrong
Because I guarantee you they didn't rewrite the whole thing
If they did they don't know how to use
You know microsoft word to pull up a document and just modify it
You shouldn't be rewriting a legal document every time. This is how you decrease your legal costs, okay?
All right. Let me talk about i'm going to talk about one more thing in the patent area
I don't want to
use people in patents because it's very,
it can be very confusing.
So actually I'll talk about two more things.
In the patent world, if you ever want to enforce your rights
you have to have placed the public on notice
or an individual on notice of your patent.
That means writing something like patent number
and then the number or PAT dot with the number
or patent NO dot with the number.
Like you have to give the patent number
to place the public on notice.
If you don't, your damages don't start.
This is why when somebody sued my client
a number of years ago
and they never marked anything with their patent number,
I said, well, let's just assume that my client's guilty.
What do we owe you?
And they said, oh, you owe like tens of thousands,
tens of millions of dollars.
I said, no, you've never marked anything
with your patent number.
And the attorney said, yes, we did.
I said, prove it to me.
He couldn't find a single place that they actually marked
any of their products ever.
So he came back to me and said,
well, unfortunately you're right.
So damages would start at the time
that we filed the lawsuit against you.
I said, well, I can write you a check for that.
That's like, you know, thousand bucks
because I think they sold like one unit since then
because they stopped selling
the second you filed the lawsuit.
So you can take your thousand bucks
and subtract that from the 150,000
you spent in patent litigation fees.
I'm sure your client will be really happy about that.
And they dropped the lawsuit.
So just remember that you need to mark,
you have to mark things.
If you don't mark, you can't enforce,
you can't get damages for your legal rights.
And so I'm gonna show you one more thing.
Let me show you one more thing when it comes to patent law.
I'm gonna tell you about what's called the statutory bars
just so nobody gets in trouble on this.
I think it's safe to tell you this.
So let me see.
I'm gonna give you guys this too.
All right.
Let's say somebody is infringing.
I'm gonna show you something.
I just put something in a chat.
Oh, will it show you?
Let me see.
What happened?
That's weird.
Paste.
It turned it into, you can actually click on it.
It opens up a very horizontal snippet, yeah.
Well, what I had there was language that can be used
for sending a notification over to another party.
Maybe I can copy it another way.
Let me see if I can do this for you guys.
Microsoft Word.
Yeah, I'll put it into Microsoft Word
and then I'll copy and paste it for you.
So if somebody is actually infringing
upon your trademark or, is somebody speaking?
Yeah, Jake, if someone clicks on it and downloads it,
there's a little download area, they can read it.
Oh, okay.
Got it.
That's what I did.
Thanks, buddy.
Yeah, I don't know why.
Let me see if I can just paste this anyway.
Paste, there we go.
Text, there we go.
I pasted it as text.
See if this works.
See if this looks better.
Hopefully it looks better.
Paste.
That come out?
Nope, still doesn't work.
So I guess you have to download it.
That's weird.
So you can't copy and paste things into the chat.
That's kind of weird.
If it's verbose.
Anyways, so what I did was I copied and pasted.
If somebody is committing infringement on something,
the language that I copy and pasted
is the more safe language that can be used.
Always consult with a lawyer.
Like always reach out to another lawyer.
That's not legal advice.
It's just what I have found over many years
to be safe language.
It's basically saying to the other party,
hey, look, I've become aware of what you're doing.
So it says our corporation owns all rights,
title and interest to blah, blah, blah.
A copy of that is attached.
A copy, and then it says we've recently become aware
of numerous technologies associated with your corporation.
Example is blah, blah, blah.
You may be interested in obtaining a license
to make you sell or import the technology
protected by our patent.
That's it.
It's not coming out and saying you infringe,
stop now or I'm gonna sue you.
Like.
When you do that, you're threatening a lawsuit.
When you threaten a lawsuit against a third party,
they can file what's called
a declaratory judgment action against you.
That means they can pull you into court.
You do not wanna get pulled into court, trust me.
So if you're gonna go the litigation route,
then speak to a lawyer and figure out
how to do litigation the right way, right?
But what you don't wanna do is send a nasty gram
to somebody and get pulled into litigation
because you worded the language the wrong way.
If you come out and say,
hey, you're committing infringement,
I'm going to sue you unless you stop in the next 10 days,
they can file a DJ action against you
and pull you into federal district court and sue you.
And what they're doing is they're asking the court
to render a decision saying that they do not infringe
because there's an imminent threat of being sued.
All right, so that's basically a long way
of saying be careful about sending nasty grams
out to others.
Don't just do it on your own,
talk to a lawyer so you don't get in trouble.
You do it the wrong way, it's really painful.
Rose, thank you for doing that, I appreciate that.
Oh, it came out one at a times, I see.
That's weird, anyways.
All right, so let me touch base a little bit
on provisional patents and then,
all right, if you've got a new technology,
so it's either a system, a method, an apparatus.
The government said, well, to get a utility patent
is pretty expensive.
Not everybody can afford a utility patent.
So what we're going to allow you to do
is what's called a provisional patent.
A provisional patent does not get examined
by the United States Patent and Trademark Office,
it just maintains the filing date, that's it.
But it requires at least a title and a description.
So that one of ordinary skill in the art
could practice the invention.
So somebody needs to be able to pick up that thing
and practice the invention, all right?
But it does not require claims, abstract,
background on the invention, summary of the invention,
brief description or a drawing,
like none of that's required.
So it essentially costs much less than a utility patent.
But within one year of filing the provisional,
you need to file the utility patent.
So it's not a way of getting around
spending the money on the utility,
it's just a way of delaying that.
So what you might want to do is file a provisional patent,
test the market, and if people tend to like your technology,
then you can proceed with a utility patent.
Because you spent less money
kind of putting your stake in the ground,
it costs you less money to be able to do that.
And so for that reason, provisionals are pretty handy.
So all I want you to remember is the word provisional.
So then this way, when you reach out to a patent attorney
with a new technology or a system,
you can say, hey, what's this thing called provisionals?
And they can explain it in more detail to you,
which should save you time and money, all right?
But it only buys you one year delay.
In that time, you can test the market,
you can seek financial backing
before you bring that product to market.
Okay, that's what a provisional is about.
It's provisional, it's like it's before the utility.
The utility is the one that gets examined
by the patent office, not the provisional.
Within one year, you have to file a utility.
And if you're interested in legal rights
in foreign countries, within one year of filing anything
in a first country, you need to do foreign filing.
If you don't do it within that year,
you can potentially lose the right
to obtain legal rights in foreign countries.
All right, I'm keeping this very broad
and simple to understand for you guys.
And then finally, there are three statutory bars
in the patent world, three statutory bars.
Number one is the public use bar.
Number two is the publication bar.
And number three is the offer for sale bar.
Okay, I'll briefly explain each one of them to you.
Public use, publication, offer for sale bar.
Okay, let's take the offer for sale bar first.
If you offer your invention for sale to another party
and it's substantially complete,
meaning that there's AutoCAD drawings
or there's a flow chart that describes the process.
If that's the case, so it's like an actual
commercial offer for sale
and the invention is substantially complete,
the clock starts.
You have one year from that day to file a patent.
in the United States. If you don't, it's considered donated to the public.
If one year and one day goes by since I offered Mary my invention,
my invention just became donated to the public.
And if I obtain a patent, somebody can invalidate my patent because I committed fraud on the patent
office since more than one year passed since I offered it for sale. I violated the offer for
sale bar. That's the first bar. The way each of these bars work is that if you perform the action
that I'm going to explain to you and one year passes, your invention is donated to the public.
So number one was the offer for sale bar. Number two is the publication bar.
So let's say you have a website and you're really excited, like Khalia's really excited
about her new invention. And she's like, check this out world. Here it is. Here's my invention.
These are all the parts to it. I'm starting to sell. This is awesome. That is considered a
publication because it's, it's a description of the invention so that one of ordinary skill in
the art can practice it. And more than one year passed and it's readily available to the public
on a website. The place where people freak out is if they have a publication.
So imagine that you're a graduate student and you're going for your PhD.
What's the document that you create when you go for your PhD?
Somebody typed that in the chat.
Thesis, Pamela nailed it again. Thesis, right?
What the universities do with your thesis is that they make it available in the library.
I was doing a teaching at Dartmouth in their medical device department for a Keith Poulsen,
who's the head of the medical device department at Dartmouth. And I was teaching at Dartmouth
department at Dartmouth. I was speaking to all graduate students. There are about 30 of them in
there, maybe about 30 of them in there. Speaking to them about all these different things. I get
to this point, publication. I explained to them that if your invention is described in a document,
it's readily available to a third party. The day that it actually gets described,
you lose the potential for foreign rights. But in the United States, you have one full
year to file a patent. If you don't do that, it's considered donated to the public.
People got up and left. They literally got up and left the room fast, fast.
Because they had just a few weeks prior submitted their thesis to the school.
And so the school, the second they approve your thesis, it gets published.
So they immediately were calling the school saying, don't publish my thesis
because my thesis is actually the basis for my corporation that I'm building when I graduate.
And Keith was like, where are you guys going? And I knew exactly what was going on. I was like,
Keith, let them go. He's like, that was really rude. I said, no, it wasn't rude. They realized
their livelihood was on the line the second that they learned that. So they took off.
They told the registrar office, don't publish anything until we tell you that we can publish
it. And they all filed provisional patent applications within a week.
So this is why it's so important. And finally, the public use bar
says that if a third party is using the invention for its intended purpose,
even one member of the public is using the invention for its intended purpose,
and one year passes, the invention is donated to the public. It's gone. Nothing you can do about
it. So make sure that you're not offering it for sale. You're not giving it to your neighbor to
play around with. And there's no publication on this. Now, there's an exception to the public
use bar. It's called experimental use. So let's say Rose is my next door neighbor. I'm blessed
to have her as my next door neighbor. And I create a new bike and I give it to Rose and I say, hey,
Rose, ride this around. Tell me what you think about it. I'm not she's not buying it from me.
I'm just like giving it to her to test it out. And she's giving me feedback. She's like, you know,
Peter, it's kind of hard to pedal on this thing. You know, the seat isn't comfortable. The handlebars
are really loose, blah, blah, blah. She's giving me feedback. That's like getting test material.
That's getting feedback on it. It's not a sale. It's called experimental use.
It's for a limited time. Like.
I'll even tell her, give me the bike back after 30 days.
I just want feedback from you.
So that is called experimental use.
It's for a limited time, for a limited purpose,
no financial gain.
I'm just gaining data to allow me to modify things.
That's called experimental use, okay?
That's all I'm gonna cover on the patent area
because there's not a lot of people
that are dealing with patent issues.
In VIP today, I'm gonna show you guys
how to do a patent search,
like using the United States Patent and Trademark Office.
I'll show you guys how to do that.
But what I will for everybody right now do
is show you the site.
We actually explored the site together before.
All right, so I'll just show you the site quickly here.
Share, share, share, share, share.
I don't care.
Here we go.
Okay, here we go.
So right here under patents, you'll see search for patents.
You can click on that.
And it tells you, there's all this information,
how to conduct a search.
Here's the patent public search here.
And then you just click on basic search or advanced.
You could probably do basic.
And then once you're in here,
you can just type in a certain thing.
So let's say you wanna look for,
oh, I gotta move this bar out of the way.
There we go.
Let's say you wanna look for like a certain title.
So you just say, let's say bicycle.
Bicycle, right?
And if I did a search for that,
all these patents that have anything to do with bicycles
pop up.
Okay, now here's the problem though.
Look at this, it's got 2,930 that popped up.
Here's the problem,
is that somebody might not use the word bicycle.
They might use like apparatus having two wheels.
So this is why this patent searching using keywords
is kind of dangerous.
I mean, it's good for you to get ideas.
Like if you're doing like VLSI,
let's say VLSI design, VLSI that search.
So there's a bunch of VLSI design.
There's actually 2,752 things on that.
So then I can say, and,
and let's say a microchip.
Do a search.
Now there are 64 patents.
So the patents here should have to do a VLSI design
and microchips.
And so now I can look those things up.
Or separately, I can look up a specific company.
Assignee is the party who the patent was assigned to.
The assignor is the one who's assigning the patent.
So I can come in here and go like Samsung
and then a microchip
and search.
And now I've got, there's eight patents.
Eight patents?
There's no way.
Oh, it's page one of eight.
Look at that, man.
That's a lot of patents.
So Samsung has a ridiculous number of patents
where microchips are part of the patents.
Okay, so this is how you can use that tool really simply.
All right.
All right, that's, I'm going to stop there.
I won't go deeper into the patent world.
Tomorrow we're going to bring all this stuff together.
So tomorrow what we'll do is we'll look at the scenario.
I'll train you a little more on the combination
of trademarks, copyrights, and patents
in real life scenarios.
And then I might do one other special thing for you guys.
What I'm going to do also is,
how many of you would like to learn how to search for logos?
Okay, a bunch of you.
All right, I'm going to add a bonus for you guys.
This will be on Saturday.
It'll be a half hour, okay?
I'm going to add this to you guys at no cost, all right?
Look at Jacob.
Jacob, that was awesome, man.
I love that celebration.
That was awesome.
So on Saturday at noon,
well, noon is actually nine o'clock a.m. for California.
Hopefully that's okay for you guys.
But-
It's 7 a.m. in Hawaii.
Oh my gosh, yeah.
You Hawaii people.
I can't feel bad for you people in Hawaii, honestly.
There's no part of me that feels bad for you guys.
Like every day you wake up in Paraguay.
paradise. Oh, I feel so bad. I just can't. I mean, I try I try
to I try to cry but it doesn't work. I don't know. So um, yeah,
12. Well, you don't have to be there for that. It's just going
to be a private session with everybody. So Saturday at 12
o'clock, I'm going to do live trademark searching for logos.
It's very unique. It's not like searching for other things. It's
very unique. Okay, so you're not going to want to want to miss
that. Please remember for all of you that are interested in the
offer, the offer closes Friday at midnight. Okay, so make sure
that you close before then. Because what we're going to be
doing is scheduling the audits for people, getting them the
information that they need, getting them into the intake
process. There's a number of things we do as a law firm to
make sure you guys are really comfortable. Yeah, right.
For those of you who think that you're not ready yet to be
audited, that's okay, too. You have a whole year before you
need to have your audit with Peter. So you I know there's
some you they're like, I'm not quite ready yet. And we've had
many like that. I probably say 85% of our members who already
had businesses in motion or creative works in motion, they
ended up going through our audit and, and unfortunately, we're
using brands, a brand name or assets that they did not have
the right to use somebody else owned it and they were
vulnerable to infringement claims and damages. So our
members who came with a kind of a blank slate, or they're very
new, they actually got a whole strategic plan on how to launch
the right way with Peter. And so it was really beneficial. So
they thought they were too early or premature to get
started in an audit, but really, they got the best leveraging
point they could have. And so it benefited them tremendously to
start that way. And then the ones that came that were
infringing, we got them on a better track. Like yesterday,
she got a good way to just kind of explain that. So during the
audit, just so all of you are aware, we will uncover things
like we'll find things that are dangerous to your company, ways
to modify things within your company. Even if you don't have
a company like ways to increase your own value to yourself and
to your company, so your income will increase. If you're doing
online training courses. We go through how to make those
protectable software packages that are dangerous to use things
that are good to use. We walk through a lot like we we go
through a tremendous amount. And if there's anything that I'm
not sure about, I'll let you know. And then I'll get you the
answer. I think that's probably only happened twice.
Yeah, we've had members who came in with an idea or they knew
what they wanted to do, but they were still budding and gestating.
And then they ended up walking out with an entire business
plan. Like it's not that that was a part of it, it just ended
up happening. I mean, they just came out with like, Oh my gosh,
now I have a viable business that I can make a profit with
because of that strategy session. It was pretty fun.
Yeah, it does work out really well. So but then on Saturday at
12 o'clock, we will do the logo search together. And I'll answer
questions during the logo searching as well. Let's see.
I can't get over Jacob's excitement. His happy dances
over there.
Funny. This is so funny. Let me see. Okay, I'm looking to see if
there's anything else I need to cover for today. Okay, so let me
touch base on this right here real fast. Okay. Alright, so
we're coming to the holiday season. So a lot of people are
doing what they're doing is they're taking images that
they're finding and putting them on t shirts. I touched base on
this really quickly. All right. Well, what about phrases? What
about like, you know, we know you can't do it with logos.
That's copyright infringement. What about like phrases? Okay.
This gets it's gets kind of interesting. phrases in general.
Um, the question is whether or not the phrase can be
copyrighted in and of itself, there needs to be some level of
of the copyrightable material being genuine, meaning like new,
genuine, creative, right needs to be an author needs to be a
level of creativity, and it needs to be fixed. So if you're, if
you've got like
some kind of, let's say there's a book,
and you grab one line of the book,
and you want to throw that on a t-shirt.
If it's argued that that line of the book
is considered part of the essence of the copyright,
you can run into problems for copyright infringement.
This is why there are so many lawsuits
that have been filed by larger companies
against individuals.
And eBay has blacklisted people,
Amazon's blacklisted people.
Alibaba doesn't care.
I mean, just being honest, Alibaba just wants money.
They don't care.
They're like, you know,
sometimes it's hard to get your own stuff pulled down
when you have a patent number or a trademark
or a copyright on Alibaba.
They just want the money.
So it's a little harder to work with them.
So if you're gonna, I was about to say,
if you're gonna infringe, you should use this platform,
but I'm not gonna say that.
I'm not encouraging anybody to do anything wrong.
Don't do that.
It's amazing.
With all the knowledge I have,
I know how somebody can be corrupt
and become a millionaire pretty fast.
And I'm not gonna say how you can do that.
Exactly.
Jacob's like, no, no, no, no.
So, but the point is that IP can be a very lucrative area
for good reasons and for bad reasons.
So in any case, grabbing somebody else's content
and putting it on a t-shirt, you can't do that.
Putting it on a mug, you can't do that.
Can't put the logos on a mug.
Can't put them on t-shirts, canteens,
backpacks, nothing, right?
You need to come out with something creative.
And if you're having trouble coming up
with something that's original,
this is what gets really interesting.
If you use chat GPT to come up with a phrase,
under copyright law, you can't own what's created,
but you may not care.
This is where it gets interesting.
And I think I'll close on this,
cause we're way over, man.
We're way over, sorry.
At 8.30, we'll start VIP.
So this is where we'll close.
Yeah, I know.
I didn't know I was gonna get this new spring of life
to talk about something, but we're coming on the holidays.
So, if you're trying to come up with an idea
for a phrase, a line, or something like that,
you might use something like chat GPT,
come up with a phrase or a line.
You can't own it under copyright law,
but you may be able to create the thing itself
and sell the thing and just compete in the market.
Not everybody cares about IP, right?
Like not everybody cares about being able
to own it outright.
Just understand that if you now make it for $12,
somebody in Vietnam is gonna make it for $8,
or somebody in the Philippines is gonna make it for $7.
And now you're just competing in the market,
while if you had a copyright, you can just tell Amazon,
hey, they're copying my design.
Here's my registration number, pull it.
And they'll pull everything that that company sells
with that same logo or that same design.
So just keep that in mind.
So chat GPT is fun, mid-journey is fun to use,
come out with stuff, but you can't own those things.
The only thing that I would caution you of
is try to make sure you're not infringing
upon something that they scraped,
meaning somebody else's legal right to a real painting
or a real drawing or something like that.
Just be careful.
I don't want you guys getting in trouble.
I really don't, because this is what I do for a living.
And just so you guys understand,
I'll close with this in the next 30 seconds,
is that the second you call a lawyer,
the clock starts ticking.
That's how lawyers make money.
They bill per hour, they don't sell products.
They sell time.
And there's only so much time in a day.
So if they're working for 12 hours,
they're trying to bill 12 hours, right?
So like Rose, let's say Rose has a manufacturing company.
She could sell 2000 units in five minutes.
Lawyer can't do that.
They can sell five minutes in five minutes, okay?
That's why the second that you talk to them
about something legal, the clock starts ticking, right?
So for that reason, you don't wanna be in legal trouble
because I've got a friend of mine who called me yesterday.
They got a trademark opposition filed against them.
And so he says, hey, I'm in your protection portal.
Can I ask you a question?
I said, yeah, sure.
What's the question?
And I answered it for him.
And he says, I wanna hire you
to handle the trademark opposition.
I said, yeah, all right, no problem.
I'm happy to help you out.
And so now I'm looking at his materials
to try to get him out of it, even though he can win.
And so this is something to keep in mind.
Even though you might be able to win in a legal battle,
you might lose, all right?
Enforcing your
legal right does and winning in a court of law does not mean that you always win. Because if
you spend $150,000 to win over something that costs $20,000, you lost $130,000. So just be
smart about your situation. So alright, I'm going to stop there. That's enough. We went over. That's
okay. You guys are awesome. You guys are worth it. If you have any questions on the offer,
please let me know because I don't want people getting stranded at the end and then trying to
figure out what to do. So please let me know. Even if you're trying to figure out payment or whatever,
let me know. We're trying to do this for you guys. So you guys are successful when your
companies flourish. It's really important to us. So with that, I'm closing